A service of:
Community123.com
Professional websites for HOAs & condos, since 2004
🎁 1st year FREE for HOATalk members! →
← Return to Topics List

Electronic Voting ?

Started by BillR21 • 19 replies • 823 views

💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

BillR21 (Florida)
Posts: 6
Posted:
Our property manager recently sent me some information about a local company's electronic voting system and I was wondering if anyone had any comments about EVS.

I'm all in favor of having many ways to vote, but I'm wondering if such a system is worth the extra expense (about $800 per year, for the least expensive of their three options, for my POA).

If you're using an EVS have your percentages gone up enough to justify the expense?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
First, read your documents and check applicable statutes to see if voting by mail is allowed. If it isn't, then electronic voting likely isn't allowed either.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
Here is one attorney's opinion on the matter.

https://www.floridacondohoalawblog.com/2017/03/20/does-electronic-voting-for-community-associations-really-work-how-do-you-implement-it/
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BillR21 on 08/26/2018 3:34 AM
Our property manager recently sent me some information about a local company's electronic voting system and I was wondering if anyone had any comments about EVS.

I'm all in favor of having many ways to vote, but I'm wondering if such a system is worth the extra expense (about $800 per year, for the least expensive of their three options, for my POA).

If you're using an EVS have your percentages gone up enough to justify the expense?

I believe in Florida EV must be authorized in the governing documents, typically the bylaws.

When I first started hearing about HOA and condo EV in Florida, which was only legally made available last year, I was against it based on trust issues. Since then I've changed my tune after seeting what companies offer, how it works, and how much they charge.

Whether or not it would work for you depends on your situation. Do you have a lot of seasonal owners (snowbirds) not able to attend membership meetings? Do you have problems with quorum in voting (e.g. votes on amendments or other non-election voting)?

We don't use it because we always have enough people here in person or voting by proxy so it wouldn't provide any real benefits to us at the moment. The cost you quoted seems high. The numbers I saw were based on how many eligible voters there would be and per-vote, not an annual charge.

I'd consider it if myself and others here thought it would be worth it. The companies who provide the voting systems don't seem to need too much data on those who will participate in the voting, which is a big plus if you're a privacy advocate.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Also, the article Richard linked to is informative. It was enacted a couple of years ago, not last year. It would be interesting to hear from associations that have utilized electronic voting about their experiences. When the only information you see and hear is advertising and marketing extolling the virtues of such systems I always wonder what the real customers who paid for it think. That's harder to find.
ArtL1 (Florida)
Posts: 140
Posted:
Lots of misinformation in this thread. OP is in Florida. Anyone interested in this in its application to Florida HOAs should read FS 720.317. In short, your docs don't have to say a word about electronic voting or voting by mail. You just need a board resolution saying you're going to do this, and a few other minor hoops (mostly dealing with notification) to jump through.

I've done a lot of research on this, but have not yet pulled the trigger and done a real electronic vote. I was actually considering posting about this (again), but didn't want to sound like an advertisement. In my most recent searches for info on electronic voting, I came across electionbuddy.com. Of all the systems I've looked at, they are by far the cheapest. I'm kind of curious if anyone here has used them?
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ArtL1 on 08/26/2018 7:03 PM
but have not yet pulled the trigger and done a real electronic vote.

Kinda the wrong choice of words, especially what's been happening in Florida lately.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By ArtL1 on 08/26/2018 7:03 PM
Lots of misinformation in this thread. OP is in Florida. Anyone interested in this in its application to Florida HOAs should read FS 720.317. In short, your docs don't have to say a word about electronic voting or voting by mail. You just need a board resolution saying you're going to do this, and a few other minor hoops (mostly dealing with notification) to jump through.

While technically true, if the Bylaws specify that elections should be conducted with paper ballots and a 2-envelope system - something which is very common (Florida condos have no choice but to do it this way while HOAs don't) - then the bylaws do need to be amended to provide for the option of electronic voting. Besides the requirement for a board resolution, FS 720.317(1)(c) says the voting system must provide

"A method that is consistent with the election and voting procedures in the association’s bylaws."

If the election and voting procedures that are usually in one's bylaws specify paper ballots or don't conform to the 14-day written notice requirement of FS 720.317(4) then the bylaws will very likely need to be amended. If they're flexible enough to allow electronic voting according to the statute then only the board resolution would be necessary.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
FS 718 for condo associations is different in that there is no mention of "election and voting procedures in the association's bylaws". That's probably because condo associations must use the procedures provided in the statute already, so a board resolution is the only thing needed.
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
We are an HOA in Florida , 525 units . IN 2017 we used electronic voting for the first time. We just needed a board resolution and we used a company that set the entire process up. It was a bust as hardly anyone used it and we found that more people that lived here used it than out of towers, snowbirds or owners who lease. Sadly most people don't care and no matter what we provided them thye chose not to participate
GwenG (Florida)
Posts: 669
Posted:
Yes, WayneN, that is correct. Electronic voting has been permitted for all HOA's in Florida since 2015, regardless of what the bylaws state. All that is required is a resolution by the Board. That is clearly stated in the statute, which lays out the requirements step by step.

Did you find that the (previous) mailings resulted in greater participation by out of towners, landlords and snowbirds? (It would be very curious if that were so given the ease of electronic voting.) Did the Board do an "autopsy" of the association's promotion and guidance for the new form of voting?
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
The previous Miami vs produced a slightly higher turn out total. We promoted it very well and even had people boudoir to door prior to snowbirds departure . The actual process to vote online is more tedious than a simple paper ballot . You had to register, get a password etc. Future voting would be easier once your registered all that's required .
ArtL1 (Florida)
Posts: 140
Posted:
The rules for condo associations are nearly the same...I think these amendments were written at the same time.

http://www.leg.state.fl.us/STATUTES/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&Search_String=&URL=0700-0799/0718/Sections/0718.128.html

WayneN, that's really disappointing that your electronic vote was a bust. If you don't mind my asking though, who did you use and what did it cost (and was that cost for a one-time use, or subscription time period)?

Our problems have been that most just won't send in proxies. Only about 15% will show up at the annual meeting. Quorum is 30%. In the past 12 years, we've made quorum twice...both times due to intensive proxy campaigns.

Electionbuddy's system sounds much simpler than whatever you used. i.e. from the "demo election" I ran with their service, you just upload your "address list" of lot owners / email addresses. They send an email (or multiple email reminders) to each lot owner with a unique URL. That URL authenticates the lot owner and takes them to the electronic ballot. AFAIK, it's common to open up electronic voting weeks before the meeting, and allow voting anytime after the first emails go out until its closed, which might be the day of or day before the meeting.
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
We used Votenow and include total costs for setup mailings etc was in the 6,000 range
ArtL1 (Florida)
Posts: 140
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By WayneN on 08/30/2018 5:36 PM
We used Votenow and include total costs for setup mailings etc was in the 6,000 range

Holy crap that's expensive, particularly if you only used it once. What I'm looking at with electionbuddy would cost us under $100/election.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By WayneN on 08/30/2018 5:36 PM
We used Votenow and include total costs for setup mailings etc was in the 6,000 range

That does sound really expensive. Another drawback frequently mentioned is that electronic voting is an optional voting method that owners may choose to use or not. The more traditional method of balloting still has to be provided for those who don't want to vote online. There are a few articles and blogs around that delve into the reasons why it hasn't really caught on in FL.
ArtL1 (Florida)
Posts: 140
Posted:
The problem we've had though is members just won't fill out and mail in a proxy. At least not many. Even fewer will fill out a proxy correctly

There's no such thing as a "good night or time" time for an HOA meeting. With so many families being dual-income, and many having kids, during the day is right out. Weekends, we all have better things to do. Weekday evenings, we're busy with dinner/homework. So in-person attendance at meetings is pretty sparse. It's been suggested to try a Friday night, and to provide kid-friendly food (i.e. stack of pizzas).
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
It was shocking expensive . Part was due to the mailing costs as well. Thye have to mail owners an opt in letter , then thye had to mail out the actual voting packet which has to include all the pages for the budget, election and document changes . There was a large set up costs so using them again is much less expensive . But in the end , not many used the system even after many many said , oh if we could just vote online we would,lol...
Like I Said, never again
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
The postage to mail out 525 opt in letters would be over 200.00 alone . Make sure all costs are included . Also need to have the HOA attorneys check making sure it's all legit cause everyone has to get a piece of the pie !
WayneN (Florida)
Posts: 35
Posted:
EXACTLY

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

  • ✓ Ask follow-up questions
  • ✓ Share your experience
  • ✓ Get expert advice
  • ✓ Access 350,000 discussions
Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here

Terms of Use and Privacy Statement