Where to begin ?

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Greetings All,
Being new to the site please excuse the rambling. I'm the current secretary (elected 2007) of an inactive 49 member HOA in York County, South Carolina. We are the extension of the builders CC&R documents that he transferred to us as an HOA around 10/1991. Which included the transfer of our now community property. Our By Laws were passed in 1997 although were not recorded until 7/2017. We were incorporated around 9/1998, which is in good standing as of 7/2017 with the state of SC. We have community property. We have not had a meeting, collected dues or paid any bills, not filed a return or made an annual report for the past 10 years that I have been able to fine record of. To say the least we are inactive and very slack. The tax's for the common space as well as community security lighting has all been keep current by our current president (elected 2007).

Due to some recent conflict between several new home owners the HOA has been stirred up a little with a request to become involved with the conflict.

The questions have become: Is this inactive HOA invalid, or dissolved? Does it require a majority vote to become active again? Can it be dissolved with a YES / NO vote of the majority? What filings are required to get correct again? And what steps are required to dissolve the HOA completely as some think it is past its usefulness.

Any thoughts or directions to take as WOW my head really hurts.

Best Regards
Doug

LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679

Posted:

All questions that only an attorney should answer.

PainintheA
Posts: 43

Posted:

ditto

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Doug

Active or inactive is an issue for you, but to many HOA's get involved in conflicts between neighbors that they should not be involved in. What is the conflict between neighbors?

DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046

Posted:

I agree that talking to a lawyer would be best. An inactive association is not necessarily invalid or dissolved. The association is created by the CCRs/Covenants/Deed restrictions and those don't change just because owners let the HOA become inactive. Dissolving the association generally means changing the CCRs and typically requires more than a majority vote. This is not likely to be a DIY project.

Since resurrecting an inactive association is also likely to open up a hornet's nest of people who are happy with it being inactive, getting legal help is a good idea there too.

As John mentioned, the governing documents should outline the responsibilities of the association, sometimes people will try to involve the association in things that it is not responsible for, don't get sucked into that.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DouglasK1 on 09/18/2017 6:05 PM
Since resurrecting an inactive association is also likely to open up a hornet's nest of people who are happy with it being inactive, getting legal help is a good idea there too.

It's truly amazing how unanticipated opposition to some things that seem simple can materialize out of the woodwork. Some situations can seem bad because they are, in fact, bad. But there's always bound to be someone who likes it that way.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DougO1 on 09/18/2017 11:19 AM
Greetings All,
Being new to the site please excuse the rambling. I'm the current secretary (elected 2007) of an inactive 49 member HOA in York County, South Carolina. What makes you inactive??? Per your later statement your incorporation was in good standing as of 7/2017 and was potentially renewed.We are the extension of the builders CC&R documents that he transferred to us as an HOA around 10/1991. Which included the transfer of our now community property. Our By Laws were passed in 1997 although were not recorded until 7/2017. We were incorporated around 9/1998, which is in good standing as of 7/2017 with the state of SC. We have community property. What does you community property consist of and if how has any items with regard to this property been paid for??? We have not had a meeting, collected dues or paid any bills, not filed a return or made an annual report for the past 10 years that I have been able to fine record of. To say the least we are inactive and very slack. The tax's for the common space as well as community security lighting has all been keep current by our current president (elected 2007). Are you stating that ONE individual has been paying he bills which should have been shared by ALL???

Due to some recent conflict between several new home owners the HOA has been stirred up a little with a request to become involved with the conflict.

The questions have become: Is this inactive HOA invalid, or dissolved? This can be answered by the document filed with your local County Records. All you potentially need to do is look at your County Records OR your Titile Insurance documents to see what has been attached to your property titles.Does it require a majority vote to become active again? Potentially ... NOPE ... All it takes is a squeaky wheel. Potentially a homeowner who would want documents attached to their Property Title followed as agreed to when they purchased and signed.Can it be dissolved with a YES / NO vote of the majority? Depends on your State Laws. Potentially as you have noted you have common area expenses which has been born by ONE individual vs. being divided by all others responsible. If you disolve who is going to in future pay for you taxes and security lighting??? You have been lucky so far, but if that individual sells their home ... do you think someone else is going to pay bills they potentially are not responsible for?What filings are required to get correct again? And what steps are required to dissolve the HOA completely as some think it is past its usefulness.

Any thoughts or directions to take as WOW my head really hurts.

Best Regards
Doug

DaveD3 (Michigan)
Posts: 796

Posted:

Have your deed restrictions/CC&Rs/whatever expired? If no, they are still valid

That you are in good standing with the state suggests that your HOA is NOT inactive. Complacent, perhaps. Lacks enthusiasm, sure. Lacks enforcement, sounds like it.

Can a simple majority vote eliminate the deed restrictions? Unlikely, but that's a question for the local municipality, AND is probably mentioned in those documents.

The bigger question is if the deed restrictions are enforceable at this point. For example, do you have a restriction against outbuildings, but dozens of people built them without issue over the past 20 years? May be tough to enforce that restriction. Figuring that side of things out will require legal advice.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

The conflict is regarding one new home owner who after moving in added a dog raising project with a fully fenced in yard. The dogs cause lots of noise and run the fence when the other neighbor is working in their yard or the dogs run the fence barking at anyone walking by on the street. Although the neighbor with the dogs kennels them in their garage during the night so as not to impact the county noise rules. The offended neighbor has tried to reach a compromise with the dog neighbor but has met with a " Talk to the Hand " response.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Hi JanetB2, Regarding your questions which I thank you for:

I do not know what makes our HOA inactive if it is. I just hear neighbors use that term a lot.

The community property consist of a 1.5 acre pond that is for fishing, no boating or swimming.

The large stone sign at the entrance of the neighborhood. It is located on the corner of a homeowners lot and they have been paid on a yearly lease basis for the location as well as the sign lighting which comes from the homeowners house.

A power company, pole mounted security light at the entrance to the development which the HOA is billed for on a monthly basis.

I am saying that all of the bills of the HOA have been paid by ONE individual, Our last BOD president.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Hi DaveD3, Yes we have 6 homeowners who have added fences to their lots in violation of the CC&R no fence rule. We have one homeowner who as constructed a large shop/storage building which is not in keeping with the CC&R requirements that the building be styled similar to the homeowners main house with regards to roof pitch, building color, roof materials. The basic aesthetic balance if you would. In addition there are several home owners who have more than one out building, "Home Depot" slide of the trailer type. The CC&R says only one and yes the time line is over at least 10 years to date. The only real complaint to date is the dog issue which of course adds the fence and now fences to the pile.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Greetings All, I just wanted to say Thank You All for responding to my plight. It is very helpful to have others that can help in the thought process. And help focus the correct direction to take. Please continue.
Doug

DaveD3 (Michigan)
Posts: 796

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:52 AM
Hi JanetB2, Regarding your questions which I thank you for:

I do not know what makes our HOA inactive if it is. I just hear neighbors use that term a lot.

The community property consist of a 1.5 acre pond that is for fishing, no boating or swimming.

The large stone sign at the entrance of the neighborhood. It is located on the corner of a homeowners lot and they have been paid on a yearly lease basis for the location as well as the sign lighting which comes from the homeowners house.

A power company, pole mounted security light at the entrance to the development which the HOA is billed for on a monthly basis.

I am saying that all of the bills of the HOA have been paid by ONE individual, Our last BOD president.

This one individual is PERSONALLY paying for HOA expenses from his own pocket?

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DaveD3 on 09/19/2017 10:39 AM
This one individual is PERSONALLY paying for HOA expenses from his own pocket?

We have 4 owners here doing that. The sprinkler system controls are scattered throughout the subdivision and powered by tying into individual homes. We reimburse $10 each year to those homeowners.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:52 AM
Hi JanetB2, Regarding your questions which I thank you for:

I do not know what makes our HOA inactive if it is. I just hear neighbors use that term a lot.

The community property consist of a 1.5 acre pond that is for fishing, no boating or swimming.

The large stone sign at the entrance of the neighborhood. It is located on the corner of a homeowners lot and they have been paid on a yearly lease basis for the location as well as the sign lighting which comes from the homeowners house.

A power company, pole mounted security light at the entrance to the development which the HOA is billed for on a monthly basis.

I am saying that all of the bills of the HOA have been paid by ONE individual, Our last BOD president.

Unfortunately those items will make it difficult or impossible to disband the HOA and the CCR's attached to everyone's property titles. You need to double check and make sure your HOA has proper insurance regarding the pond. If they do not any anyone ever gets hurt or worse, the HOA could potentially be sued and without insurance all owners could be liable for each percentage they own of the common area property. Just a heads up ...

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:34 AM
The conflict is regarding one new home owner who after moving in added a dog raising project with a fully fenced in yard. The dogs cause lots of noise and run the fence when the other neighbor is working in their yard or the dogs run the fence barking at anyone walking by on the street. Although the neighbor with the dogs kennels them in their garage during the night so as not to impact the county noise rules. The offended neighbor has tried to reach a compromise with the dog neighbor but has met with a " Talk to the Hand " response.

What do your CCR's or the Local Government allow regarding dogs??? I will admit I am more in favor of an HOA following the Local Government Ordinances vs. placing item in CCR's. This is because if they are in the CCR's then the HOA has potentially superseded the Local Government with regards to liability and enforcement. If you CCR's do not regulate then the homeowner who is having an issue needs to contact your Local Animal Control and report the problem.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DaveD3 on 09/19/2017 10:39 AM

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:52 AM
Hi JanetB2, Regarding your questions which I thank you for:

I do not know what makes our HOA inactive if it is. I just hear neighbors use that term a lot.

The community property consist of a 1.5 acre pond that is for fishing, no boating or swimming.

The large stone sign at the entrance of the neighborhood. It is located on the corner of a homeowners lot and they have been paid on a yearly lease basis for the location as well as the sign lighting which comes from the homeowners house.

A power company, pole mounted security light at the entrance to the development which the HOA is billed for on a monthly basis.

I am saying that all of the bills of the HOA have been paid by ONE individual, Our last BOD president.

This one individual is PERSONALLY paying for HOA expenses from his own pocket?

Yes he is PERSONALLY paying for the HOA expenses.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

I am scheduling a meeting with my lawyer for next week if I can get in his office then. He also does work for HOA's. This is a good first step I just hope it doesn't break the bank. Once again Thank All of You for your inputs and comments. This is a great help.
Doug

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JanetB2 on 09/19/2017 8:42 PM

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:34 AM
The conflict is regarding one new home owner who after moving in added a dog raising project with a fully fenced in yard. The dogs cause lots of noise and run the fence when the other neighbor is working in their yard or the dogs run the fence barking at anyone walking by on the street. Although the neighbor with the dogs kennels them in their garage during the night so as not to impact the county noise rules. The offended neighbor has tried to reach a compromise with the dog neighbor but has met with a " Talk to the Hand " response.

What do your CCR's or the Local Government allow regarding dogs??? I will admit I am more in favor of an HOA following the Local Government Ordinances vs. placing item in CCR's. This is because if they are in the CCR's then the HOA has potentially superseded the Local Government with regards to liability and enforcement. If you CCR's do not regulate then the homeowner who is having an issue needs to contact your Local Animal Control and report the problem.

our CC&R's 4.11 state:
No nuisance, or noxious, or offensive activity shall be conducted on any lot. Nor shall anything be done on any lot tending to cause discomfort or annoyance to the neighborhood. No plants, animals, machines, or devices of any kind whose normal activity or existence is dangerous, unsightly, unsanitary, or unpleasant shall be maintained on any lot. All animals owned by a lot owner or kept upon a lot, shall be so confined or restrained as not to go beyond the boundaries of such lot.

Our county ordinances are being looked into at this time for clarity.

DougO1 (South Carolina)
Posts: 9

Posted:

After meeting with the county zoning commission they related that our development is zoned RC-1 and does not allow dog breeding, The ordinance on noise covers the barking issue, The fence problem is in the hands of the HOA to resolve. My Thanks to everyone who helped give me direction and insite.
Regards
Doug

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By DougO1 on 09/20/2017 4:27 AM

Posted By JanetB2 on 09/19/2017 8:42 PM

Posted By DougO1 on 09/19/2017 5:34 AM
The conflict is regarding one new home owner who after moving in added a dog raising project with a fully fenced in yard. The dogs cause lots of noise and run the fence when the other neighbor is working in their yard or the dogs run the fence barking at anyone walking by on the street. Although the neighbor with the dogs kennels them in their garage during the night so as not to impact the county noise rules. The offended neighbor has tried to reach a compromise with the dog neighbor but has met with a " Talk to the Hand " response.

What do your CCR's or the Local Government allow regarding dogs??? I will admit I am more in favor of an HOA following the Local Government Ordinances vs. placing item in CCR's. This is because if they are in the CCR's then the HOA has potentially superseded the Local Government with regards to liability and enforcement. If you CCR's do not regulate then the homeowner who is having an issue needs to contact your Local Animal Control and report the problem.

our CC&R's 4.11 state:
No nuisance, or noxious, or offensive activity shall be conducted on any lot. Nor shall anything be done on any lot tending to cause discomfort or annoyance to the neighborhood. No plants, animals, machines, or devices of any kind whose normal activity or existence is dangerous, unsightly, unsanitary, or unpleasant shall be maintained on any lot. All animals owned by a lot owner or kept upon a lot, shall be so confined or restrained as not to go beyond the boundaries of such lot.

Our county ordinances are being looked into at this time for clarity.

Most City or County ordiances will limit the number of dogs. My local City allows 4 and my County allows 5. The exceptions are a little of puppies until the puppies are 8 weeks old. Puppies are generally weaned at 6 weeks and should have new homes by 8 weeks.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Darn no correction ... instead of "little" should be "litter" of puppies.