Using email for warnings or fines.

Started by JohnT38 • 11 replies • 521 views

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JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

We have two homeowners that don't live there. In one case, the condo is occupied by a renter. In the other case, the condo is occupied by the owner's 17 year old son. The renter and the kid have both repeatedly violated some clearly documented rules. The property manager was told to send a warning to both residents. He did this via email and when I asked why he said that he doesn't have the address where either of these owner's live. Our docs don't mention what delivery method must be used for warnings and fines and I'm concerned that an email might not hold water if either resident pushes back on us and fights any future fines that might occur. When I told the property manager this he said that he believed an email would pass scrutiny by the courts. Does anyone have any advice on this? I'm in South Carolina. I was thinking that at a bare minimum something should be sent to the address on record and the owner's should be requested via email to provide their current mailing address.

BillH10 (Texas)
Posts: 1,217

Posted:

John, I agree with you.

I cannot cite you chapter and verse regarding court rulings on this point. I can offer a couple of suggestions.

1. What is the age of your documents? We have a client whose documents were filed in 1981. There are several references to "notices" being " . . . given to board members or owners by mail or telegraph, N days prior to the day named for such meeting". (Yes, telegraph!) In any case, in 1981 " by "mail" meant one thing only as email was not yet in wide spread use if it was in use at all. Absent any modification to that language, everything in that Association must be sent by US Mail.

2. A few years ago, in Texas, we were required to ask HOA owners if they wished to "opt-in" to receive official association communications via e-mail. I'm not certain if that applied to condominiums as well. If the owner chose not to opt-in, we had to continue to use the United States Postal Service. Even so, our company chose to continue to send Annual Meeting, Regular Assessment, and Compliance notices by regular mail as well as by email. Is there any such requirement in your state?

As for an address, the documents of every association we manage require the owner to notify the association of the current mailing address. Further, if there is ever a question, we can access the records of the county tax assessor for the address they have on file.

Good luck.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

JohnT

The BOD must communicate with the owner, not the renter (though some communicate with both. If something could lead to legal action, I would want it documented in writing. If a general warning/scolding, Email would suffice.

In SC one can go online to the County and find the owner of record and their address as in where the County sends the tax bill. I forget the exact procedure, but I have done it several times here in Lexington County.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

JohnC and Bill, thanks for the replies. I did check the county web site for the tax bill info. In both cases their condo address is still listed. In addition, both of them pay their monthly HOA fee using a 3rd party payment system that the property manager uses for all their communities. I've just sent the property manager asking if he has asked for their mailing address via email. Bill all of our governing documents are 40 years old and written by the developer. We are in the process of paying an attorney to rewrite everything. I hadn't thought about this topic when we employed him so if anyone has any thoughts on this subject please feel free to chime in.

AugustinD
Posts: 5,144

Posted:

JohnT38, do either of the two owners respond to emails? If I were on this board I think I would recommend creating a rule saying that each owner must have a valid snail mail address on file. I think such a rule is a fair interpretation of the boilerplate lines present in Declarations about the Board having to operate the HOA. Without a valid snail mail address, legally proving an owner, who is otherwise silent, received "notice" is not possible.

JohnT38 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,631

Posted:

AugustinD, it's my understanding that one of the owners responds and the other does not. I agree with your comment about creating a rule to address this and will ask the lawyer that's rewriting our docs to address it.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Remember the owner's mailing address is their HOA address. Whether or not they live there doesn't change the fact they are owner of that property. Which by being an owner they are a member. So I ALWAYS advice to send any and all communications to the HOA address directly. Even if they do not reside there. You can always send correspondence to BOTH. However, you want to have proof correspondence was sent to the HOA's members address in the HOA.

Former HOA President

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808

Posted:

I would disagree with Melissa, but perhaps only in the priority order. My HOA sends legal notices to the address where the owners live, not to the renter’s address (the actual property address).

The county tax system uses the address provided to them by the owners - the failure to provide a suitable address is always the responsibility of the owner - the county will take property due to failure to pay tax. While all counties use different software and systems, most I have seen show the property address, and the mailing address for tax notices.

In this specific case, if the owners have not provided the county with an accurate address to reach them, the owners, it is on the owners. The county will simply send to that address and assume the notices have been received.

The owner with son living in the property probably just says to them, “save the mail for me.” The one renting could be doing the same thing, but not as likely.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

The tax records filed at the county should reflect the HOA's address the owner owns. Do not believe it reflects other addresses they may live. They are still to pay taxes on that property. It is also that property in the HOA they own that makes them a member.

BTW: There was a foreclosure case someone tried to fight their HOA over. They stated that they never received any notices from the HOA because they did not live in the HOA. So they wanted to claim the HOA could not foreclose. They lost. Why? Because that person wasn't paying their dues for their HOA property. Regardless of that person's living address, they still had to be responsible for their HOA property. Which does include participating in paying dues, special assessments, voting, and keeping up with maintenance.

Former HOA President

AugustinD
Posts: 5,144

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MelissaP1 on 01/18/2020 6:49 AM
The tax records filed at the county should reflect the HOA's address the owner owns. Do not believe it reflects other addresses they may live.

You believe wrong. George is correct.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

With Augustine and George, Melissa is wrong. And she's been wrong on this topic many, many times.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

JohnT

We do not track rentals. All our communication goes to the taxpayer of record no matter who lives there. We have several situations we know of. Father owns the unit, son lives there. Owner address is Father's name at the address of the unit.

In another, the Daughter owns the unit, her father lives there. Owner address is Daughter's name at the address of the unit.

Not that it matters but as they are family, I expect neither is technically a rental.

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