Discussion Using Address or Account Number?

Hi All,

Specific question - should be easy :-)

Our Board has been using addresses during Board meetings when discussing whether to assess fines, file to lien and file to foreclose.

Is this common/advisable, or is it better to use the internal account numbers of each property?

Thanks!

I would think using APN (tax records?) would still allow someone not part of the community management to cross to the address?

There are states where IT MUST be approved in open session. Are you worried about hurting someone's feeling? As someone recently said, "Get over it".

We use addresses. We have no internal account number separate from the lot number or address in any case. To TimM's point, as Mark alluded to, Florida has broad open records and open meetings laws for associations, and late status is not one of the categories that is exempt from either. Any member can review the financial records (including who is late), and discussions of same would need to be discussed in open meeting.

We discuss this is Executive Session and we will use whatever we can names, addresses, dirty names, etc. to see if we can get the deadbeat to pay us.

No need to be an Internet Tough Guy about this. If the law says you have to do it in open session, then do that. But in my HOA, we always had the best results keeping it between the Board, MC, and offenders.

I responded precisely to your response. Sorry if that offended you.

When the violation or late payment reaches the board level, we simply referred to it in the minutes as a member is late or a violation of xyz.

Fortunately, we don't really have a whole lot of these that need to be discussed at the board level.

My opinion is that it doesn't matter what one owes as much as if your board is taking action to collect. For me showing the membership the board took dues being owed seriously and steps to correct was enough. Do not think any member needed more details other than "Lot 10 has a lien filed". "Lot 1 we will consider foreclosure" "Lot 15 has entered a payment plan".

We also established a 6 months we lien and 1 year we CONSIDERED foreclosure. Having that in place there was never a real need other than to state "We filed a lien on Lot 10". This showed we were taking action and applying our policy. The why or who had no relevance for anyone except to wag their tongues.

60 days to foreclosure? That's a little too little time. A bank doesn't foreclose till about 1 year of non-payment. A foreclosure is just a "Stop the bleeding" action. So can't imagine 60 days the HOA is bleeding greatly. The HOA never ever wants to own the home in a foreclosure. Plus they are not cheap. There is also the "right for redemption" time period in many states. Which is none to up to 1 year for the owner to pay back all owed to get the home back. Which means not really able to touch the property till that time period goes through as the new buyer. Just a waste of money/effort.

We wait till a year after lien is filed to foreclose. This time we would know if it's a bank foreclosure as well. If bank is foreclosing, then we aren't going to do their work for them. The bank gets paid first and foremost. (Except in states with Super Liens which put on same footing).

There are many factors to consider before we would consider following through with a foreclosure overall. Which having done one, it's not cheap. The process takes like 3 months. The first bid goes to the HOA for dollar over the amount owed. The HOA of course does NOT want to bid. Right of redemption period has to pass. This wouldn't be a process I'd do for a 60 day late in payments.

Not in Florida.

Ah if only it worked that way... It doesn't. The HOA doesn't get a 1500 house unless the home is paid for. Otherwise the HOA will be owning a home just like anyone else. Which means house payments, HOA dues, insurance, taxes, maintenance, seller costs, and every other expense associated with owning a home. Which they are also subject to the "right of redemption" expenses. Not to mention it would be paying out TWICE to purchase the home. It would be out the money owed and then money to buy.

Before you ASSUME what happens may want to find out for sure. It's not as simple as sell house and get money...It also would be subjected to a pretty large tax bill for that "profit".

Do yours. I did this in real life have you?

You keep posting in response that I am "clueless" yet do not back it up on how. You do not post right information yourself.

Now having done a Foreclosure I assure you that the HOA does NOT want to own the home they foreclose on. It is nothing more than a "stop the bleeding" procedure. There is no "Profit" involved. If there was, it would be taxable.

Let's follow the bouncing ball here shall we? An owner does not pay their dues for a year. Their dues are $100 a month. They owe the HOA $1200 at the end of the year. The HOA has filed a lien but no results at 6 month mark. Add on another $500 for legal costs etc. Now owner is in debt for $1700 to the HOA. (Not including foreclosure costs yet).

The owner owes on their house 100K. They have not paid their mortgage for a year. The HOA decides to foreclose on their lien and the bank has a foreclosure filed, then the bank will get paid first and foremost. Leaving the HOA out in the cold if money is still owed on the mortgage. The HOA is basically doing the work of the bank.

If the owner does not owe the bank, the HOA can foreclose on their lien for the $1700 + Legal expenses. The 1st bid goes to the HOA for $1 over the amount owed PLUS a 100K mortgage. The HOA would have to pick up the mortgage payment. It would have to pay the HOA dues on the home. Plus have house insurance and be responsible for the repairs.

Now the HOA may have to hold onto the house for a year due to the right of redemption. All this time making mortgage, insurance, tax, utilities, repairs, and maintenance costs. We are talking about 1K + a month of expense BEFORE they can sell the home. Which if sold at a profit like 125K, then the 25K would be taxable income to the HOA. A HOA can't make a profit without being subject to taxes from a sell of property.

Renting out property may be an option but it can only be rented for the amount it costs them. Rent would have to be 1K a month. Plus your entire membership is now "landlords". Renters aren't HOA members. They don't pay the HOA dues. Plus don't have to adhere to the HOA rules unless written in the lease agreement.

This is just the high points of why a HOA never wants to own a home it forecloses on. Plus that $1700 is money already OWED. So the HOA is basically trying to fill in a "hole" in their budget by foreclosing. Not a profit.

Now can you tell me how I am clueless? Give details that are RIGHT. Not the ones in your opinion.

Ok



Well, the timeline needs a little work. The HOA should file for foreclosure way before the bank to ensure it gets paid.



Not true. No one has to pick up a mortgage payment. Just ignore it. An HOA can foreclose on a bank with a mortgage, happens every day. And sell it for $1700. The new owner will know there is a mortgage on it and it will get foreclosed on in the future.



The HOA does NOT need to hold the house for any amount of time, nor spend a dime on expenses. The HOA can sell the house the next day, and the right of redemption still exists. But right of redemption will be against the new owner, not the HOA. The buyer will know this, they buy properties like this all the time.