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HarelH (California)
Posts: 2
Posted:
A few months ago during the heavy rains in California, two units in our 12 unit complex were flooded when water leaked through walkways located in the common area into the ceiling of those units. The HOA insurance claim was denied by their carrier because the water damage source was considered flooding/rising water, and their insurance did not include flood insurance.

The HOA has agreed to pay for the repair costs for the units - but not for the lost rent suffered by the owners when their tenants had to move out for repairs. The owners have not yet filed a claim with their insurance companies, because (1) this is the third common area leak over the past 12 months - and they are afraid of a significant rise in premiums or cancellation of policy if they report another claim, and (2) they also don't hold flood insurance - so it's likely that their insurance companies will also deny the claim.

Is the HOA legally responsible for reimbursing the owners for lost rental income since the source of the water damage was in the common area?
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
Pay the lost rental income, otherwise you are going to pay more for attorney fees and court cost.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By HarelH on 07/14/2017 11:41 AM

Is the HOA legally responsible for reimbursing the owners for lost rental income since the source of the water damage was in the common area?

Question for an attorney.

I suspect you will find one that says yes and one that says no.
DouglasM6 (Arizona)
Posts: 724
Posted:
If it was a flood, how did it leak into the ceiling? What am I missing?
HarelH (California)
Posts: 2
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DouglasM6 on 07/14/2017 1:38 PM
If it was a flood, how did it leak into the ceiling? What am I missing?

Rainwater pooled on the third story common area walkways (insurance carrier defined this as flooding/rising water) and seeped down into the ceilings of the two ground floor/second story units below.
GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276
Posted:
Not a lawyer but my position would be that the association will pick up the tab for the repairs just like it would for any owner. If the owner happens to be leasing the unit and loses rental income because of the leak then that's tough luck for the owner. The association shouldn't be on the hook for costs above and beyond what they'd normally cover for another owner who was not leasing their unit. Cost of doing business, Mr. Landlord.

I do agree with Tim, though. Two licensed attorneys are probably going to give you two different answers.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Well it depends on a few factors... However, I consider a rental agreement between owner and renter. It's NOT with the HOA. The HOA doesn't run the owner's business nor have a rental agreement with the tenant. It's a third party thing.

Loss of income would be if they owned a doctor's office and ran a practice out of their home. That may be something that falls under "loss of income". However, considering this is illegal to do in most HOA's to use your home as a business, it's most likely not on the hook.

As for flood insurance. In our state one has to be declared to be in a flood zone to get flood insurance. If your in a flood zone then it's required. Otherwise it's optional for the most part. When a downpour of rain causes flooding and goes away afterwards, it's not a flood zone. A flood zone the water retains for a long period of time.

I don't believe the HOA is on the hook for lost rental because there just is not a contract between HOA and renter. The renter should have had their own rental Insurance. Otherwise, you pay for the damage full on.

Former HOA President
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
The loss of rental income insurance is with the owner's policy. As stated they chose not to file a claim.

Sorry, unless you file a claim, you have no case.
JeffT2 (Iowa)
Posts: 880
Posted:
This is a quote from a California law firm:

"Many homeowners mistakenly believe that their associations are strictly liable for any damage or loss they may suffer even if the HOA was not the cause of the loss. For example, a plumbing leak damages an owner's unit does not automatically make the association liable for the damage. The standard for HOA liability is negligence (unless the governing documents establish a different standard). Accordingly, the HOA must have had a duty to maintain the particular plumbing line, the HOA breached that duty (the board knew or should have known that the line needed repair and failed to take action to repair it), and the HOA's breach of its duty caused a loss to the owner. Under those conditions, the association may be liable to the owner for the loss he/she suffered."

http://www.davis-stirling.com/Main-Index/Negligence-Defined

Did your association do something negligent to cause the water damage, or did it "just happen" due to lots of rain?
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
For legal questions, talk to an attorney.

As far as the rental income goes, I would have to say no - that's why you should get landlord insurance, which I believe has provisions for loss of income (check the policy for the details). That's also why tenants need to have renter's insurance that would pay for moving and living expenses while the home or apartment is bein repaired, or they move to a different place.

The HOA was never designed to be a rental property - homeowners choose to rent out their units. I realize some do this because they've moved far away and may need a way to pay housing expensed until the home sells. However, others choose to buy a home simply for the rental income potential - the HOA doesn't benefit from that because the homeowner is already legally obligated to pay assessments. In fact, the HOA usually has to spend more time and money dealing with rental units because if there's a problem, both the tenant and owner/landlord have to be contacted.


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
Looking at the bigger picture, does the association pay loss of use for owner residents who are displaced in the same situation? If not, then I don't see the case for paying for lost rental income.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DouglasK1 on 07/17/2017 7:15 AM
Looking at the bigger picture, does the association pay loss of use for owner residents who are displaced in the same situation? If not, then I don't see the case for paying for lost rental income.

Exactly. If it was policy to compensate owner/ occupants, the same compensation would be due the owner/ lsndlord.
DouglasM6 (Arizona)
Posts: 724
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By HarelH on 07/14/2017 2:04 PM
Posted By DouglasM6 on 07/14/2017 1:38 PM
If it was a flood, how did it leak into the ceiling? What am I missing?


Rainwater pooled on the third story common area walkways (insurance carrier defined this as flooding/rising water) and seeped down into the ceilings of the two ground floor/second story units below.

You should challenge the Insurance Carrier's definition. It's damage from rain water, not flood water. Contact them and express this. If they do not budge, contact a lawyer or an independent adjusting company.
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DouglasM6 on 07/17/2017 9:52 AM
Posted By HarelH on 07/14/2017 2:04 PM
Posted By DouglasM6 on 07/14/2017 1:38 PM
If it was a flood, how did it leak into the ceiling? What am I missing?


Rainwater pooled on the third story common area walkways (insurance carrier defined this as flooding/rising water) and seeped down into the ceilings of the two ground floor/second story units below.


You should challenge the Insurance Carrier's definition. It's damage from rain water, not flood water. Contact them and express this. If they do not budge, contact a lawyer or an independent adjusting company.

I agree . Was going to state the same thing.

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