Condo President can't get access to bank account

Started by JimC24 • 13 replies • 1816 views

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JimC24 (Connecticut)
Posts: 60

Posted:

I recently took over as condo president for a small condo. The Treasurer is the only one with access to the bank account. I noticed that he doesn't keep good records and the information that he provides changes by the minute. I asked for bank statements about 3 weeks ago and he never provided them. Becoming more concerned, I asked for online access to the bank account and it seems to be taking longer than it should. I visited the bank and asked what I could do and they said that someone that is the signer on the account has to agree to give you access. I told them my situation and they did not really offer an alternative. I asked them if they would accept a document that names me at the president and meeting minutes where a vote was taken and approved to provide me with access. They said they would forward that information to the legal department but they could not make any guarantees. The Treasurer makes up a million excuses why he can't get statements, meet me at the bank, give me online access ...ect... I got a flat tire, my kid was sick, my friend got a dwi, I have a project at work that is taking all my time - and this is only after two months. Does anyone know how I can gain access to this bank account? Like I said we are a small condo and not well funded. I don't want to incur extensive legal fees, but I think I need to find out what's going on here.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Usually another signee has to vouch for the new signee. That is what we do in our HOA when officers change. We change the signature card at the bank. We also have an official HOA seal. Which not sure how that plays into things but all official corporate documents (official meeting notes etc...) had to have that stamp/seal. That may be a way to show official documentation.

Not sure if a Notary may be able to help in any way. Banks usually have them available to their customers. It may be an option in showing your "official" status. Plus generally any HOA should have 2 people who can sign. We have a 2 signature requirement per check in our HOA. That is for checks and balances. Something you can tell them that you want to put into place.

Former HOA President

DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046

Posted:

It's been about 3 1/2 years ago, but I was surprised how easy it was to get the signers changed on our accounts at two major banks (BOA and Wells Fargo). We had to take meeting minutes, I think for just the board meeting where a motion was made appointing the assignees (on letterhead). Maybe we also needed the annual meeting minutes where the directors were elected, but I'm not sure on that.

I talked to one of the bank people, he said that since board turnovers weren't always smooth, requiring the old signees to show up or sign paperwork was not practical.

Since our "Letterhead" is nothing but a Word document template, it seems to me that anyone could print/forge the required paperwork and take over lots of HOA accounts with just a minimum of info, such as the account number.

In the Jim's case, I would be getting very worried. Many HOAs have poor internal controls and rely way too much on trust. While it works out ok in the vast majority of cases, there are still a lot of situations where fraud/theft/embezzlement occurs.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JimC24 on 07/05/2017 5:17 PM
I recently took over as condo president for a small condo. The Treasurer is the only one with access to the bank account. I noticed that he doesn't keep good records and the information that he provides changes by the minute. I asked for bank statements about 3 weeks ago and he never provided them. Becoming more concerned, I asked for online access to the bank account and it seems to be taking longer than it should. I visited the bank and asked what I could do and they said that someone that is the signer on the account has to agree to give you access. I told them my situation and they did not really offer an alternative. I asked them if they would accept a document that names me at the president and meeting minutes where a vote was taken and approved to provide me with access. They said they would forward that information to the legal department but they could not make any guarantees. The Treasurer makes up a million excuses why he can't get statements, meet me at the bank, give me online access ...ect... I got a flat tire, my kid was sick, my friend got a dwi, I have a project at work that is taking all my time - and this is only after two months. Does anyone know how I can gain access to this bank account? Like I said we are a small condo and not well funded. I don't want to incur extensive legal fees, but I think I need to find out what's going on here.

Potentially I would CHANGE MY HOA BANK ACCOUNT! If you can PROVE you are the HOA President then you should have been given accesss.

JimC24 (Connecticut)
Posts: 60

Posted:

Thank you all for replying. Unfortunately, I am caught in a kind of Catch 22. I talked to the bank and they wont allow access unless someone with access authorizes it. I asked them if I were to call a special meeting and present the meeting minutes approving access to the account by the majority of unit holders and also present evidence that I am the Condo President would they allow me access to the account. They said they would forward the documents to their legal department but they can't make any guarantees, but it did not seem promising.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JimC24 on 07/06/2017 3:10 PM
Thank you all for replying. Unfortunately, I am caught in a kind of Catch 22. I talked to the bank and they wont allow access unless someone with access authorizes it. I asked them if I were to call a special meeting and present the meeting minutes approving access to the account by the majority of unit holders and also present evidence that I am the Condo President would they allow me access to the account. They said they would forward the documents to their legal department but they can't make any guarantees, but it did not seem promising.

I would ask other local banks the same question. He who gives you better appropriate answer is who I would change to in future. It is a bit ridiculous that individuals who had previous access are allowed to essentially "hijack" a bank account by withholding permissions ... when they by Law no longer have such permissions. Somehow in my mind that does not compute ...

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

To address this in the future, you might want to consider giving all Directors as signature authority at the Bank. This allows access to records and funds and provides a work around for situations like yours. We do a simple memo to the Bank each year signed by the Association Secretary.

In regards to the situation you are in now, you may want to make a motion to remove the individual from serving as Treasurer if you suspect foul play. Otherwise, you may need to simply show up at their home and ask to look at the books (harder to say no when you are right there).

Keep in mind finding excuses may simply be perception.
Not having good records does not always indicate foul play.

It may simply be that the job takes more time then the individual has to give at the moment.

LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679

Posted:

I wouldn't go to the same bank as your accounts are located for Notary services, it would look like a conflict of interest.
This might be a stretch, have you reached out to your lawyer that represents your HOA, maybe they can procure a document you can take to the bank.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Another solution is make the treasurer go to the bank with you and don't take no for an answer.

JimC24 (Connecticut)
Posts: 60

Posted:

Actually, I tried that today and in the past. If I get too demanding, he gets very defensive - say things like " what are you accusing me of". Taking a more passive but persistent approach, I will schedule a time to meet at the bank, like I did today. He agreed to the time but then I get about 5 phone calls throughout the day where he wants to reschedule by a few hours. And by the end of the day, the meeting never happens. It's very frustrating for me, but I can only think it must be more frustrating for him. I think he is used to people giving up and realizes that I have no intention of every giving up. In some ways I think when he calls up to reschedule he is hoping I will become more demanding about the meeting time. This way he could pretend outrage that I would suggest that this issue should take precedence to work or his family. But by asking him for a new time, he knows he will have to continue to come up with new excuses, which become harder and harder to believe. These are all just tactics. I would much prefer to get legal access to the bank account instead of playing this stupid game.

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Ask a friend or two to help persuade him. He's acting like someone with something to hide which raises huge red flags and suspicions. It's borderline illegal IMO.

JimC24 (Connecticut)
Posts: 60

Posted:

Your right GenoS, I should get others involved. Right now, his behavior is very suspicious but I am the only one that sees it. If he tried to do the same thing with a group of people, I would have more support and a greater number of people calling him on it. Thanks for the suggestion.

LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JimC24 on 07/07/2017 6:52 PM
Actually, I tried that today and in the past. If I get too demanding, he gets very defensive - say things like " what are you accusing me of". Taking a more passive but persistent approach, I will schedule a time to meet at the bank, like I did today. He agreed to the time but then I get about 5 phone calls throughout the day where he wants to reschedule by a few hours. And by the end of the day, the meeting never happens. It's very frustrating for me, but I can only think it must be more frustrating for him. I think he is used to people giving up and realizes that I have no intention of every giving up. In some ways I think when he calls up to reschedule he is hoping I will become more demanding about the meeting time. This way he could pretend outrage that I would suggest that this issue should take precedence to work or his family. But by asking him for a new time, he knows he will have to continue to come up with new excuses, which become harder and harder to believe. These are all just tactics. I would much prefer to get legal access to the bank account instead of playing this stupid game.

It sure sounds like he is stalling you, like he has something to hide. You need to visit with the HOA's lawyer and hit the treasurer with a blueback.. Then you need to have a forensic audit performed on the books, and have the treasurer removed from his post.

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