💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

BobB31 (Florida)
Posts: 178
Posted:
I have a question about this since our board will be having its first meeting of the year in a couple weeks and we are required by statute FS 720.303(2)(e) to consider whether a notice of preservation needs to be filed. I am unclear about what the effect of filing such a notice would be. Some possibilities that occur to me include:
a. The covenants are preserved for an extra 30 yrs beyond the current deadline for temination. E.G., if they will terminate in 2047 they get another 30 yrs and will terminate in 2077 unless a new notice of preservation is filed sometime between 2047 and 2077.
b. The covenants are preserved for a period of 30 yrs from the date of filing the notice of preservation.That would mean that if the notice is filed this year, another notice would need to be filed by 2050. This would make it advantageous to wait till the last minute to file.
c. The covenants are preserved forever, making it necessary to only file this notice once.
d. something else

Does anyone know?

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
First, MRTA is senior to whatever your CCRs say ... ie, it is irrelevant to MRTA if your CCRs note they expire in xx years, or are auto renewed. MRTA will extinguish all of them at root of deed plus 30 years.

I am assuming your neighborhood is either less than 30 years old, or has previously preserved per FS 720 and FS 712.

Yes - if you preserve in 2020, add 30 yrs - unless there is updated law in Florida, another preservation would be required prior to 2050.

It is to advantageous to wait - in my opinion - for close to the 30 year point. Get it done early, when the Board is operating effectively!
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Shoot - cant edit.

IMO, it is NOT advantageous to wait.
BobB31 (Florida)
Posts: 178
Posted:
Our covenants were revived in 2017 so 2047 is the termination date.

Could you clarify why it is not advantageous to wait? If there are 27 yrs to go before termination, why file notice now and only get an extra 3 yrs?
Why not wait until the year before termination and then get an extra 29 yrs?
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
OK, the additional info is instructive.

If revived in 2017, I would consider 2042 a good point to begin the process to preserve.

I’ll bet FS will change by then to eliminate most of the damage caused by MRTA.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
I've heard that, too. The legislature is considering carving out an exception for HOAs so that HOA CC&Rs will never expire due to MRTA. The concern I have is that I've been hearing this for 5 years now and the legislature has done nothing.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Hope so ... the effect of MRTA on some communities has been devastating.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Working as planned. I would say that HOAs who let MRTA extinguish their covenants get what they deserve, but that's on their boards of directors, not the homeowners, because boards are supposed to be aware of these things.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GenoS on 01/30/2020 7:56 PM
Working as planned. I would say that HOAs who let MRTA extinguish their covenants get what they deserve, but that's on their boards of directors, not the homeowners, because boards are supposed to be aware of these things.

I would think that this would be on all members.

I expect with the amount of press that the issue received when MRTA started, everyone was aware.
An aware member should have asked.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Geno,

That is a terrible thing to say.

Pretty horrible in that it destroyed hundreds, perhaps thousands of communities.
BobB31 (Florida)
Posts: 178
Posted:
Thanks for the information. It was really helpful.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GeorgeS21 on 01/31/2020 6:19 AM
Geno,

That is a terrible thing to say.

Pretty horrible in that it destroyed hundreds, perhaps thousands of communities.

Well, it's true and if the shoe fits....
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
It is neither true, nor is there any shoe involved.

The lives of tens of thousands of people were financially affected, many in a major way, by a accidental and unintentional connection to a Florida law never intended to affect HOAs ... and, you think it’s something they deserved?

Really?
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GeorgeS21 on 02/01/2020 8:15 PM
It is neither true, nor is there any shoe involved.

The lives of tens of thousands of people were financially affected, many in a major way, by a accidental and unintentional connection to a Florida law never intended to affect HOAs ... and, you think it’s something they deserved?

Really?

There is no evidence that MRTA was "never intended to affect HOAs".

The verbiage of "if the shoe fits" wasn't a great choice of words, I'll grant you that. But Boards of Directors are supposed to be familiar with the statutes affecting their communities. If the homeowners get bitten by MRTA then there's no one to blame but their Board members. That's their job. Accidental and unintentional results are a sad fact of life and if people are asleep at the switch then bad things happen. Ignorance of MRTA is no excuse.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
MRTA had zip connection to HOAs ... someone saw an angle to break their HOA and used it to do so.

You’re on the wrong side this time, Geno.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GeorgeS21 on 02/01/2020 8:39 PM
MRTA had zip connection to HOAs ... someone saw an angle to break their HOA and used it to do so.

You’re on the wrong side this time, Geno.

From what I have read and seen out here, George is correct. MRTA was not meant for HOA's but someone find a way to apply it.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
It was not meant for HOAs because the MRTA statute is from 1963 and laws regarding HOAs didn't come until a decade later. MRTA, aka FS 712, was designed to extinguish old stale covenants on property dating back to the time of the Spanish. It's like the ultimate statute of limitations.

The correct question is were the HOA statutes in their various forms and incarnations enacted with MRTA in mind. The legislature could have carved out a MRTA exception for HOAs from the very start. They chose not to.

They birthed the HOA statutes knowing full well that MRTA would work to extinguish HOA covenants after 30 years unless those covenants were preserved before the clock ran out. FS 712.05 provides a way to do that. Absent that preservation, deed restrictions will usually expire. For HOAs whose covenants expire due to MRTA, I would only say, "You could have stopped this. There was a way spelled out in the MRTA statute. Ignorance of the law is no excuse."

It's easier to blame the law than it is to accept responsibility for ignorance and nonfeasance.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Geno

Maybe because of some past "vocal" posters ranting about MRTA on here that we on here have a slanted view that it has caused havoc on quite a few associations.

Does a BOD need owners agreement to extend or can the BOD alone do it.
GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808
Posted:
Sure ... all the oldsters and other volunteers could have simply read all the info on the internet ...

Geno - you are way off base on this.

John - to your question. The Board can preserve.
JamesG22 (Florida)
Posts: 1
Posted:
New to HOATalk.

I'm the newly elected president of a 33 unit HOA. The only common area is our dry retention area. Our documents are due to be preserved in 2027 to comply with MRTA. Former HOA president said don't amend Deed of Restrictions until we submit our documents for MRTA. MRTA seems to be simply a refiling of our documents. Questions are:

1) If we amend deed of restrictions now, will the MRTA process preserve the amendments?
2) If we revise wording of our deed of restrictions now, can we submit the revised document for MRTA in 2027?
3) Articles of Inc for HOA are dated in Jan 1997 all other docs are July 1997. Do we use Jan or July for MRTA?

Jim

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

  • ✓ Ask follow-up questions
  • ✓ Share your experience
  • ✓ Get expert advice
  • ✓ Access 350,000 discussions
Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here