BOD ELECTION LOSS

Started by JohnC46 • 22 replies • 1163 views

💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

We had our Annual Meeting and BOD Election this evening. We had 3 open seats on a BOD of 5 with 4 running for the 3 seats. I was one of the candidates. We each had 3 minutes to amplify our views with one of the candidates not present.

I was candid in that I stated we needed several things. Better communications to our owners (all said that), a crack down on Covenant violations (one other said that), and a dues increase primarily directed to Reserves (no one else called for a dues increase).

Well, my candidness killed me. I finished 4th. The candidate not there, thus their views were not even expressed, beat me.

I did not like the outcome but I walked out with my head held high.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Good for you! Best held high than brown nosed in they say! Sorry for the loss but next time you will get it!

Former HOA President

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

JohnC46, sorry to hear that. What's the general level of knowledge in your association with regard to reserves? I fear that I will be in your shoes in a few months. Among the homeowners there is scant awareness of the situation with our reserves vs. the large maintenance projects that have been kicked down the road for a decade. Most homeowners are only too happy to put their heads in the sand and literally applaud every year when assessments go up by only $5 a month, an increase that doesn't even keep up with inflation. The homeowners have not a clue about what's required and the extent of neglect on some of these projects. Some outright question the need for reserves at all. Apathy here is in a race with ignorance and it looks like ignorance is winning.

I feel bad for you because I'll bet your financial plan was the only responsible one put forward among your candidates. I wish you luck. As for me, I know I'll be Public Enemy #1 around here before the end of the year since our reserves need at least a $50 per month increase to stave off a several hundred thousand dollar shortfall in 5-7 years' time. I plan to advocate for that during our budget planning over the next few months. I expect to be laughed out of the room. I'm unfortunately resigned to probably having to sell and move out before the special assessments become necessary.

Were people aware of what you planned to propose before you made your pitch at the meeting? Did anyone try to talk you out of making that proposal in your election-night statement?

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868

Posted:

John,

Not to take away from your loss, but how does one speech on the night of the election win any votes.

This is why I detest quorum for the election of directors. My job, as a candidate, is to get more votes than anyone else to get elected, NOT ensuring that the community reaches quorum, so maybe the ballot get opened.

Give me a level and fair playing field and I'll beat anyone. If I think I can help a community, I will do anything to get on the Board. I'll build a webpage, I'll email, I'll put out flyers, even put a slate of candidate together, and go door to to door to secure their vote.

Maybe the person who didn't show, was still out campaigning.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Richard

Until recently I had no intention of running. I did so at the urging of several neighbors. Granted I put no effort into it as it was not that important to me.

I was on the original transition BOD when we made some decisions that did not sit well with some. I was the first to confront naysayers and those that did not have their facts straight so needless to say, I have made some enemies.

I know the killer was Proxies. I was told we had quite a few and unless stated otherwise, they named the President of the BOD as their designated voter. I have locked horns with her several times including during the meeting, prior to voting. I was later told by the two running the election that she cast all her Proxy votes away from me.

I might be a bit disappointed, but it is not a major issue with me.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Geno

We are small patio homes. 40 or so side by side single story duplexes and 32 single family one and two story homes thus 72 structures.

The main reserve issue is some 15 years down the road and that is the HOA is responsible for roof replacement. The last reserve study (done by the Declarant and Builder) put this cost at about $650K spread over about 6 years thus about $100K per year.

At our present Reserve rate ($10K per year on a $65K budget) we will have about $250K come the first home needing to be done. This will get us about 2.5 years into a 6 year project or about a bit over 1/3rd of the 72 homes then we will basically be out of money.

I know some have said not to worry. Come that time we can assess each owner for their roof replacement. I say this will open one heck of a legal battle as it is clearly in the Covenants that the HOA is responsible.

I am 75 and one of the last homes built so it is probably some 20 years before my home would need roofing. Chances are I may well not be here and that is the issue. Many do not want to look down the road.

Will I see the problem come to fruition? Probably not. Maybe I should bury my head in the sand the same as as many others are doing.

SueW6 (Michigan)
Posts: 814

Posted:

John - keep attending the meetings and asking the right questions, especially about the Reserve Fund.

People don't like hearing that they might have to pay for repairs in the future - like they might not be around to enjoy the benefit. That's why a Reserve Fund is a hard sell..

AugustinD
Posts: 5,144

Posted:

Few people at my HOA understand that a one-time assessment of current owners (or a group of owners) for new roofs is inequitable. Prior owners enjoyed the roofs for many years and so should pay their share of this benefit. Professionals, like the staff of companies that do Reserve Studies, understand and preach that the cost of large capital assets has to be spread over years of owners and assessment payments.

Also the risk exists that, when a roof needs to be replaced, the current owners will not have a few thousand dollars lying around to pay for it. In John's HOA's case, and ignoring inflation, an owner would have to come up with around $9000 on the spot. Many owners would have to finance this.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868

Posted:

I should have added that in addition to despising quorum, it also includes the use of proxies, which in John's case, designated the President as the proxy holder.

Proxies were designed for corporations, which an HOA is, but they are really designed for the Bank of America's of the country which may have 500K or more shareholders. Do government entities allow proxies to be cast for any type of election? When comparing the two organizations, government or corporate, which organization closely resembles a HOA. If the Board at B of A decides to drastically change the terms of my credit card account, I am free to pay off my balance and choose among the hundreds of credit cards on the market today. If I happen to live in a 1200 unit complex and I don't like the idea of the Board raising my assessments 20% every year, creating a 5% special assessment every other year, fining me $500 for walking my 6 lb dog 10 feet on the lobby floor or fining me $1000.00 per night because I used my unit as a AirBnB for three nights while a special event was in town, what are my options. Run for the Board, that will never happen because for the past ten years, quorum hasn't been reached. Can't change the Bylaws because quorum can't be reached. Overturn the rules, can't happen, again quorum can't be reached. Pretty much SOL.

So taking John's case, the Board control the language of the proxy, who they may be directed to. If they are directed to have the Board make the decision on behalf of the owner, who the owners think know best and are always working for the benefit of the community.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

John, I know from past conversations here that your community is similar to mine in many respects. Mine is also responsible for the roofs of all buildings. We were in decent shape and on pace to replace all of them in another 10 years. That was the ONLY reserve account that was in good shape. We recently started hearing new estimates of 5 years away, which is a surprise, and one of the purposes of having reserve accounts is to prevent nasty surprises.

We've never had a reserve study done and now I'm starting to hear things similar to what you are:

We don't have to worry about that now.
Maybe we can do a few at a time.
We'll cross the special assessment bridge when we come to it.

It's quite discouraging. Hang in there. I really wish Florida required reserve studies every so often and mandate compliance with the statute for all HOAs regardless of when they were established. Keep plugging away at it and try to accululate some friendly allies. I know exactly what you're going through.

JerryD5 (Colorado)
Posts: 218

Posted:

John,

I would only add to the discussion that definitely keep involved. Perhaps, in the future and before the next election, a board member has to step down. Let the board know you are willing to serve if a vacancy comes up. You might get on the board that way.

AugustinD
Posts: 5,144

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JerryD5 on 08/23/2017 12:33 PM
John,

I would only add to the discussion that definitely keep involved. Perhaps, in the future and before the next election, a board member has to step down. Let the board know you are willing to serve if a vacancy comes up. You might get on the board that way.

Unless he has a board majority on the major issues, I think he would be wasting his time.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By AugustinD on 08/23/2017 2:08 PM

Unless he has a board majority on the major issues, I think he would be wasting his time.

This is true and with the fact that I am overall happy with the way our HOA runs, I see no advantage to me getting on the BOD.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Allow me to add. I do have the ear of two recently elected BOD Members. They do agree a dues increase is warranted so we will see how it plays out.

HomE (Washington)
Posts: 29

Posted:

Good for you. If you don't have good reserves and nobody wants to get there, I'd suggest moving. You had the right ideas. It's hard to get people to face reality sometimes.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

There is skulduggery about. Three of the 5 BOD Members (including the new President) have approached me and want me on the BOD. I have told them there are 3 ways for this to happen:

1. A Recall is mounted against a BOD Member (all elected) and I am named as their replacement. I have said no way. This is time consuming and prone to failure so let us forget this path.

2. We wait until next year when 2 BOD spots will be available and I run for one. I also reminded them they could could do the Proxy end run that was done on me. Proxies signed over to the outgoing President who did not cast one for me where as the new President will cast them for me,

3. An existing BOD Member resigns and I am appointed by the BOD to fill the vacancy. Two existing BOD Members will be approached on doing such. We believe one might just so.

Now the skulduggery. Although the Reserves are/were my main issue, the secondary and more immediate issue we have are Covenant violations such as landscaping, parking, trash barrels, etc. I suggested they appoint an ACC (now handled by the BOD) with me heading it and we go after the scofflaws. One of the blatant scofflaws was elected to the BOD. If the ACC goes after the BOD Member (and all others to be fair) with the landscaping violations, I believe they may just resign and pave the way for me to be appointed to the BOD.

I am mulling this whole thing over as I always have believed there is more then one way to skin a cat. Part of me says do it. Another part of me says just let it drop.

Your opinions and suggestions please.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HomE on 08/24/2017 6:07 PM
Good for you. If you don't have good reserves and nobody wants to get there, I'd suggest moving. You had the right ideas. It's hard to get people to face reality sometimes.

HomE

The reserve issue is far enough out that it will not affect me thus not sufficient cause for me to move. That said, it cannot be ignored.

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

Since you have the ARC concern anyway, JohnC, it seems time to have a Committee with you chairing it. As you know your background & experience, the HOA can get looking pretty bad in a short while if there's lax enforcement. And your community sound very nice!

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

John,

Sorry to hear that you were not elected.
You would be a good choice and it may take time for the membership to see that.
I will say that it took me over a year to explain to the members the need to properly fund the reserves.

You might offer your services to do a study for the Association.
It might not be as good as a professional one but it's better then no study at all.
Explain to the Board that it can't hurt to have one done.
Explain that there is no requirement to fund it but it will help the Board look to the future.

This way, you will be able to ensure that the study contains all the things you know it should.

Tim

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By TimB4 on 08/24/2017 7:01 PM
John,

Sorry to hear that you were not elected.
You would be a good choice and it may take time for the membership to see that.
I will say that it took me over a year to explain to the members the need to properly fund the reserves.

You might offer your services to do a study for the Association.
It might not be as good as a professional one but it's better then no study at all.
Explain to the Board that it can't hurt to have one done.
Explain that there is no requirement to fund it but it will help the Board look to the future.

This way, you will be able to ensure that the study contains all the things you know it should.

Tim

Funny thing you should mention the reserve. One of the things I had discussed was at least getting a quote from a roofer as to the cost to re-roof. We have been kicking around $5K per home so about $560K but it would not hurt to get a valid number. I do see this as a function of the ACC (Arch. Control Comm.)

I have not mentioned it before but not only is the HOA responsible for roofing, we are responsible for house siding which is brick on one side, vinyl on the other 3 sides. To clarify, the HOA is responsible for replacement due to normal wear and tear. Any other damage such as accidental, storm, etc. is on the owners dime/insurance. I have always prayed for a massive hail storm damaging the roofs so we can get them replaced under homeowners insurance.....LOL

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 08/24/2017 6:56 PM
Since you have the ARC concern anyway, JohnC, it seems time to have a Committee with you chairing it. As you know your background & experience, the HOA can get looking pretty bad in a short while if there's lax enforcement. And your community sound very nice!

Overall I would give us a solid 9 of 10 for our aesthetics. We have no glow in the dark problems. We do have a bunch of piddly stuff like some dead grass areas, rusting mail box posts, trash cans left out to long, parking overnight on the streets when banned, some improperly planted bushes, occasional overnight parking of boats/trailers mainly by 2 habitual offenders.

The past BOD (2 years since turnover) rarely went after offenders unless the violation was flagrant parking a car on the grass, boat in the driveway overnight, basketball hoop in the street, etc. This new BOD wants to change that.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 08/24/2017 6:45 PM
There is skulduggery about. Three of the 5 BOD Members (including the new President) have approached me and want me on the BOD. I have told them there are 3 ways for this to happen:

1. A Recall is mounted against a BOD Member (all elected) and I am named as their replacement. I have said no way. This is time consuming and prone to failure so let us forget this path.

2. We wait until next year when 2 BOD spots will be available and I run for one. I also reminded them they could could do the Proxy end run that was done on me. Proxies signed over to the outgoing President who did not cast one for me where as the new President will cast them for me,

3. An existing BOD Member resigns and I am appointed by the BOD to fill the vacancy. Two existing BOD Members will be approached on doing such. We believe one might just so.

Now the skulduggery. Although the Reserves are/were my main issue, the secondary and more immediate issue we have are Covenant violations such as landscaping, parking, trash barrels, etc. I suggested they appoint an ACC (now handled by the BOD) with me heading it and we go after the scofflaws. One of the blatant scofflaws was elected to the BOD. If the ACC goes after the BOD Member (and all others to be fair) with the landscaping violations, I believe they may just resign and pave the way for me to be appointed to the BOD.

I am mulling this whole thing over as I always have believed there is more then one way to skin a cat. Part of me says do it. Another part of me says just let it drop.

Your opinions and suggestions please.

Sad to hear you were not elected based on your awesome, up front, and honest question answers. Unfortunately with some people it takes getting hit with many thousands of dollars in a special assessment for them to "see the light". Keep in mind if the other BOD members can obtain a quorum for a recall it would be potentially to the benefit of the members to have you. If they want to take the time ... I say let them try. If they fail then that still leaves your options 2 or 3.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 08/25/2017 3:03 AM

Funny thing you should mention the reserve. One of the things I had discussed was at least getting a quote from a roofer as to the cost to re-roof.

When I did our first study, I found that most contractors were willing to assist with a quick ballpark figure. We were upfront that we were looking at reserves and promised that they would be included with any request for bids. Most took an hour and provided the information we sought.

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 08/25/2017 3:03 AM

I do see this as a function of the ACC (Arch. Control Comm.)

Actually, it takes whomever is in charge of maintenance and the treasurer working together to get a good study.

Quote:

Posted By JohnC46 on 08/25/2017 3:03 AM

To clarify, the HOA is responsible for replacement due to normal wear and tear. Any other damage such as accidental, storm, etc. is on the owners dime/insurance.

Interesting covenants.

I expect that this division is plainly stated within the covenants. Otherwise, it might not withstand a legal challenge. Normally if the Association is responsible, then the Association insurance would cover the damages.

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

✓ Ask follow-up questions
✓ Share your experience
✓ Get expert advice
✓ Access 350,000 discussions

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here