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Required to hire licensed & insured contractors?

Started by MichaelH21 • 22 replies • 3238 views

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MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
I noticed in another thread about HOA repair responsibility one of the replies was that neither the HOA or the homeowner is under obligation to hire a licensed and insured contractor, and I was wondering if this is really so. Ours is one of the few communities where the homeowner is responsible for the siding, and when doing repairs we are told we must use a licensed and insured contractor. I can find nothing in the cc&r's, bylaws, or the architectural guidelines that say this is required, but when filling out an application for repair, one must provide this information or not be approved. Oddly, if the homeowner does the repair themselves, you needn't be a contractor. The main issue has been termite repair, because a lot of termite companies that do repair don't have contractors licenses, therefore not approved. Can the architectural committee enforce this?
CarolF (Florida)
Posts: 435
Posted:
Does your county require a permit for this work?
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
Not sure. If someone replaced all their siding, I imagine so. My contractor replaced portions of siding and some trim repair with no permit.
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Anyone who contracts to perform work that is valued at $500 or more for materials and labor must hold a current, valid license in the specialty for which he/she is contracting. A contractor's license can be verified through the Contractor License Board.

As noted here: http://www.davis-stirling.com/Main-Index/Contractor-License

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
It is our POLICY but NOT a REQUIREMENT. We HIGHLY suggest that all work is done by a licensed and insured contractor. We the HOA does verify the contractor WE hire to meet that qualification unless the job doesn't require this. (I.E. cleaning clubhouse or other small jobs). Otherwise owners can hire whomever they want or do the job themselves.

It just will come down to the fact that if something goes wrong and they/us did not hire a licensed/insured contractor, then we suffer the consequences. You can't come blame the HOA for a bad job if you did not practice a good business practice.
Former HOA President
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
In co-joined units (town homes or condo type) I believe it is well within the power of an association to only allow licensed and bonded contractors for the "structural integrity" of the building. In stand alone units, the owner should be pretty much free to do as they wish.
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
Thank you all for the good information.
LetA (Nevada)
Posts: 2,679
Posted:
It might be a State, County or Local ordnance, and yes the ARC committer can and does enforce it. I have worked security in condo high-rises, where even cleaners/ maids that are hired by the owner/ occupant are not allowed through the lobby unless they are licensed, bonded and insured.
GeorgeR8 (Arizona)
Posts: 182
Posted:
Where I live any job that is over $1000 in labor and materials must be done by a licensed contractor. Our ACC will not sign off on illegal work. Any electrical work, according to our docs must be done by a licensed electrician with no dollar amount listed.
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
The size of the repair and value would likely trigger contractors getting involved. I'd be more concerned that your termite company carry liability insurance and worker's compensation on any employees that perform work on your house.

Someone posted the California HOA code requiring a person to be licensed for the service they provide, the termite company would likely be regulated for its service and carry a license to do business. No contractor will come on site for a simple $500 to $4,000 job. It's not worth it.
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
You should see the type of contractors we get for small repairs......bondo on wood repairs, the whole nine yards. As you stated, most (the good ones) won't even come out. Termite companies, even the ones without a contractors license don't use bondo....
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 494
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelH21 on 05/26/2017 5:56 AM
You should see the type of contractors we get for small repairs......bondo on wood repairs, the whole nine yards. As you stated, most (the good ones) won't even come out. Termite companies, even the ones without a contractors license don't use bondo....

Bondo is fine for some repairs. There are several rot repair products that are similar to a bondo. I have even used this as detailed, specified and inspected by an engineer on a condo stucco repair

https://www.systemthree.com/products/endrot-wood-restoration-kit?gclid=Cj0KEQjwx6TJBRCWtsiXpI7bhOYBEiQA1en3F5RIDNer-siYDiWzAcPZB-jxoBv6-b012VJf92KqEesaAr848P8HAQ
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
While bondo is fine for some self made repairs, if I'm paying a contractor I don't expect to see it........https://thecraftsmanblog.com/bondo-is-never-the-answer/
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 494
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelH21 on 05/27/2017 9:49 AM
While bondo is fine for some self made repairs, if I'm paying a contractor I don't expect to see it........https://thecraftsmanblog.com/bondo-is-never-the-answer/

Well, I'll put my years of carpentry and multi-million dollar supervisory experience against what you read on a blog, where even there he was taken to task. There are places where bondo and products like the System 3 structural repair putty are perfectly useful. And there are places where it is not.
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
Don't know what multi-million dollar supervisory experience has to do with it. One of the replies on the blog stated.... "As a professional I used Bondo for years (following the instructions properly) only to find failure after failure just a few short years down the line."..... so again, if I'm paying a contractor or termite company to fix termite damage, I for one, want a wood repair, not bondo. To each his own.
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 494
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MichaelH21 on 05/27/2017 10:18 AM
Don't know what multi-million dollar supervisory experience has to do with it..

Basically that I'm a professional and you're an amateur. It is ludicrous to say that using bondo is wrong. There are many places where it is fine. And if you're picking up the bill, repairing a window casing with bondo and epoxy may be a better choice than a $5K remove and replace.

Carry on
MichaelH21 (Georgia)
Posts: 13
Posted:
Lol, amateur? Yeah, I get it.......you must be right. My sincere apologies.
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 494
Posted:
We hardly knew ya
DouglasM6 (Arizona)
Posts: 724
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 05/19/2017 2:41 PM
It is our POLICY but NOT a REQUIREMENT. We HIGHLY suggest that all work is done by a licensed and insured contractor. We the HOA does verify the contractor WE hire to meet that qualification unless the job doesn't require this. (I.E. cleaning clubhouse or other small jobs). Otherwise owners can hire whomever they want or do the job themselves.

It just will come down to the fact that if something goes wrong and they/us did not hire a licensed/insured contractor, then we suffer the consequences. You can't come blame the HOA for a bad job if you did not practice a good business practice.

How can your policy NOT be a requirement? I find that a bit confusing.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
It may be the HOA will only work with licensed and insured contractors for work done on the common area, but the homeowner is free to hire whoever he/she chooses.

It's one thing to hire a handyman to install a mailbox or toilet seat - that work doesn't require a license. But if it's something more involved and expensive like replacing siding or installing a circuit box, I, for one, would NEVER hire someone who wasn't licensed and bonded. No, it isn't a guarantee everything will run smoothly and you still need to check if the person or company has ever had any complaints and how they were handled. However, I would like to think when one goes through the trouble of getting a license and bond, that will increase the odds that whoever I hire will be qualified to do the work I need.

In my community, we have a handyman who can do relatively simple stuff for the common area, but when it comes to siding replacement (which we've been doing for the last 4 years), the Board hires licensed and bonded people if the work requires such. We live in a townhouse community, and when I was on the board, we felt that if one's spending association money, the Board has the duty to make sure whoever they hire is capable of doing the work to its specifications and at a high level so it doesn't have to spend more time, money and aggravation to have it redone over and over again.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
GwenG (Florida)
Posts: 669
Posted:
My FL HOA tries to be a nanny to homeowners who choose their own contractors for work on their own property. They have actually denied contractor entry through the gates telling the homeowner that their contractor is not on their "list" of approved contractors. My HOA just doesn't get it.

We had a homeowner who threatened to sue the HOA for tortious interference. They haven't changed their behavior. Homeowner recourse is to contact the police because the homeowner's invited guest is being denied access to the homeowner. Police tell the HOA to lift the gate, which it uses to harass owners. End result is homeowner is pissed, police are pissed, HOA is pissed, Contractor Pissed and probably won't want the job/hassle. Lots of time wasted.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GwenG on 05/30/2017 9:17 AM
My FL HOA tries to be a nanny to homeowners who choose their own contractors for work on their own property. They have actually denied contractor entry through the gates telling the homeowner that their contractor is not on their "list" of approved contractors. My HOA just doesn't get it.

We had a homeowner who threatened to sue the HOA for tortious interference. They haven't changed their behavior. Homeowner recourse is to contact the police because the homeowner's invited guest is being denied access to the homeowner. Police tell the HOA to lift the gate, which it uses to harass owners. End result is homeowner is pissed, police are pissed, HOA is pissed, Contractor Pissed and probably won't want the job/hassle. Lots of time wasted.


The other alternative is for everyone to rally together and compel this board to change its ways or replace them - I wonder how many good contractors have been put off because this board wants to dictate everything. If everyone's as pissed as you say, they need to get busy

And how does one make this "approved list" anyway? Do the homeowners get some sort of discount if they use an "approved" contractor as oppose to someone else? No? Then what's the point of the list??????

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
GwenG (Florida)
Posts: 669
Posted:
Answer is unknown as to what benefit might be to owners by the Nanny List. I see no benefits. Homeowners are free to choose their own contractor whether licensed, bonded, experienced or just a bunch of college kids out to make some fun money. None of the HOA's business.

There are two reasons that come immediately to mind, however. Nanny Management Company gets some kind of kickback from the Preferred Contractors and, because it represents itself as having the final say over who gets to work inside the community, the contractors fall into line if they want to work. So there is the monetary incentive...paired with a control incentive.

The control is the second reason; this HOA does not have ARC authority so it has, in the past, pretended to have ARC authority by bullying and intimidating homeowners. Then EVERYTHING CHANGED with expiration of Covenants and Rules and the deceipt could no longer be maintained by the HOA. Homeowners now know that HOA has no ARC authority, so the HOA is now controlling contractors and their access as a runaround the homeowners.

Business as usual in the carefree living style of an HOA.

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