Formal Proceedure regarding minutes

I have recently been elected to my communities BOD. As a new member one of my goals is to establish formal procedures for our meetings.

I really need someone who knows what their talking about in regards to this subject. If you offer your opinion here, please, if possible cite a source. At the risk of sounding presumptuous I really don't want to debate this. I know there is a formal procedure, I just need to know what it is. I have searched Robers Rules (tenth addition) and so far I can't find it.

My question is, how should a minutes contain the results of a vote taken on a motion. Roberts rules suggests; that in the minutes of a meeting references to specific Board members and their opinions should not be included, unless a person specifically requests to "go on record". Should the results of a vote simply be something like " the motion was passed 3 votes for, 2 against", or should we record who voted, and exactly how they voted?

I agree with Robert. Honestly, I don't know of any "official form" for meeting notes or votes. It's whatever the format the HOA wants to follow or has already implemented. Some HOA's may have an official form they may want to share with you.

I would NOT post the names of the board member or other members and how they voted. That will just cause chaos and anger you don't want to get into. It's best to keep votes and collections "anomonous". (Sorry can't spel ) It's the END result of the vote that matters ultimately, NOT how you got there.

Your going the right direction in regards to Robert Rules. Our by-laws or CC&R's actually had our order of business written in them at the beginning regarding meetings. You may find some details there about meetings and how to handle them for your situation.

Keep reviewing other posts on here. This is a good source for educated responsible advice about HOA's.

You can slightly modify any corporate minutes that you can find online. An HOA is just a corporation generally. There is software you can buy as well, for a nominal amount.

I think I'm going to push for a version on our web site that gives the results without specifics. There will be an official copy, with a record of how each member voted kept in the HOA files, assessable to any homeowner that requests it.

This might help prevent the enormous amount of gossip, then again, maybe not.

So then your recommendation is to post the official minutes on the web with the result of each vote and how each member voted?

As opposed to creating a public copy that is the same in every way but only announces the result of the vote, e.g. 3 votes for, 2 against, motion passed....ect...

I would agree with Roger on this that the way members vote, especially against a measure should be a matter of official record. Two reasons for this...1)as Roger said if there is ever a lawsuit it is important to know who was for and against. 2) Board members are after all elected officials...I think it is important for homeowners to see how they vote on issues so they can make an educated decision come election time if that board member subscribes to their though process or not. Just my opinion.

As Melissa said go check out city council, ours publishes the names of those council members who vote against a measure.

Chris, I applaud you for your work in turning around your board and community. It sounds like you are on the right track.

In the newspaper here they often have a roll call of how our various representatives voted on issues. When there is something that is particularly dumb, in my opinion, I look up hoping that my "good guys" voted "right". Although I am aware of what RRO say, it seems to me it is good to record the votes and who voted which way. If things that are being decided are that controversial, perhaps town meetings are in order. Certainly the solution should not be to hide the vote (IMO).

Thanks to Roger for stating what RRO say about small boards. When I found that particular section, especially the one about no seconds for motions, I thought our meetings went far more efficiently. I hope others take note of it as it really does smooth things out and far too many "experts" in parliamentary procedure don't appear to know about it.

On approval of minutes -- as I read it, a board member can vote to approve the minutes even if they did not attend the board meeting in question. This is necessary sometimes, but it always seemed strange -- how could they possibly know whether the minutes are correct or not? (Now if they had a recording to reference ...)This question always troubles me.

Chris,
Yes I recommend posting the official minutes only. I do not recommend posting how each member votes on each motion. I recommend posting the names of those who vote against a motion. How the others voted is obvious unless there are abstentions or if the minutes fail to include those Board members present/absent).
Examples: 1) motion passed unanimously; and 2) motion passes with Jack Jones opposed.

Robert,

For clarification, our By-laws state that when not in conflict with our Rules and state and local laws Roberts Rules takes precedence. Sorry I didn't make that clear.

Here is a fictional example of what I would like to see in our minutes....

----------------

ITEM FROM AGENDA

Discuss what should be done with CD that has just matured at Home Town Bank.

MOTION: (if a member requests a motion on the issue)

Motion put forth to request that the Board redeposit CD at the Home Town Bank in the amount of $1000 for an additional six months.

MOTION SUBMITTED BY:
President (or actual name)

MOTION SECONDED BY:
Vice President
(Other possibilities; the motion is withdrawn in the event there is no second, or the person who requested the motion in the agenda requests to remove it from consideration. The issue of seconds is a minor one and not something I feel is really needed unless there is a large number of people involved)

TOPIC DEBATE: (this is where we outline very briefly the debate if any)
Members agreed the money should be re-invested. Bank is offering a special rate of 5% with a yield of 5.24%

RESULT: (the result should be clearly spelled out)

Vote to to re-deposit CD for an additional 6 months at Charles Town Bank:

Yes: 4
PRESIDENT (or name)
VICE PRESIDENT
TREASURE
MEMBER AT LARGE

NO
None

ABSTAIN
None

ABSENT
SECRETARY

ACTIONS REQUIRED: (If the topic requires specific dates or times or assignments to persons they should be included here)

The Treasure and President or Vice president will visit the bank on (date) to renew the CD.

----------------------------

Some things I'm flexible on are below, and would like to know opinions of best practice. Keep in mind that in our Community RRO takes precedence, since on issues of formality our By-Lays don't speak.

Items in CAPS would be relatively standard for each issue.

There are several ways to change this.....

One since the members that are absent would be included at the top, eliminate the "absent"

Someone suggested only the "NO" vote be recorded, or those votes that members with to go on record for.

In place of title, use full names.

Chris:

As Roger said I would leave out who voted for the motion. At the beginning of your minutes it should state the board members present and from there is it easy to figure out. I would only put names of abstentions or no votes.

Can you give a reference as to how the State dictates how minutes are to be written? I am curious.

Can you recheck the website you gave. It doesn't seem to be valid.

I assume you are referring to this paragraph:

"(3) MINUTES.--Minutes of all meetings of the members of an association and of the board of directors of an association must be maintained in written form or in another form that can be converted into written form within a reasonable time. A vote or abstention from voting on each matter voted upon for each director present at a board meeting must be recorded in the minutes. "

The reference states it does not contain changes after July 1, 2007.

Home > Publications > Alerts and Updates
Florida Amends Homeowners' Associations Laws
June 20, 2007

Provisions Become Effective July 1, 2007

On June 19, 2007, Florida Governor Crist signed Senate Bill 902 (the "Bill"). The Bill changes many provisions of existing law that affect homeowners' associations. The new provisions become effective July 1, 2007. In particular, changes to Chapter 720 of the Florida Statutes include the following:

Section 720.303(2) - Board Meetings This Section was amended to provide that the requirements relating to board of director meetings also apply to (a) meetings of any committee or other similar body when a final decision will be made regarding expenditure of association funds and (b) meetings of architectural review committees. As revised, meetings of such committees require a quorum and must be open to all members of the association.

How does this relate to how minutes are to be written?

As I remember the answer was that accounting wise it was easier. We have already been thru our transition and the developer was very generous throughout the whole time in making sure we have a good reserve. We have already repaved our streets ( we are a gated community so we own the streets) and still have a great amount in our reserve.

I read this board daily - it has a lot of good info about how various HOA are being run.
My question is this: Re: HOA in Florida; our secretary has taken minutes for only 1 out 4 meeting we had this year. I asked the PM for a copy of all minutes and he suggested I call the secretary since he doesn't have any.
This I believe is in violation of FL Statutes, but is the PM also in violation of Chapt. 468 ?

I know this input will no be savory to many. When a board meeting is held, it is audio recorded by a Member, who is in attendance and pays attention. This is specifically allowed per law and is usually done on a smartphone. After the meeting, the member reviews the meeting and produces a written summary, which is then posted on the resident-controlled website. An audio of the Meeting is also posted. This is to inform owners what is happening in their community and on the boards if they cannot attend meetings, and have a way of evaluating board directors at election time.

Members reading the Member Summary have often exclaimed that the two versions the meeting were completely different in tone and content. The Member Summary fleshes out the details of issues and always records dissenting Directors and votes. Member Summaries include descriptions of audience reaction and body language, as well as spontaneous remarks and questions and board response. It is detailed by design. Both have a purpose but this diary serves as a perpetual record of Association business which will live past the 7-year records retention period to preserve history.

Boards do not like it, but it is not disruptive and has proven to be valuable in "keeping it real".

The resident-controlled website posts both the Member Summaries and the Official Minutes and differentiates the two in Large Red Bolded Titles so there can be no confusion between the two. Anyone can read anything on this website; it is open and registration is optional. This has been operating for 7 years in this manner. First amendment rights are alive and well and the sky has not fallen

DITTO