HOA legal requirements

Started by JimL16 • 26 replies • 743 views

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JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Hello,

I'm a homeowner in an HOA in Florida. I'm trying to find out what (if any) from the list below is the HOA legally required to do.

Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting minutes for past HOA meetings?

Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting agendas for HOA meetings?

Do they have to provide written (by mail) financials when requested? What financials are they required to provide?

If i ask for clarification and to point out exactly on what grounds in the bylaws they are ticketing me on, do they have to provide it? For example, in a recent
inquiry, I looked in the bylaws for anything pointing to clarification about a ticket they issued. I could not find anything. So I asked them where it was and they
said it was in there. I asked them to show me (I was in their office). The lady started looking and less than a minute later of not being able to find it, she said
"I don't have to show you. Its your responsibility to find it." In the end they waived the ticket, but the harassment (of random tickets without being in direct violation) continues.

Is there a mandatory response timeline they have if I request documents? In other words if there is a ticket and fine, i have x days to pay. But there does not seem to be any response timeline required for them to respond to my questions.

If any of the above things are required and they fail to do them, what legal actions can I take? Are any of these things such that all i need to do is provide proof and a our city, county or state government will fine the HOA?

A lot of changes to HOA laws went into affect in Florida on 1 July 2018. There are a lot of sites talking about it. But it's very difficult to find anything about having a outside party investigate the HOA. It's as if as long as the HOA management company and board of directors and president are all sticking together, they can do whatever they want and the only choice a homeowner has is to sell their house.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Jim,

Start with your governing documents and applicable statutes.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 08/12/2018 9:04 AM
Jim,

Start with your governing documents and applicable statutes.

I am not an attorney so I don't know exactly what you mean. If you are talking about the "Declaration of Covenants" document, that has no verbiage that I could find specifically on anything i posted. Even if they created new documents that are different....that is not what I'm trying to figure out.

I'm asking about laws that are above anything in documents the HOA creates. For example, if the HOA "governing documents and applicable statutes" says "it's ok to kill people in the community"...well it doesn't matter what their documents say, that doesn't override state and federal law. That's not the greatest example since all HOA documents I read so far are full of statements that are much more ambiguous than the above statement.

I'm trying to find out if any of the things I listed are governed in a manner in which the HOA management company, board of directors or president can't change even if they wanted to. Things that are in place to protect homeowners from problematic HOA's.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

The rules have to be compliant to Local, City, State, and federal laws. They do NOT exceed those laws They can be more restrictive but they can't overrule laws. Your answer is in your CC&R's most likely not just your by-laws. the CC&R's are filed with the county. They are more binding. By-laws are just internal HOA documents.

Former HOA President

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808

Posted:

Jim,

Florida Statutes Chapter 720 provides the framework, but in some cases you governing docs could be more restrictive.

Your D, CC&Rs will probably be recorded in your county and hence should be accessible online - if your community is large enough you may already have a website?

Your Bylaws may or may not be recorded - you should get a copy from your Board of Directors - keep it informal - call the secretary or the Community Manager (if you have one) and ask for a copy.

Spend about 10 hours studying them all.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

So is the answer simply "if something is not in the CC&R, and/or if it does not violate city, state, or federal laws, it's allowed" and given nobody has listed any or a place to find any state, or federal laws specifically governing the operations or activities of an HOA, that there are none?

So if the bylaws or CC&R don't specifically outline the things pointed out in my first post, then there is nothing (state or federal) requiring the HOA to comply with any of that?

For example my CC&R has lots of verbiage about meeting minutes (especially in inspection by members and mortgagees section), but nothing about when to provide that information to homeowners. Or another example, Financials and other documents, the CC&R says the HOA must provide them to any purchaser of a home or unit in the community, but does not outline any timeline. The document just says they most be made available for inspection which leaves the door wide open to make homeowners jump through hoops or run in circles trying to get any type of documents. Our documents even state that the board should make rules for inspection but we don't have any.

Even if the governing documents don't outline a timeline or process of request and reply, there is no law above the HOA that conflicts with this?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Jim, George suggested you review FL Chapter 720, which might give you timelines. Can't quit remember, but in CA it's 10 days. I think our bylaws say "reasonable period of time."

You also asked: "Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting minutes for past HOA meetings?"
I doubt it, but these usually are posted on your HOA's website once approved a month or more after the meeting in question (Some boards don't meet monthly.)

"Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting agendas for HOA meetings?"
No, but your bylaws or FL statutes may require that the notice of a board meeting and the agenda be posted xx days in advance of said meeting

"Do they have to provide written (by mail) financials when requested? What financials are they required to provide?"
Yes. You need to read FL statutes to see which ones. If the board or Manager cannot send them to you online, they most likely are permitted to bill you for copies and mailings.

I don't know FL or your documents about fining procedures. In CA, owners may present their point of view at a hearing. Doesn't FL require such hearings?

You have homework to do, Jim.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GeorgeS21 on 08/12/2018 10:56 AM
Jim,

Florida Statutes Chapter 720 provides the framework, but in some cases you governing docs could be more restrictive.

Your D, CC&Rs will probably be recorded in your county and hence should be accessible online - if your community is large enough you may already have a website?

Your Bylaws may or may not be recorded - you should get a copy from your Board of Directors - keep it informal - call the secretary or the Community Manager (if you have one) and ask for a copy.

Spend about 10 hours studying them all.

We just changed HOA management companies. I don't know why, I'm at work during most of the meetings and the HOA does not provide meeting minutes. I do have a copy of my CC&R but it does not go into details on the things in my first post. The new HOA management company website does not have any documents. I checked today and the only thing was a new ticket for a dirty driveway (discoloration from sitting rain-water?) and a demand to specifically "have it pressure washed within 15 days". Considering its a problem every house in my neighborhood has, its strange that I have a ticket for it.

That's another store. My visit to the site today was part of gathering research on the unrestricted power HOA's have. My initial post outlines a few small things that open big holes. From what I can see so far, the HOA seems like they are more powerful than many organizations in that they appear to have no government actively inspecting and regulating what they do.

A community managers phone number is on the new HOA website. I will try to reach out to him this week and ask for any updated Bylaws. It's difficult to believe that reaching out to the community manager will help anything. He works for the HOA board and president....if he doesn't respond in the interest of what the directors or president wants, their management company may get fired like the last one did. It seems like a large circle of conflicts of interest where any homeowner that is not friends with the board president or the board, is stuck in the middle dealing with whatever mischief comes about from an organization that has no outside oversight.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/12/2018 11:30 AM
Jim, George suggested you review FL Chapter 720, which might give you timelines. Can't quit remember, but in CA it's 10 days. I think our bylaws say "reasonable period of time."

You also asked: "Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting minutes for past HOA meetings?"
I doubt it, but these usually are posted on your HOA's website once approved a month or more after the meeting in question (Some boards don't meet monthly.)

"Do they have to provide written (by mail) meeting agendas for HOA meetings?"
No, but your bylaws or FL statutes may require that the notice of a board meeting and the agenda be posted xx days in advance of said meeting

"Do they have to provide written (by mail) financials when requested? What financials are they required to provide?"
Yes. You need to read FL statutes to see which ones. If the board or Manager cannot send them to you online, they most likely are permitted to bill you for copies and mailings.

I don't know FL or your documents about fining procedures. In CA, owners may present their point of view at a hearing. Doesn't FL require such hearings?

You have homework to do, Jim.

From what I've read online, California has a lot more government oversight over HOA "Office of the Attorney General has limited, discretionary authority to intervene on behalf of homeowners who are denied certain prescribed rights provided by the California Corporations Code" Ref: https://oag.ca.gov/consumers/general/homeowner_assn

I don't think we have that here in Florida. The new HOA rules our governor signed off on effective 1 July 2018 specify different verbiage for homes vs condos. I may have to read the whole 7xx laws to figure out if something is specifically being violated. Even then, the next issue will be trying to find legal help to make sure the HOA is corrected. Maybe this is why HOA's are so big. Who has time to work, spend time with family and friends, deal with maintenance and upkeep of their homes and cars, taxes, new health insurance regulations, and also be an HOA law expert??? All of the board members and president in my community are retired. They have so much time.

JenniferG11 (Texas)
Posts: 667

Posted:

Here, one used to go to the office to inspect the minutes, and now (at least in theory) they are to be posted on our website.

Just ask the MC how to see the minutes.

JenniferG11 (Texas)
Posts: 667

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JimL16 on 08/12/2018 11:15 AM
So is the answer simply "if something is not in the CC&R, and/or if it does not violate city, state, or federal laws, it's allowed" and given nobody has listed any or a place to find any state, or federal laws specifically governing the operations or activities of an HOA, that there are none?

So if the bylaws or CC&R don't specifically outline the things pointed out in my first post, then there is nothing (state or federal) requiring the HOA to comply with any of that?

For example my CC&R has lots of verbiage about meeting minutes (especially in inspection by members and mortgagees section), but nothing about when to provide that information to homeowners. Or another example, Financials and other documents, the CC&R says the HOA must provide them to any purchaser of a home or unit in the community, but does not outline any timeline. The document just says they most be made available for inspection which leaves the door wide open to make homeowners jump through hoops or run in circles trying to get any type of documents. Our documents even state that the board should make rules for inspection but we don't have any.

Even if the governing documents don't outline a timeline or process of request and reply, there is no law above the HOA that conflicts with this?

State law will definitely set timelines for financials. If the MC doesn't answer you about those, send a polite but firm letter citing the statute. They can charge you for compilation and mailing.

I'm in a condo in Texas so this may not apply to you, but we do not have to pay because there is an on-site office that meets the TX law definition of a reasonable place to provide inspection during reasonable (office) hours.

JenniferG11 (Texas)
Posts: 667

Posted:

"If i ask for clarification and to point out exactly on what grounds in the bylaws they are ticketing me on, do they have to provide it? For example, in a recent
inquiry, I looked in the bylaws for anything pointing to clarification about a ticket they issued. I could not find anything. So I asked them where it was and they
said it was in there. I asked them to show me (I was in their office). The lady started looking and less than a minute later of not being able to find it, she said
"I don't have to show you. Its your responsibility to find it." In the end they waived the ticket, but the harassment (of random tickets without being in direct violation) continues."

That is totally wrong. Of course it is up to them to show where the violation is codified in the by-laws or rules and regs.

DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046

Posted:

Generally speaking, FS720 requires official records of the association to be made available for inspection (and copying) by members, it does not require mailing, emailing, or delivering them.

This is not the complete section on records, but a relevant portion:
(5) INSPECTION AND COPYING OF RECORDS.—The official records shall be maintained within the state for at least 7 years and shall be made available to a parcel owner for inspection or photocopying within 45 miles of the community or within the county in which the association is located within 10 business days after receipt by the board or its designee of a written request. This subsection may be complied with by having a copy of the official records available for inspection or copying in the community or, at the option of the association, by making the records available to a parcel owner electronically via the Internet or by allowing the records to be viewed in electronic format on a computer screen and printed upon request. If the association has a photocopy machine available where the records are maintained, it must provide parcel owners with copies on request during the inspection if the entire request is limited to no more than 25 pages. An association shall allow a member or his or her authorized representative to use a portable device, including a smartphone, tablet, portable scanner, or any other technology capable of scanning or taking photographs, to make an electronic copy of the official records in lieu of the association’s providing the member or his or her authorized representative with a copy of such records. The association may not charge a fee to a member or his or her authorized representative for the use of a portable device.
(a) The failure of an association to provide access to the records within 10 business days after receipt of a written request submitted by certified mail, return receipt requested, creates a rebuttable presumption that the association willfully failed to comply with this subsection.
(b) A member who is denied access to official records is entitled to the actual damages or minimum damages for the association’s willful failure to comply with this subsection. The minimum damages are to be $50 per calendar day up to 10 days, the calculation to begin on the 11th business day after receipt of the written request.

As you mention upthread, Florida, like most states, does not have a state department or agency to enforce HOA laws, enforcement is via civil action in the courts.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Glad Douglas cleared up the state-oversight topic, Jim.

Not clear tot me if you've read your HOA's bylaws about meetings, minutes, elections, etc. It seems you're taking about the Rules & Regs of your HOA re: "tickets," fines, etc.

It is not correct to say that CA seems to have some sort of watchdog or whatever over HOAs. CA does have lots of statutes that CAN protect h'owners, but Owners need to to take the time to learn them just as you're doing right now, Jim. FL also has a lot of protections for Owners.

Where I do disagree with Douglas is that civil action via the courts is made to seem like the only way to get a rogue HOA board to behave. Many of us on this forum have completely reversed the activities of ignorant arrogant board via HOÅ elections and our votes. But it take knowledge, hard work and JOINT, UNIFIED action. But it cost us nothing. Yes, we Owners eliminated the abuses of previous board. Recalls also are possible

Now, if none in your HOA "have the time" to do that, no nanny state is gonna take care of you.

GwenG (Florida)
Posts: 669

Posted:

It seems that there is some focus toward you, perhaps discriminately, regarding HOA-issued tickets. An important question to ask is 'Do the Covenants permit enforcement of rules/covenants etc with or without fines?" If fining is authorized, FS720 requires specific systems be established by the HOA attempting to enforce a rule, including a non-board affiliated Fining Committee, statutory notices of violation, hearings and a published fining schedule.

"Tickets" for violations, are generally not found in bylaws. These are customarily adopted by board and/or membership vote and memorialized in a separate Rules & Regulations" document. Well-run HOA's typically attempt to gain compliance through warnings and, failing that, will begin papering the violator. This may culminate, if permitted by the Covenants and desired by the Board, in levying fines.

Unfortunately, there is a hefty learning curve to understanding the HOA governance model. It appears you have done some research, in that you discovered that Florida does not have effective institutional controls or regulatory agencies for HOA's as some other states do. The best advice is to get a current copy of your governing documents and read them all--90% of your basic questions will be answered by them. In your case, I would also read FS720 provision related to fines.

In Florida, ALL of these documents are easily and freely downloadable online.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/12/2018 1:33 PM

Not clear tot me if you've read your HOA's bylaws about meetings, minutes, elections, etc. It seems you're taking about the Rules & Regs of your HOA re: "tickets," fines, etc.

My CC&R docs provide information regarding rules and regulations. Valid fines that myself and my neighbors have received do have lines outlining the rules and regulations about them in the CC&R and the "bylaws" are attached to that document as an exhibit. All the information i have is from those documents. The questions I have about meetings, minutes, etc are not addressed in those documents. My note about a specific ticket above was just an elaboration of what's available on the new HOA community website. Links, docs, new, etc are all blank. The only thing there is a new ticket and I elaborated on what it was about but also noted that this thread is not about that.

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/12/2018 1:33 PM

It is not correct to say that CA seems to have some sort of watchdog or whatever over HOAs. CA does have lots of statutes that CAN protect h'owners, but Owners need to to take the time to learn them just as you're doing right now, Jim. FL also has a lot of protections for Owners.

I didn't say CA has some sort of watchdog or whatever over HOA's, i simply posted a link to a publication by your state government and a direct quote about what they will look into, and stated that we do not have that in Florida. And we don't. If we do, please post a link by the governing body that outlines it. The link I posted even outlines exactly what types of violations they will address and they reference the governing code.

I'll also point out a reminder from an attorney I reached out to. Learning codes is one thing, precedence is another. All laws or statutes are not so clear that just learning them is enough. If the legal system was that simple a lot of things would be different. One attorney who has fought cases in my area but not specifically against my HOA explained to me without getting into detail just how financially out of control a case can get because of the gray area of the law. That does't just apply to HOA stuff, that's all legal stuff. Law as a profession isn't there to take people's money. It's there because people don't agree on what words and phrases mean and a systems been created to deal with this problem. The less you understand that system, the more likely you are to have a good case get thrown out of court. Even experienced lawyers mishandle cases.

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/12/2018 1:33 PM

Where I do disagree with Douglas is that civil action via the courts is made to seem like the only way to get a rogue HOA board to behave. Many of us on this forum have completely reversed the activities of ignorant arrogant board via HOÅ elections and our votes. But it take knowledge, hard work and JOINT, UNIFIED action. But it cost us nothing. Yes, we Owners eliminated the abuses of previous board. Recalls also are possible

Now, if none in your HOA "have the time" to do that, no nanny state is gonna take care of you.

Congratulations. But "cost us nothing" isn't true. When I am focused on HOA nonsense, I am not focusing on other issues. Everything has a price and and if your time is worthless, then yes, i guess it did cost you nothing. Myself, when I broke down and decided to pay a lawn company to manage my yard, it wasn't because i wanted to. I love working outside in the yard. However, the weather hear is supports a yard easily getting out of control if its not tended to each week. It takes more time than i can justify spending to avoid a ticket. The alternative is me to work less so I can spend more time in the yard....doesn't make financial since. Or I can do the best I can and just pay the frequent tickets during the summer months....doesn't make financial since based on the repeated violation scale of ticket fines....by the fourth fine I'm paying more in fines than what it cost to have a professional manage my yard. The point is just because you gave all the time it took to get what you wanted, doesn't mean that was free or that it appropriate for everybody.

As far as "no nanny state is gonna take care of you", you just degraded the thread. Where did I suggest I was looking for nanny like treatment from the state. What is that suppose to even mean? What I am looking for information about has been outlined. I'm not sure what your goal was with this post anymore.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GwenG on 08/12/2018 2:04 PM
It seems that there is some focus toward you, perhaps discriminately, regarding HOA-issued tickets. An important question to ask is 'Do the Covenants permit enforcement of rules/covenants etc with or without fines?" If fining is authorized, FS720 requires specific systems be established by the HOA attempting to enforce a rule, including a non-board affiliated Fining Committee, statutory notices of violation, hearings and a published fining schedule.

"Tickets" for violations, are generally not found in bylaws. These are customarily adopted by board and/or membership vote and memorialized in a separate Rules & Regulations" document. Well-run HOA's typically attempt to gain compliance through warnings and, failing that, will begin papering the violator. This may culminate, if permitted by the Covenants and desired by the Board, in levying fines.

Unfortunately, there is a hefty learning curve to understanding the HOA governance model. It appears you have done some research, in that you discovered that Florida does not have effective institutional controls or regulatory agencies for HOA's as some other states do. The best advice is to get a current copy of your governing documents and read them all--90% of your basic questions will be answered by them. In your case, I would also read FS720 provision related to fines.

In Florida, ALL of these documents are easily and freely downloadable online.

I still have to wait for the management company to provide the updated bylaws to see how different they are from the docs I have. I have received community notices in the mail about the fine procedure so I'm clear on that. Fist time is warning, second time is fee, and it gets more elaborate depending on the violation and can double up to a cap for each repeated fine. What isn't clear is when I get a fine and can't find anything in the documents about it. I'm going to have to spend time as you said getting familiar with the Florida statues, especially the changes that went into effect 1 July 2018.

Most of my research is leading to the conclusion that the most appropriate thing for me to do now is to keep paying the HOA all the money they are trying to get, and look for another house so I can sell this one. For many years this neighborhood was everything I expected from an HOA based on previous HOA neighborhoods I lived in. However, over the last year I went from being happy to come home after work to feeling like I was just going to my second job of dealing with HOA issues. Even the retired people in my neighborhood won't take time to fight. One by one they are selling their houses. First my neighbor on the right, a few months ago my retired neighbors on the left said they are fed up and selling (they haven't listed yet), a good neighbor that lived on the other side of them sold last month, a coworker of mine that lives in the neighborhood is selling. Nobody is getting great prices for their homes but they are still selling.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DouglasK1 on 08/12/2018 12:31 PM
Generally speaking, FS720 requires official records of the association to be made available for inspection (and copying) by members, it does not require mailing, emailing, or delivering them.

This is not the complete section on records, but a relevant portion:
(5) INSPECTION AND COPYING OF RECORDS.—The official records shall be maintained within the state for at least 7 years and shall be made available to a parcel owner for inspection or photocopying within 45 miles of the community or within the county in which the association is located within 10 business days after receipt by the board or its designee of a written request. This subsection may be complied with by having a copy of the official records available for inspection or copying in the community or, at the option of the association, by making the records available to a parcel owner electronically via the Internet or by allowing the records to be viewed in electronic format on a computer screen and printed upon request. If the association has a photocopy machine available where the records are maintained, it must provide parcel owners with copies on request during the inspection if the entire request is limited to no more than 25 pages. An association shall allow a member or his or her authorized representative to use a portable device, including a smartphone, tablet, portable scanner, or any other technology capable of scanning or taking photographs, to make an electronic copy of the official records in lieu of the association’s providing the member or his or her authorized representative with a copy of such records. The association may not charge a fee to a member or his or her authorized representative for the use of a portable device.
(a) The failure of an association to provide access to the records within 10 business days after receipt of a written request submitted by certified mail, return receipt requested, creates a rebuttable presumption that the association willfully failed to comply with this subsection.
(b) A member who is denied access to official records is entitled to the actual damages or minimum damages for the association’s willful failure to comply with this subsection. The minimum damages are to be $50 per calendar day up to 10 days, the calculation to begin on the 11th business day after receipt of the written request.

As you mention upthread, Florida, like most states, does not have a state department or agency to enforce HOA laws, enforcement is via civil action in the courts.

Thanks for pointing that out. After I reach out to the new community manager and request documents, I'll have to reference the fs to make sure i get them.

JimL16 (Florida)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JenniferG11 on 08/12/2018 11:53 AM

I found a note in our documents that says its up to the board to determine when and if we pay, but I wasn't able to find any documents outlining a fee schedule.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JimL16 on 08/12/2018 11:15 AM
Even if the governing documents don't outline a timeline or process of request and reply, there is no law above the HOA that conflicts with this?

Hi, Jim. You should familiarize yourself with FS 720. http://www.leg.state.fl.us/Statutes/index.cfm?App_mode=Display_Statute&URL=0700-0799/0720/0720.html

Complaints about access to the official records are among the most frequent complaints of homeowners and condo unit owners in Florida. Your rights are plainly spelled out in FS 720. Look for the section on "Official Records". That part of the statute likely overrides and takes precedence over anything to the contrary in your documents regarding access. Hint: you have a right to view just about everything.

This is pretty basic stuff. You would do well to study FS 720 and your governing documents before asking a ton of "HOA 101" questions here. People are generally very helpful but there is a definite leaning curve and you'll find that people are more helpful when it appears as though you're doing whatever it takes to become educated on these things.

FS 720 also places significant requirements on an HOA that wants to fine one of its homeowners. "Fine" is defined in the statute. "Ticket" is not.

Another phrase to google: "hoa selective enforcement"

You can't be singled out for enforcement of a violation if others are also in violation and no action is being taken against them.

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808

Posted:

Jim,

Again, you need to really understand your CCRs, Bylaws and FL 720 prior to spending too much time on this site asking questions.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

In many states, reviewing the state's corporations codes is helpful too.

Remember to request what you want form the new manager, Jim, in writing. something that may help you a lot is a copy of your HOA's contract with the mgmt. co.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/12/2018 3:45 PM
In many states, reviewing the state's corporations codes is helpful too.

Remember to request what you want form the new manager, Jim, in writing. something that may help you a lot is a copy of your HOA's contract with the mgmt. co.

A copy of the contract with the management co. is definitely something I'd request along with whatever else is requested. It's important to remember that the Board of Directors is ultimately responsible for fulfilling a request for access to the records. The board can't disclaim responsibility for that even though it might be reasonable that they've assigned the "maintenance of the official records" to the management company. If it becomes clear that they're trying to obfuscate responsibility, keep making excuses or otherwise stonewalling (or outright ignoring) requests for access to the records then don't wait too long before putting your official records request in writing and send it certified mail to the HOA's registered agent. I'd also send a copy to the president (which doesn't have to be sent certified as long as a certified one is sent to the Registered Agent). At the end of the day the Board is responsible and the management company works for the HOA, not the other way around, so blaming them for the failure to produce the records isn't going to fly.

PaaN
Posts: 219

Posted:

..... Most of my research is leading to the conclusion that the most appropriate thing for me to do now is to keep paying the HOA all the money they are trying to get, and look for another house so I can sell this one. .....

Unfortunately, correct reasoning.

remember:

CAVEAT EMPTOR

GwenG (Florida)
Posts: 669

Posted:

JimL16, I agree with your bottom line assessment. Sell, move...be done with the "carefree" HOA lifestyle hassle. Life is too short to take on a second job navigating an HOA. Unfortunately, you will probably have to make adjustments in your housing expectations as there is not a a great selection of non-hoa housing available in metro areas in FL. My HOA house is for sale, and I am happily renting.

HOA housing? Never Again!

GeorgeS21 (Florida)
Posts: 3,808

Posted:

And, I will add and offset to Gwen's conclusion :-)

I love the HOA neighborhoods in which I have lived ... none have been run by neo nazis, though. I was involved on the boards of all of them.

Our single family home neighborhoods looked better, had a much higher price per square foot of living space than non HOA neighborhoods, and were known to be very nice places to live - there was palpable pride in ownership and maintenance.

To each their own.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GwenG on 08/13/2018 1:50 PM
JimL16, I agree with your bottom line assessment. Sell, move...be done with the "carefree" HOA lifestyle hassle. Life is too short to take on a second job navigating an HOA. Unfortunately, you will probably have to make adjustments in your housing expectations as there is not a a great selection of non-hoa housing available in metro areas in FL. My HOA house is for sale, and I am happily renting.

HOA housing? Never Again!

I'm getting there. Realtors in my area routinely advertise homes for sale here as "Maintenance Free Living" and our documents were clearly written with that in mind. The reality is much much different as the board has consistently for 25+ years worked to offload the HOA's responsibilities and obligations onto the homeowners. "Maintenance Free Living" still appears in the listings for several properties currently for sale here.

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