Rules and Regs that differentiate between Guests and Visitors?

We've got an owner who's in assisted living, her house has been empty for a couple of years; it's not rented to anyone. She has a granddaughter who comes in with about 6 of her friends a couple of times a month to use the pool. No one in here knows her or any of her friends. When asked she always says "I'm the granddaughter and guest of Mrs. X who owns that house right over there," and that's usually that.

Contrast that with an owner who's a seasonal resident whose child is married with a family, and that family comes down for a week or two every summer to stay in the house and enjoy the pool and the nearby beach. They're responsible people who seem to be good parents and never cause any problems.

Then there's another seasonal resident owner ("snowbirds" we call them) who goes north every Easter and doesn't return until after Thanksgiving. They have friends who live in town about 6 miles away from our subdivision. They pack their kids into their mini-van a couple of times a month and trek over here and use the pool. Then they leave, go out the front gate, and head home.

We're trying to come up with some language for our Rules & Regulations - or to amend our CC&Rs with if necessary - to prevent case #1, allow case #2 and put a stop to case #3. Anyone have any samples of language that would accomplish this? We spoke of adding language that only permits guests to use the recreational facilities if the homeowner is "in residence" but nobody has seen similar language anywhere else. We considered saying that guests can only use the rec facilities if accompanied by a homeowner, but we have one owner who has company when it's in-season over the winter and he wants to be able to allow his 30-year-old kids to use the pool when they visit without him having to go to the pool with them.

Now we're thinking about defining "guest" as someone the owner invites into the community and "visitor" as someone who comes to see and spend time with the owner. We're trying to figure out some language along those lines. Can we prohibit guests who are not visitors that are under the age of, say, 25 from using the facilities? I have to think that's not housing discrimintation because the young people we'd exclude don't live here. The mini-van of the locals probably wouldn't come if they couldn't bring their small children with them.

It's tricky. Any thoughts?

You can also limit the number of guests for each pass.

Here's some wording we use, Geno:

"Guests on an extended stay (over 2 weeks) are considered members of the household and may use the facilities unaccompanied. Extended-stay guests must register with the Association and are subject to all community guidelines contained within the Community Handbook or posted in common areas and recreation areas. Other guests may use the facilities only when accompanied by the host."

We have a relative with three kids who uses the pool maybe 3-4 times a summer who we have as a "permanent guest." When we go out of town soon for a couple of weeks, she can come use the pool without us accompanying her.

We used to have a rule limiting the number of people from any condo unit to 8. But we dropped it since 8 or more only happens maybe once a month and causes no inconveniences to others.

I don't think you should try to distinguish between guests and visitors. Legalese I've seen seem always to say, guests or invitees. I don't think it'd be legal to forbid anyone under 25.

All I have time for now, Geno.

It's both. The granddaughter and her friends break numerous rules. The minivan crew doesn't break any rules but they have no right to be here. I like your suggestion about Guest Passes. We don't have any passes right now but I think we might be able to do that. It's a small pool, 20' x 40', bathing load 20, and it's rare that there are ever more than a dozen people there at one time.


That's a good question, Mark. We're dealing with that exact problem right now but it doesn't involve the use of our recreational amenities. It deals with yet another owner who's in a nursing home and his ex-brother-in-law who acts as his "rental agent". The agent claims to hold a full PoA from the 95 year-old owner but he won't produce it. We have a question in to our HOA attorney right now about that.


Thanks, Kerry, that is very helpful.


We've had a few brushes with unintended consequences so we're mindful of that. It's more than one person, really. Another instance we had in January needs to be addressed as well. An owner reserved the clubhouse for a private function and invited about 30 people to it. The owner and his wife themselves didn't attend. Nothing bad happened during the event but we, as owners who pay to maintain and insure the recreational amenities, think that the facilities shouldn't be used solely by people who have no skin in the game. There were a few owners who wanted to do something in the clubhouse that Saturday but they could't because it had been reserved for someone else (we allow that and have rules and procedures in place). They were more than a little upset because the people who reserved it weren't even there.

As more and more homes turn over here we anticipate an increase in people who will push the envelope to see what they can get away with. We've had a few of those in the last couple of years. We want to head off future problems caused by people who don't even live here yet.

We know we could create tiny paragraphs for our CC&Rs or Rules that would carefully delineate every possible situation, but they'd be so long and complicated that no one would bother to read and understand them. That's why we're trying to come up with a concise and succinct solution. (As an aside, the current Rules Committee has someone on it who objected last week to the introductory text of our published Rules and Regulations because it contained the word "succinct" and she didn't understand what it meant.)

Thank you for the responses. All very helpful.

A fair question. The owner is responsible for his/her tentants, guests, visitors and invitees whether or not the owner is currently occupying the residence. Your solution is the simplest but there would be significant opposition.

We're not an age restricted community, but we have a limit of only 4 guest at the pool per household.

If i'm not mistaken FHA forbids that, but there are a different set of guidelines for age qualified communities.

God giveth, and the FHA takes rights away. YUP!!!! That's exactly what I'm saying. visitors. renters. co-habitors, caregivers. whatever they're called they have rights too. I don't like it, I agree with you, but it's the sad shape we are in. I don't live in an age qualified HOA, but this comes from our property manager. Age Qualified communities hay have slightly different guidelines.. Believe me, I am sick and tired of the renters in my HOA destroying things, If I had it my way, renters should be accompanied by the owner when going to the pool.

We're saying the same thing. As long as the resident, whether they be renters, co-habitors, etc. are present, the visitors can use the pool. I thought you were saying that anyone could come off the street and use it.