Fence Application Delay

SuhN (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Hello,

We were hoping to set up a fence to enjoy the nice weather in Florida this time of the year. We submitted a fence application to the HOA as soon as it started to feel nice and we made sure to follow their rules exactly to avoid delays.

HOA email contact informed me that the board has up to 45 days to make a decision. Which I found too much time for simply making a decision, especially when I still have to get county permit, and wait for vendor to order parts and finally schedule time for installation. It will be hot and humid again by then. I may have started the process late, but even county permit takes only 3 weeks on average. Sorry for venting but it might be useful for me to hear an HOA board member's perspective here as I do not know exactly why a decision require all that time? Is that normal?

Anyway here is my question, we patiently waited for 45 days and we have not received their decision yet. The HOA is now ignoring my emails and I do not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Is my next step to file a complaint? How and where do I do that?

Thanks

GinaF1 (Florida)
Posts: 7

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SuhN on 12/02/2017 7:20 AM
Hello,

We were hoping to set up a fence to enjoy the nice weather in Florida this time of the year. We submitted a fence application to the HOA as soon as it started to feel nice and we made sure to follow their rules exactly to avoid delays.

HOA email contact informed me that the board has up to 45 days to make a decision. Which I found too much time for simply making a decision, especially when I still have to get county permit, and wait for vendor to order parts and finally schedule time for installation. It will be hot and humid again by then. I may have started the process late, but even county permit takes only 3 weeks on average. Sorry for venting but it might be useful for me to hear an HOA board member's perspective here as I do not know exactly why a decision require all that time? Is that normal?

Anyway here is my question, we patiently waited for 45 days and we have not received their decision yet. The HOA is now ignoring my emails and I do not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Is my next step to file a complaint? How and where do I do that?

Thanks

45 days for an ACB approval or denial is not unreasonable. Because this person's in charge of making this decision have to do it in an open meeting. To be respectful of the volunteer's time you should respect they probably don't want to meet but once a month.

However, since you don't have the perspective to be cognitive of your neighbors time, I should not assume you would respect mine or others on this forum..

You would like to know if you should file a complaint??? With who???? To compel the HOA to move forward, hire an attorney and file suit.

What does your docs, not email, say about timeframe on ACB request? I saw one HOA say in docs... "30 days and after that and no answer it's deemed approved." You might want to look.

Also look at Florida statue 720.. entire chapter. This will help you in more ways than one and will save yours and my time in the future.

SuhN (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GinaF1 on 12/02/2017 4:06 PM

Posted By SuhN on 12/02/2017 7:20 AM
Hello,

We were hoping to set up a fence to enjoy the nice weather in Florida this time of the year. We submitted a fence application to the HOA as soon as it started to feel nice and we made sure to follow their rules exactly to avoid delays.

HOA email contact informed me that the board has up to 45 days to make a decision. Which I found too much time for simply making a decision, especially when I still have to get county permit, and wait for vendor to order parts and finally schedule time for installation. It will be hot and humid again by then. I may have started the process late, but even county permit takes only 3 weeks on average. Sorry for venting but it might be useful for me to hear an HOA board member's perspective here as I do not know exactly why a decision require all that time? Is that normal?

Anyway here is my question, we patiently waited for 45 days and we have not received their decision yet. The HOA is now ignoring my emails and I do not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Is my next step to file a complaint? How and where do I do that?

Thanks

45 days for an ACB approval or denial is not unreasonable. Because this person's in charge of making this decision have to do it in an open meeting. To be respectful of the volunteer's time you should respect they probably don't want to meet but once a month.

However, since you don't have the perspective to be cognitive of your neighbors time, I should not assume you would respect mine or others on this forum..

You would like to know if you should file a complaint??? With who???? To compel the HOA to move forward, hire an attorney and file suit.

What does your docs, not email, say about timeframe on ACB request? I saw one HOA say in docs... "30 days and after that and no answer it's deemed approved." You might want to look.

Also look at Florida statue 720.. entire chapter. This will help you in more ways than one and will save yours and my time in the future.

First of all - what the *** is wrong with you? Calm down please. No body is wasting your time, I did not put a gun on you to answer.

Secondly - the HOA is still being run by management company, not a neighbor.

Thirdly - If neighbors values their precious time so much, don't the *** volunteer, a volunteering neighbor must have the "the perspective to be cognitive of" his/her neigbors as well. F** 45 days to say nay or nay?

Lastly - Calm the *** down, it is people like you why HOAs have such a messed up reputation.

SuhN (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GinaF1 on 12/02/2017 4:06 PM

Posted By SuhN on 12/02/2017 7:20 AM
Hello,

We were hoping to set up a fence to enjoy the nice weather in Florida this time of the year. We submitted a fence application to the HOA as soon as it started to feel nice and we made sure to follow their rules exactly to avoid delays.

HOA email contact informed me that the board has up to 45 days to make a decision. Which I found too much time for simply making a decision, especially when I still have to get county permit, and wait for vendor to order parts and finally schedule time for installation. It will be hot and humid again by then. I may have started the process late, but even county permit takes only 3 weeks on average. Sorry for venting but it might be useful for me to hear an HOA board member's perspective here as I do not know exactly why a decision require all that time? Is that normal?

Anyway here is my question, we patiently waited for 45 days and we have not received their decision yet. The HOA is now ignoring my emails and I do not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Is my next step to file a complaint? How and where do I do that?

Thanks

45 days for an ACB approval or denial is not unreasonable. Because this person's in charge of making this decision have to do it in an open meeting. To be respectful of the volunteer's time you should respect they probably don't want to meet but once a month.

However, since you don't have the perspective to be cognitive of your neighbors time, I should not assume you would respect mine or others on this forum..

You would like to know if you should file a complaint??? With who???? To compel the HOA to move forward, hire an attorney and file suit.

What does your docs, not email, say about timeframe on ACB request? I saw one HOA say in docs... "30 days and after that and no answer it's deemed approved." You might want to look.

Also look at Florida statue 720.. entire chapter. This will help you in more ways than one and will save yours and my time in the future.

First of all - what the *** is wrong with you? Calm down please. No body is wasting your time, I did not put a gun on you to answer.

Secondly - the HOA is still being run by management company, not a neighbor.

Thirdly - If neighbors values their precious time so much, don't the *** volunteer, a volunteering neighbor must have the "the perspective to be cognitive of" his/her neigbors as well. F** 45 days to say nay or nay?

Lastly - Calm the *** down, it is people like you why HOAs have such a messed up reputation.

PaininyourA
Posts: 215

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SuhN on 12/02/2017 7:20 AM
Hello,

We were hoping to set up a fence to enjoy the nice weather in Florida this time of the year. We submitted a fence application to the HOA as soon as it started to feel nice and we made sure to follow their rules exactly to avoid delays.

HOA email contact informed me that the board has up to 45 days to make a decision. Which I found too much time for simply making a decision, especially when I still have to get county permit, and wait for vendor to order parts and finally schedule time for installation. It will be hot and humid again by then. I may have started the process late, but even county permit takes only 3 weeks on average. Sorry for venting but it might be useful for me to hear an HOA board member's perspective here as I do not know exactly why a decision require all that time? Is that normal?

Anyway here is my question, we patiently waited for 45 days and we have not received their decision yet. The HOA is now ignoring my emails and I do not see any light at the end of the tunnel. Is my next step to file a complaint? How and where do I do that?

Thanks

NO

Your next step is to READ your Covenants and Restrictions and file the application by Certified Mail to document EVERYTHING.

In the CCRs there is (probably) a procedure for said applications.

NOT verbal.

NOT email.

PAPER TRAIL

(you tried it 'nicely', now file it officially)

ps. if you can not enjoy your home w/o the fence why did you purchase ?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

I agree with Pain.

I also agree with Gina that 45 days is not unreasonable for a reply. Ours is 30 days and I've seen many time on this forum anywhere form 30 - 60 days. Just one reason is that Committees or boars often meet only once a month.

I do not agree, however, with Gina's unnecessarily unfriendly and unhelpful reply..

ArtL1 (Florida)
Posts: 140

Posted:

Check your covenants...they probably specify how much time your ACB has to act on submissions. The question then becomes, what happens when the ACB fails to act in the time permitted? i.e. my HOA's restrictions say the ACB will act on submissions within 45 days. They don't say what happens after 45 days with no answer, and I don't see that FS 720 does either.

I'd be inclined to say that if your docs specify 45 days, and its been more than that, and the management company hasn't asked for additional information from you (i.e. more specifics about placement, materials, etc.), then by default, your application is accepted/permitted. Your board/management company may feel differently, and is this a fight you want to get into? Have you tried simply calling the management company?

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

45 days is not unreasonable at all. Having said that, check your documents because many will contain a clause that says, in effect, if you don't get an answer in X days then the request is deemed approved. Check carefully, however, because some say if you don't get an answer in X days then the request is DENIED. You want to be sure which one. Also be ready to discover there may be no such clause at all.

In any case, I think GinaF7's out of line with the tone of her comments. Berating someone for not being respectful of someone else's time is a little harsh. Scolding someone for not knowing about how HOAs are regulated in Florida with respect to "filing a complaint" is also uncalled for. Having said that, there ARE no HOA police in Florida and compelling an HOA to do anything does usually require hiring an attorney and going through mediation and, if that doesn't work, filing a lawsuit and going to court.

Nobody learned all this stuff in a day and I think jumping all over someone who doesn't know what's what is a bad look.

SuhN (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Thanks everyone for your insightful replies and tips! I'm going to make my applications more official next time using Certified Mail and with paper trail and spend time familiarizing myself with CC&R and HOA rules.

And thanks GenoS and KerryL1 for understanding my perspective, I'm indeed first-time homeowner and has been in this community for only 7 months. I came to this forum with an open-mind trying to understand the HOA side perspective and why they might require all that time.

Anyway, I've spent the weekend searching through my county public records to find the CC&R documents and was able to found them. They state that board has 30 days to decide or they are deemed approved in line with what you have said, but not in line with the period given by HOA (45 days).

It's all moot now as I have recieved the approval just this morning

ps. if you can not enjoy your home w/o the fence why did you purchase ?

We do enjoy the home a lot. It's the weather that we would like to enjoy this time of the year in the backyard and we think privacy fence would make it more enjoyable.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SuhN on 12/04/2017 10:06 AM

Anyway, I've spent the weekend searching through my county public records to find the CC&R documents and was able to found them. They state that board has 30 days to decide or they are deemed approved in line with what you have said, but not in line with the period given by HOA (45 days).

Since they acknowledged receiving the plans (keep that letter/email).

Send a letter to them that according to the covenants, cite passage (Article x section y), the Association has 30 days to approve/disapprove or such requests are determined to be approved as submitted. Explain that your understanding is that other governing documents or policies may not conflict with the covenants. However, in an effort to be reasonable, you will look forward to a decision by mm/dd/yyyy (give it a week or so past the 30 days).

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Congrats on the approval, Suh!

BenA2 (Texas)
Posts: 1,273

Posted:

I didn't see anything wrong with the question. 45 days is ridiculous but I understand if that is the rule. Our rule is 30 days but we average about 3 days to approve things. If they have to have a meeting to approve something (not sure why anyone would do that in 2017) they should have meetings more often. The board, architecture review, and management ALL work for the members. As a volunteer, I am not going to drop everything to approve a fence in 24 hours but I also realize that volunteering means making a commitment.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By BenA2 on 12/06/2017 4:36 PM
I didn't see anything wrong with the question. 45 days is ridiculous but I understand if that is the rule. Our rule is 30 days but we average about 3 days to approve things. If they have to have a meeting to approve something (not sure why anyone would do that in 2017) they should have meetings more often. The board, architecture review, and management ALL work for the members. As a volunteer, I am not going to drop everything to approve a fence in 24 hours but I also realize that volunteering means making a commitment.

A meeting is required since FS 720.303(2)(a) deals with open board meetings and says:

"The provisions of this subsection shall also apply to the meetings of ... any body vested with the power to approve or disapprove architectural decisions with respect to a specific parcel of residential property owned by a member of the community."

Our documents do not impose a specific timeframe for making architectural change decisions. The architectural control committee doesn't meet every month and, depending on people's travel and vacation schedules, they can go 3 months without a meeting. After that, it's still up to the board to decide on whether to approve the committee's recommendation. That can add additional time to processing the request.

If the timing is just right, you could get approval from my HOA in as little as 3 weeks. But if the meeting schedules are out of sync then 2 months is not unheard of and a couple of years ago someone submitted an arch change request in May that was not finally decided upon until September.

A guaranteed 45-day response time is quick in my opinion. Not every HOA is blessed with an efficient decision-making process. Especially the self-managed ones (including mine).