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ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Earlier this month a young man moved into one of 1 bedroom units that had been for sale in my building.

In the past 48 hours, a neighbor of mine brought something to my attention. (She's a good friend of the woman who sold that unit.) The young man is a 34-year-old schizophrenic who doesn't take mediation and has a very violent past. He's been arrested and convicted of lewd exposure and 4th degree sexual assault on 2 separate occasions. In addition, he's been arrested and convicted of strangulation and destruction of property. His most recent arrest and conviction was in October of 2015. He's also spent time at the Mendota Mental Health Institute in Madison.

He's not the unit owner. His step-father is and is paying for him to live there. He lives in the unit rent free,

My neighbor and I have alerted the Board of Directors about him and are going to speak to the association attorney. However, one of the board members doesn't think much can be done due to Fair Housing laws. I wasn't aware that the Fair Hosing laws awarded protection to persons with violent criminal histories who posed a threat to the community.

Does anyone have any advise on how to deal or approach this?

Is the association obligated to warn other residents about him?

What if he ends up exposing him or assaulting someone in a common area? Since my mom and I own a share of that, are we then liable for him doing that?

While I don't have children, I feel for those in my community who do have children and now I'm going to constantly worry about the children in my community who have to pass with feet of his garage door to get on and off the school bus.

My doors are always locked and my garage door is always closed. At night, I drop my blinds and close the curtains in the bedrooms.

He's invited me inside his unit 3 or 4 times and I've always declined. He's flirted with me a few times and has already stared at me twice from his patio doors as I've walked the dog at night.

Despite the fact I live feet away, I try hard to avoid him. If he comes over and rings my door bell, I refuse to answer the door.

I'm a compassionate and understanding person, but we're a condo community NOT a mental hospital.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
As you may be aware, having a criminal background by itself does not equate to a protected class under Fair Housing law, with one caveat: HUD is going around saying that singling out ex-cons for different treatment generally will result in minorities (such as African Americans and Hispanic Americans) being treated differently. HUD discourages housing providers (including HOAs) from singling out those with a criminal background.

This tenant also has schizophrenia. He likely is technically disabled. Fair Housing law does protect those who are disabled.

I do not think your HOA should say anything for now. Nor do I think the HOA has any liability if this person commits a crime. The criminal justice system operates on the premise that people released from prison paid their dues and presumably are safe. It is not the HOA's place to second-guess this.

Is this tenant's criminal past on public record such that all Members could in theory read about this guy? If so, this especially argues for the HOA doing nothing. But you as a member can tell anyone about another's criminal past.

I think the mild harassment you are describing is not sufficient to warrant further action, other than your being very firm with this fellow in your communications with him. I think I would just literally walk right by him and say nothing. Don't get me wrong: I too would be bothered by living near such a person, especially given his present behavior.

Over the years I have seen many families install their unemployable adult son or daughter in condominiums. I think having these sort of folks as neighbors from time to time is part of the price of owning a small home (in a neighborhood that is often affordable to lower income folks).
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AugustinD on 04/20/2018 8:35 PM
As you may be aware, having a criminal background by itself does not equate to a protected class under Fair Housing law, with one caveat: HUD is going around saying that singling out ex-cons for different treatment generally will result in minorities (such as African Americans and Hispanic Americans) being treated differently. HUD discourages housing providers (including HOAs) from singling out those with a criminal background.

I'm a Fair Housing Tester so, yes, I'm aware those with a criminal history aren't, in of themselves, a protected class.

However, offenders tend to be repeat offenders, as with this young man. He's exposed himself twice and committed assault twice. 4th degree no less, which tends to involves minors.

He also has a pretty colorful and storied past where traffic violations and drunk driving is concerned. Each time it involves a different car with different plates and a different VIN.

Quote:
Posted By AugustinD on 04/20/2018 8:35 PM
This tenant also has schizophrenia. He likely is technically disabled. Fair Housing law does protect those who are disabled.

Even that's kind of questionable at this point.

His sister and mother say he has bipolar disorder, but he certainly doesn't the characteristics of that.

If he does have anything mentally wrong with him it's most likely schizophrenia.

Quote:
Posted By AugustinD on 04/20/2018 8:35 PM
Is this tenant's criminal past on public record such that all Members could in theory read about this guy? If so, this especially argues for the HOA doing nothing. But you as a member can tell anyone about another's criminal past.

Yes, but unless you know his last name you're not going to find it.

Up until recently, everyone just knew him by his first name.

Believe you me, I've already began sharing this information with some of the others in my neck of the woods. My neighbor and I think others here should know about it. That it's everyone's right to know, especially if they have children.
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
"Tend to your own knittin'"

Don't like the guy? Ignore him. If he does anything remotely criminal, call the police. End of story. Let's not make this a federal case. Life is way too short.

If there is nothing in your governing documents prohibiting such occupants, you're just creating drama. You may not like him, you may not feel safe around him, you may feel others have a right about knowing his history, etc. Those are "you" issues, not his nor the HOAs.

I wouldn't necessarily want to live next to him, but short of me living on a deserted island, people sometimes to get unsavory neighbors. That's just the game of life!
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Number 1 the HOA can NOT interfere with any rental agreement. It is NONE of the HOA's business. The HOA business is with the owner/member ONLY. The renter is NOT a member of the HOA.

Number 2. This ALL sounds like a reason to run one's mouth about a mentally ill person. Seems time to be more sensitive than tongue wagging... Just going to put that out there as this is what it come off as.

Number 3. Yes his criminal PAST is concerning. However, it is a PAST. If it is the PRESENT, then the person or person(s) effected by the crime calls the police.

The HOA can NOT evict this person and needs to stay out of it. If they do commit a criminal act, call the police. They violate the HOA's rules, contact the owner. Otherwise, just STOP the tongue wagging and EDUCATE yourself on mental illness. Schizophrenia is not something one needs to be afraid of. It's a symptom of a disease. Do we need to hate on a person who has a disease?

Former HOA President
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
It's just quite upsetting to me and my one neighbor because when the woman sold her condo, she was under the impression a 70-year-old widowed man would be living in it. So when she got to the closing and found out that wasn't the case, she felt deceived and since she's learned more about who's now living there, she's upset the seller's mislead her.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
So what? Be upset. Don't own it anymore and the new owner can do what they want. Sounds more like a personal problem than anything else.

Former HOA President
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 04/20/2018 9:15 PM
.Don't own it anymore and the new owner can do what they want.

I don't trust the guy's family.

When my neighbor and I spoke to the sister and mother this afternoon, she told us that the guy was a "sweetie" and we had nothing to worry about it. Sorry, but someone with a violent criminal history is someone to worry about.

No one else who lives here should unknowingly have to put themselves or their children, if they have children, in harm's way. I and everyone else here shouldn't have to change our way of life to accommodate his being here.
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Again, these are "you" issues. The more you reply, the more I would suggest you make an appointment with a trained psychologist to discuss your issues and work through them.
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/20/2018 9:22 PM
Again, these are "you" issues. The more you reply, the more I would suggest you make an appointment with a trained psychologist to discuss your issues and work through them.

Actually, these are the issues of several other residents. Not just my issues.

The neighbor who brought this to me attention has been sexually assaulted twice and I was raped myself. I take the fact that he's here just feet away from us very seriously.

Again, no one else who lives here should unknowingly have to put themselves or their children, if they have children, in harm's way. I and everyone else here shouldn't have to change our way of life to accommodate his being here.

If we're somehow crazy for taking this seriously, then so be it. I'd rather be crazy about it than not.
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Then *group therapy it is.
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
I moved to Pleasant Prairie to get away from people like him. North Chicago was just full of people like him. Heck, I had to live next to someone just like him for 10 years. I'm not looking to spend any more of my life near someone like that. This is why people move from worse neighborhoods to better neighborhoods to begin with.

ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/20/2018 9:31 PM
Then *group therapy it is.

They say you can't possibly relate to someone unless you've been through what they've been through so I don't expect you to understand what I and the rest of us are going through right now.
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
That's just another assumption you've made on this thread. I am starting to feel sorry for the "unbalanced tenant".
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/20/2018 9:31 PM
Then *group therapy it is.

When you get sexually assaulted or raped and then have to live just feet away from someone maybe then you'll understand.
ElizabethM11 (Wisconsin)
Posts: 16
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/20/2018 9:36 PM
That's just another assumption you've made on this thread. I am starting to feel sorry for the "unbalanced tenant".

That's because you're a male, like he is.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/20/2018 9:22 PM
Again, these are "you" issues. The more you reply, the more I would suggest you make an appointment with a trained psychologist to discuss your issues and work through them.


Why is it you have a problem with someone either doing a reality check or trying to see how, within the bounds of the law, she can best prevent becoming a victim or her neighbors becoming victims? There is a reason all 50 states maintain registries of sex offenders, available for public viewing, despite said offenders ostensibly having paid their debt.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
There is a requirement if you are convicted of a sex crime notifications are sent out to the area they plan to move. Did not see poster mention getting any notification in the mail about this person. Plus there is a website you can visit that reports the sex offenders nearby. I have a notification sent to me updating that status. I do live across the street from a guy who was investigated for sex crime. (Long story but nice guy).

This is still all personal issues the OP has. The truth is this guy is probably just sitting in front of his TV playing video games. Not thinking about the neighbors. He has every right to live in that house and mind their own business.

Your not going to be a "hero" by reporting this information to all the neighbors. It's not going to prevent a crime. It's just a way for you to feel better. I always say: What you think about me is NOT what I think about me. Your putting your own fears and self conscious feelings onto this person. This person just went outside to pick up the newspaper... You have them going outside to scope out their next victim...

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
As has been pointed out, there is little the Association can do.

If the tenant violates covenants, rules or regulations, the Board can (and should) hold the owner accountable. This may or may not encourage the owner to not renew the lease or evict. However, since this is the owners son, I doubt that will happen.

If there is anything criminal going on, call the police.

You posting indicates you might have been a victim of sexual assault. Perhaps a support group in the area (who would be more knowledgeable) can offer suggestions.

Worst case, you may have to sell and move to feel safer. I know it's not an option you desire, but it might be the only option that is within your control.

Hope this helps,

Tim

AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Right now, this is all hearsay. The OP stated her friend told her these things about the "unbalanced tenant". So far, it's just gossip.

I was brutally assaulted (sexually) as an adult and suffer from PTSD. It's not that I don't have sympathy, it's just that I wish the OP would take more control of things she DOES have control of. It will do her better in this situation and in other things in life.

The world is not picture perfect and if the OP wants to live in a place where she is guaranteed to be free from "unbalanced tenants" then she needs to move. As I mentioned, all of this sounds like a "her" problem which I strongly suggests she seeks help with.
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posted:
If you have not done so already, do a criminal background check and look him up on the Wisconsin sex offender registry. Make sure his address on the registry is correct, since sex offenders must report their correct address (and often don't do so). Check the nature of the sex offense as there are levels. 4th degree is the least serious.

https://appsdoc.wi.gov/public

Also check the faq for a lot of useful information:

https://appsdoc.wi.gov/public/faq#A610
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
You stated that the guy is flirting with you? If that is so, it could be considered a crime, report it to the police.
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LetA on 04/21/2018 8:34 AM
You stated that the guy is flirting with you? If that is so, it could be considered a crime, report it to the police.

Wait, are you suggesting that flirting with someone is a crime? Now I've heard it all lol!
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/21/2018 10:34 AM
Posted By LetA on 04/21/2018 8:34 AM
You stated that the guy is flirting with you? If that is so, it could be considered a crime, report it to the police.


Wait, are you suggesting that flirting with someone is a crime? Now I've heard it all lol!

It's called unwanted advances, and if he's a registered sex offender that's a BIG NO-NO!
AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960
Posted:
Elizabeth, I must be the ONLY one who understands what you are trying to convey here. People should know who their neighbors are. If there is a sex offender or convicted felon living there EVERYONE should be aware if they live in a falsehood that their children or their wives or mates or elderly parents are being deposited outside the house of someone like this. ]If something were to happen and no one warned them of this person the Board could be held responsible for not forwarding this information to the other residents, IF they are aware of it.
Always be proactive rather than reactive. I know I'll get criticized for putting this out there. But the Board needs to cover their butts before the crime...rather than after.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AnnaD2 on 04/24/2018 3:44 PM

I know I'll get criticized for putting this out there.

Not by me.
AnnaD2 (Florida)
Posts: 960
Posted:
Thanks Tim!
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AnnaD2 on 04/24/2018 3:44 PM

If something were to happen and no one warned them of this person the Board could be held responsible for not forwarding this information to the other residents, IF they are aware of it.

It's not always clear cut decision for the Board.

I offer the following articles:

Sex Offenders – Not in my HOA – Not so fast 2017 article by an attorney

Q&A: When an Alleged Sex Offender Lives In Your Building May 2017 Article which (in part) states:

“Generally speaking an association has no clear legal duty to warn residents about known sexual predators living in the building,” . . . It is almost a certainty that if the board is notified that a sexual predator is residing in the building, does nothing, and someone is later assaulted by the person, the association will be sued by the victim. . . .
“Unfortunately, there is also possible liability to the association if it does warn residents about a sex offender’s occupation of the property.

PREVENTING SEX OFFENDERS FROM LIVING IN YOUR HOA a 2017 article that says, in part:

Does the association have an obligation to warn of sex offenders living in their association? Idaho law states that members of the public are not allowed to publicize the information contained in the sex offender registry list or to use it to harass or threaten sex offenders or members of their families; and harassment, stalking, or threats against sex offenders or their families is prohibited and doing so may violate Idaho harassment laws.

Since the OP is from Wisconsin:

Wisconsin's Sex Offender Registration and Notification Laws: Has the Wisconsin Legilature Left the Criminals and the Constitution Behind?
A 2004 Law Review Article

LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
I would assume that having a park or other amenities, even a school bus stop 1000 feet from the HOA would disqualify sex offenders from living in a common interest community. I raised the same concern when a sex offender moved into our community, he lives 1000 feet from the park and even closer to the pool. I was told by police that is is a judgment call from the parole and probation department.
DouglasM6 (Arizona)
Posts: 724
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AdamD1 on 04/21/2018 10:34 AM
Posted By LetA on 04/21/2018 8:34 AM
You stated that the guy is flirting with you? If that is so, it could be considered a crime, report it to the police.


Wait, are you suggesting that flirting with someone is a crime? Now I've heard it all lol!

Oh boy am I in trouble then! My wife says I'm biggest flirt she's ever seen!
DouglasM6 (Arizona)
Posts: 724
Posted:
Stay on the guy's good side. Don't be the one he goes after when he learns the neighbors are trying to boot him out of his free housing. Bake him some cookies, say Hi. (but carry a sidearm)
AdamD1 (Indiana)
Posts: 179
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DouglasM6 on 04/25/2018 11:34 AM
Stay on the guy's good side. Don't be the one he goes after when he learns the neighbors are trying to boot him out of his free housing. Bake him some cookies, say Hi. (but carry a sidearm)

I think we'd be good neighbors... fair but aware!

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