Hot Water Heaters

In recent years, hot water heaters have been an issue for our 88 unit townhouse complex.
Several of the hot water heaters have burst which resulted in a lot of water damage to that unit and adjacent units.

It's always been the belief of the HOA Board that the Hot Water Heater is the responsibility of the homeowner and any damage it causes is also the responsibility of the owner.
However, our new management company says the HOA should be the one paying for these repairs, as we're responsible for any water damage to the structure.

So without the approval of the board, the management company took it upon themselves to start the work and paid our $10,000 deductible out of our maintenance account.

Does anyone have any advice on how the HOA can drastically minimize its risk of these costly repairs caused by blown water heaters?
And is the management company right for saying the HOA should be paying the deductible even when the homeowner is negligent?

Thx!

First, check with the insurance company, as they are the ones who underwrite the insurance polices for the association. They would know what they (the association) is responsible for based on their interpretation of the CCRs and any attached amendments.

So, generally you have one of two scenarios. First, if the HOA is responsible for the damage, the homeowner will have to pick up the deductible, possibly through their own insurance. Second, in my experience, the failure of water heater, unless maintained by the association, falls on the individual homeowner.

The homeowner whose property was damaged should be talking to their insurance agent. Let the agents handle this being companies.

Water heaters, Pat, are probably not "limited common elements." They, like toilets and other plumbing within the units are personal property, and should be maintained, replaced, etc., by owners. That is unless your docs say otherwise.

It seems to me it's very important to make sure your MC knows its limits re: these and other expenditures.

It seems to me that your MC owes the association 10k for making expenditures without board authorization. Assuming they have the checkbook and signing authority on the account, I would remove that post haste and make sure the treasurer or president is signing all checks going forward.

I live in a townhouse complex and the homeowners are responsible for everything within their unit, including heating/air conditioning elements and water heaters. When it comes to water damage, we've always said that if homeowner negligence or abuse leads to damage to the common area, they're responsible for the association's deductible. In fact, we remind the homeowners of this every year when we send out our budget for the upcoming year - it also includes a flyer on water damage from frozen pipes that burst and that extends to toilets, faucets, etc.

It seems to me that unless your management company can show you in writing where the association is responsible, they owe you $10K. I'd also start looking for another management company and this time, make sure they don't have that type of access to the association's checking account. And check with your insurance carrier - they write the master policy based on the association documents, so if the policy isn't covering water heaters or other stuff within the unit, that's your answer.

The insurance carrier can also help you with providing homeowners with tips on how to maintain their water heaters so this type of thing doesn't happen - perhaps starting with checking how old the heater is. Maybe old age has been partially responsible for the heaters going kaboom and homeowners just need to bite the bullet and start shopping around for a good model and serviceman

"Water Heaters"

Why would one wish to heat hot water ?

on a serious note:

sounds like the T-PRV piping needs to be brought to code

too often it merely ends above the drip pan, which can NOT handle the flow of a fully opened relief

It is critical that discharge pipes meet the following requirements, which can be found in InterNACHI’s Water Heater Discharge Piping mini-course, at www.nachi.org/education. A discharge pipe should:

1.be constructed of an approved material, such as CPVC, copper, polyethylene, galvanized steel, polypropylene, or stainless steel. PVC and other non-approved plastics should not be used since they can easily melt.
2.not be smaller than the diameter of the outlet of the valve it serves (usually no smaller than 3/4").
3.not reduce in size from the valve to the air gap (point of discharge).
4.be as short and as straight as possible so as to avoid undue stress on the valve.
5.be installed so as to drain by flow of gravity.
6.not be trapped, since standing water may become contaminated and backflow into the potable water.
7.discharge to a floor drain, to an indirect waste receptor, or to the outdoors.
8.not be directly connected to the drainage system to prevent backflow of potentially contaminating the potable water.
9.discharge through a visible air gap in the same room as the water-heating appliance.
10.be first piped to an indirect waste receptor such as a bucket through an air gap located in a heated area when discharging to the outdoors in areas subject to freezing, since freezing water could block the pipe.
11.not terminate more than 6 inches (152 mm) above the floor or waste receptor.
12.discharge in a manner that could not cause scalding.
13.discharge in a manner that could not cause structural or property damage.
14.discharge to a termination point that is readily observable by occupants, because discharge indicates that something is wrong, and to prevent unobserved termination capping.
15.be piped independently of other equipment drains, water heater pans, or relief valve discharge piping to the point of discharge.
16.not have valves anywhere.
17.not have tee fittings.
18.not have a threaded connection at the end of the pipe so as to avoid capping.

So one could increase the temperature of the water enough to boil the egg they laid.

Hot water tanks are so 19th century technology. have you considered going tankless?

I owned a mobile home and the tank went out, I had a mess that soaked the carpet in the bedrooom adjacent to the hot water cabinet. The current code requires earthquake straps and a drip pan. I went one step further and waterproofed the cubby hole with a drain for both the drip pan and the nook where the hot water tank.

Personally I would with tankless technology I would install the Rennai tankless system that Paul Harvey used to endorse.

What say you PITA??

Yes, Richard. Our boilers are on the roofs of our twin towers. They and the pipes from them are not in any individual condo and are common area components. Can't get what your point is--if any.

..... and don't call ME Surely !

(the movie Airplane)

UM!! Yes because of gravity..

oh crap, forgot I was retired

Thanks for the education - I'd heard of tankless heaters and wondered if I should get one, but didn't know if there were electric ones (I have an all electric townhouse) It would appear I will have to continue with what I have.....

On a related note, I've also seen water heaters made of some heavy duty plastic and have been told these are better because they don't corrode like the usual types (I've replaced two for that reason) - what do you think of those?

Rheem comes to mind - lifetime warranty - $1300 equipment alone - really odd sized.

There ARE stainless steel commercial type heaters available.

For the 'typical' consumer I recommend:

Any name brand with a twelve year tank warranty.

If you can afford: a s/s tank (will not corrode or rupture)

NOT from a big box store.

Installation is MUCH more important than the heater itself.

A leak at a water heater should NOT, repeat NOT, cause any significant damage IF PROPERLY INSTALLED.

There MUST be a floor drain in the heater's 'installation space' or the design/install does NOT meet manufacturer's specifications.

The T-PRV 'should' be piped 6" above a floor drain or to the building exterior.

etc. etc. etc.

The typical condo is a disaster waiting for a time to occur.

BEST OF LUCK

ps. the first thing I did when I purchased my last home was relocate the heater to the garage

ps. to Kerry,

the links are merely to pictures - no time other than a click and a look required

And what does this have to do with the OP's situation???????

No actually I asked if you had boilers (extra large water heaters and maintained by the HOA), there is a difference.

Like you, sometimes I don't have time to read ALL the responses.

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