Can we get some compensation if COA ban pool passes?

Started by TimL3 • 22 replies • 1029 views

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TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

A very useful topic Md. court: Condo groups can’t bar privileges for non-payment. http://thedailyrecord.com/2017/06/26/court-of-appeals-condominium-association-fees/ But COA didn't obey the law and our community by-law, still banned my pool pass for last two years and denied my negotiation. If I sue them, can I get some compensation? Or just release the pool pass later? Thanks

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Your of "unclean hands" here. Have you NOT been paying your dues? If so, the HOA can counter-sue you for all that or even foreclose. Plus consider the ramifications of filing a suit. It effects lending rates and lending packages. Plus everyone repeat after me "Suing your HOA is suing yourself and your neighbors".

Former HOA President

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

I never owe my regular HOA fee. COA sent an unqualified plumber to fix my toilet ring wax since fireman already stopped emergency situation. Plumber worked 30 min, but charged 3 hours included trip and still leaking 2 weeks. I tried to negotiate with them, but COA manager replied " I do not provide Board members phone numbers or email". I checked our community web page that it didn't show any contact information too. It seems they hided intentionally. As board members, can they hide their information? Do you think it's illegal? This is why this case delayed for 2 years.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

What is illegal about that? COA is a sub-contractor to the HOA. They aren't supposed to give the personal information of the board members out. The board is a separate entity. Your best to go by your HOA's rules of communication. Which may be meeting or they may put out POC information. Each HOA is different.

Again you keep on about the emergency plumbing repair. Please get over it. It's done already. No need to get "revenge". It's just making you look bad. Paying any money you owe the HOA besides dues is part of the whole "In good standing". You still have to pay special assessments even if you pay dues.

If this was an extra fee and option to have a pool pass, then I may see a violation. However, if pool pass is part of your dues, then no way.

Former HOA President

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

Everyone received HOA budget letter each year and read it. Our community HOA fee increased double in past few years. One of reasons is for much costs to repair pool, the board president owns a pool repairing company. It means much HOA fee paid to board president. Who is "unclean hand"?

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

NO. It means the HOA paid the company the President owns to do the repairs. They could do that with any other company too. Your just want to pick a bone with the president. From my own pool experience... It is always increasing in expense/repairs every year. So don't find that too unusual.

Former HOA President

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

In our community by-law, it wrote clearly that it doesn't allow junk car in our community parking lots. But Board president junk car parked in our community parking lots for many years. Someone attended the board meeting to complain, but Board president denied. It's not revenge at all. Everyone should obey the law. No one is above the law.

PaininyourA
Posts: 215

Posted:

No 'law' involved.

Contract violation is NOT a 'crime'.

There are laws governing contracts, but they are civil laws NOT criminal laws.

Your only redress of a contract violation is via the court system.

good luck

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

Who can compete with Board president's own pool repairing company and other relational service companies? He can choose own business company and denied others to make money. It's his making money way, who can block this way? It seems "unclean hands" former board president helps and supports "unclean hands" other board president(s). But some people and attorneys don't agree your points. This is why let more people come here to discuss and learn to improve. Maybe some people can get some help from here or look for a fair right later.

It's not picking a bone, not revenge at all. It seems you support Board president to against law without punish as you were former Board president. Please remember NO ONE IS ABOVE THE LAW!

PaininyourA
Posts: 215

Posted:

correct

soooo take them to court and petition for an order of specific performance/compliance

'they' will argue that they WERE in compliance

you may pay ALL the legal costs if you lose

spend your $$$$$$$

OR

live your life - pay for the plumber - be happy

OR

send the meter spinning

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

Nobody says this case is a crime. It's a civil case. We can appeal the Board’s illegal activity to the Montgomery County Commission on Common Ownership Communities (CCOC) in Maryland.

TimL3 (Maryland)
Posts: 18

Posted:

I want to sue, but want to know can we get some compensation if COA ban pool passes or just release it later. If I win, how much compensation I can get exclude attorney fee?

PaininyourA
Posts: 215

Posted:

ask the attorney

not

the internet 'experts'

PaininyourA
Posts: 215

Posted:

100%

I'm out.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

The court system ONLY makes you "Whole". Your "win" equals as much money you put in to include attorney fees. Which attorney fees are never a guarantee to recoup. If the case is found to be frivolous, the HOA can make you pay their legal costs. It's called "DAMAGES".

So how much money? Depends on how much you put into the COA pool pass and the legal costs to sue. The effect of suing? It increases your dues, loan rates, and/or loan package offerings. Plus suing your HOA is suing yourself and your neighbors. So any special assessment required to pay your "Award" you still have to pay too. Congrats! Now everyone hates you.

Former HOA President

CarlJ2 (Texas)
Posts: 194

Posted:

It's part of the overall issues with HOAs. Dealing with them in the courts is not unlike chemotherapy. You have to hurt yourself while getting rid of the disease.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

And yet if you decide to sell, your no longer a member of the HOA. Then your lawsuit goes to pot... So your not just hurting yourself but everyone around yourself... then you still have to live there...

Former HOA President

CarlJ2 (Texas)
Posts: 194

Posted:

That is part of the issue with the HOA construct more generally.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CarlJ2 on 10/27/2017 4:08 PM
It's part of the overall issues with HOAs. Dealing with them in the courts is not unlike chemotherapy. You have to hurt yourself while getting rid of the disease.

Sad ... but true. In my last HOA we tried everything to avoid a lawsuit and attorney fees. What peeved us towards the end is we had been forced to sue potential criminals violating criminal laws. You would think attorneys would have figured that out in the beginning.

When you ask how much you could receive in a lawsuit ... probably not much if only regarding pool pass issue, but you need to ask an attorney. We are not attorneys and can only go by our past experiences and public information.

Personally ... I agree with some States which allow banning of pool privileges when assessments are not paid. After all ... why should someone not paying their current fair share of the pool maintenance and other costs be utilizing said amenities? If they want to utilize then they need to pay their fair share of costs.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

In CA, the withholding of privileges must fit the alleged violation. Refusing to pay assessments, certainly fits with denials of common area privileges.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

First of all, it isn't necessarily true that condos can't suspend privileges for non-payment of dues. There are 50 stays and your citation is for ONE state - in my state you can suspend privileges if that's written in the bylaws.

As for your emergency toilet repair, which you've discussed in another post, you're learning the hard way that rules violations, paying regular assessments, approval of exterior change requests and other assorted HOA issues tend to be separate issues. Your appealing a rules violations for example is ok, but you still have to pay regular assessments because you're legally obligated to do so. If your documents state you lose pool access if you don't pay regular assessments, you don't get to swim until that's fixed. You may not like it, but that's what you signed up for.

And no, you won't get compensation for not having access to the pool.

I seem to recall you've consulted an attorney about this toilet repair business, so let the man or woman do his/her job and let a judge decide how this plays out. And next time, take the time to go over to your home and find out for yourself what's happening as far as emergencies are concerned - the problem here (which you still don't seem to want to admit to) is that you made a lot of assumptions and now have to pay the price. Pay your fees in the meantime because right now you're risking paying assessments, late fees, the association's legal expenses in going after you for delinquent fees, your own attorney fees - and the toilet repairs.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

CjC
Posts: 210

Posted:

It is interesting that in our HOA docs, it specifically says that poll passes are valued at $20. We do NOT sell pool access to anyone outside of the HOA.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SheliaH on 10/29/2017 6:00 AM
First of all, it isn't necessarily true that condos can't suspend privileges for non-payment of dues. There are 50 stays and your citation is for ONE state - in my state you can suspend privileges if that's written in the bylaws.

As for your emergency toilet repair, which you've discussed in another post, you're learning the hard way that rules violations, paying regular assessments, approval of exterior change requests and other assorted HOA issues tend to be separate issues. Your appealing a rules violations for example is ok, but you still have to pay regular assessments because you're legally obligated to do so. If your documents state you lose pool access if you don't pay regular assessments, you don't get to swim until that's fixed. You may not like it, but that's what you signed up for.

And no, you won't get compensation for not having access to the pool.

I seem to recall you've consulted an attorney about this toilet repair business, so let the man or woman do his/her job and let a judge decide how this plays out. And next time, take the time to go over to your home and find out for yourself what's happening as far as emergencies are concerned - the problem here (which you still don't seem to want to admit to) is that you made a lot of assumptions and now have to pay the price. Pay your fees in the meantime because right now you're risking paying assessments, late fees, the association's legal expenses in going after you for delinquent fees, your own attorney fees - and the toilet repairs.

Sound advice.

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