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ChrisG10 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
I live in a small HOA community with 38 homeowners. The HOA meets twice (2x) a year and require all members to attend. On the newsletter they sent, they usually say that there will be a fine if a homeowner did not attend a meeting. Due to Religious observance, I have been excusing myself on the meeting as they always meet on Saturday mid-morning where my whole family goes to church (I'm a Seventh Day Adventist). The HOA manager has always been good at accepting my excuse as I always good at talking to her or other member of the board after the HOA meeting to get updates.

Regular attendance is about 25 to 30 homeowners as other homeowners have other reason for not excusing themselves such as work, vacation or their house is turned into a rental. On the last HOA meeting few homeowner complain that we never got 100% participation and propose to be strict on the fine on everyone and not accept any excuses for not attending (yes these are mostly retired or does not have anything to do on Saturday). Unfortunately, most homeowners agree to that proposal.

I looked in the CC&R and I did not see anything that talks about attendance. I guess this is just something that they were saying before to encourage homeowners to participate in the HOA meeting and it is now comeback to hunt them as some member now wanted this to be enforced.

My Question: Is it legal for an HOA in California to make attendance "Mandatory and impose fine" to its members?

Thanks!
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Chris,

I have never heard of an association trying to do this and, without a provision in the CC&R's, cannot imagine where they would get the authority to compel attendance.

If I recall correctly, CA law requires that an association permit voting by absentee ballot. This implies that the state legislature did not intend for an association to compel attendance.

You have raised a bona fide argument against mandatory attendance: that it violates your religious beliefs. If your church has a defense counsel you might request that they intervene on your behalf. This might also be a violation of the Fair Housing Act.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
I also have never heard of such a thing.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
It would be ILLEGAL what they are doing.

First, you would only have one Member meeting per year at which time elections generally would be held.

Board meetings should be held not least than 4 times a year to comply with Civil Code that requires the Board to review the financials at a mininum of four times a years. General Board meetings are OPEN to the Members, BUT not required by statues to attend.
AugustinD
Posts: 5,144
Posted:
ChrisG10, if your HOA does not offer reasonable accommodation for your religion's requirement not to do whatever on Saturdays, then it is violating the federal Fair Housing Act and possibly fair housing laws in California as well. Other laws may come into play here as well, as others are pointing out. The first thing I would do is write the HOA Board a letter and say you believe that requiring your attendance on Saturdays violates the Fair Housing Act; would you please continue to make an exception for my attendance?
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I think it'd be illegal too to demand attendance. And with others, assuming you're talking about a meeting of the members (not a board mtg.), and if voting is involved, with absentee ballots legal in CA HOAs, what's the purpose of forced attendance?

Well, I suppose to try to overcome apathy, but I don't think coercion is effective.

Do your Bylaws, by chance, have any thing about this topic in them? If not, the Board is blowing smoke and seems to have no justification to demand that you and others attend.

If the board can't show you & others this "requirement," as a group, ignore the board. At least that's my thinking.
BobD4 (up north)
Posts: 1,002
Posted:
Truancy fines ? At the risk of being a Devil's Advocate, sounds like a good creative way to either get participation or raise revenues.
( Chris C10 : Maybe not the best idea to suggest to them that their fine-enforced meetings / revenue generation be scheduled to something like 3 am to 4 am on weekdays . . )
KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 06/22/2016 9:32 PM
I think it'd be illegal too to demand attendance. And with others, assuming you're talking about a meeting of the members (not a board mtg.), and if voting is involved, with absentee ballots legal in CA HOAs, what's the purpose of forced attendance?

Well, I suppose to try to overcome apathy, but I don't think coercion is effective.

Do your Bylaws, by chance, have any thing about this topic in them? If not, the Board is blowing smoke and seems to have no justification to demand that you and others attend.

If the board can't show you & others this "requirement," as a group, ignore the board. At least that's my thinking.

I would think it doesn't matter what the by-laws say. If it isn't in the declaration. Than they are overstepping their authority. I would love to see this enforced.

I remember my old neighborhood got into trouble when they told a Rabbi he couldn't have people over to his house to pray because it was causing a nuisance to their neighbors. They lost big. If your neighborhood continues down this path they too will be in for a rude awakening.
ChrisG10 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LarryB13 on 06/22/2016 2:01 PM
You have raised a bona fide argument against mandatory attendance: that it violates your religious beliefs. If your church has a defense counsel you might request that they intervene on your behalf. This might also be a violation of the Fair Housing Act.

Yes. Our church have a defense counsel and I will use them if needed. I exchanged communication with the Property Manager last night and she said there is 1 homeowner that always raise the issue of mandatory attendance but they have never really fine anyone. So she said that I will be ok as she knows that I can't make it on the day they picked. If they do fine me then I will have to get our defense counsel involved.

Thanks!

ChrisG10 (California)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardP13 on 06/22/2016 3:28 PM
It would be ILLEGAL what they are doing.

First, you would only have one Member meeting per year at which time elections generally would be held.

Board meetings should be held not least than 4 times a year to comply with Civil Code that requires the Board to review the financials at a mininum of four times a years. General Board meetings are OPEN to the Members, BUT not required by statues to attend.

I believe our HOA can be considered "self managed HOA?" since the property manager is also a property owner in the community? I feel like our board does not have enough understanding of covenant and By-laws and are making decision based on what that majority of members want. We only have 2 HOA meeting per year (June and December) it used to be 4 but since everything is going smoothly in our community they decided 2 meeting is enough. We simply have an email list and when something comes up, we simply email the board. Our HOA in general is friendly. There is just 1 homeowner that seem to always have complain who also keep complaining that some homeowners need to be on the meeting to be informed therefore the fine for non-attendance.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Interesting idea, but a HOA can't mandate attendance.

If there's nothing in your CCRs or Bylaws that mandate this, point this out to the board and make them justify why they can do this.

I suspect your board came up with this because there was an issue with meeting quorum for meetings or Board elections, but I think that's really heavy handed and virtually impossible to enforce. What happens if you don't pay the fine? It's one thing to fine someone for maintaining a nuisance, but not showing up at a meeting????I

I can't remember if California allows proxies - if it does, the board could use those so absent owners can help establish quorum by appointing someone to come in their place to vote. Or take a poll to see which days people would prefer instead. You'll never make everyone happy, but perhaps you can come to a reasonable meeting day, perhaps even altering days (Saturday this month, Tuesday the next month)

Personally, I'm not fond of Saturday meetings because people are already busy with housecleaning, taking the kids to Scout meetings, church (not just Seventh Day Adventists, either), sorority meetings, etc.

By the way, if you really want answers to legal questions, you should consult an attorney.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
To all the readers here. What they were doing was making it mandatory to attend BOARD meetings, not ANNUAL meetings. As the wording implies, these are for Board members to conduct business, not the homeowners. They are, by statue, allowed to attend to OBSERVE and again by statue, allowed to address the Board during OPEN FORUM.

There is a misinterpretation of the statues in regards to the number of Board meeting required. Statues state that the Board must review certain documents, such as financials, bank statements, bank reconciliations of both operating and reserve accounts, but it doesn't say this has to be at a meeting OR if any action needs to be taken. The number of meetings the Board is to attend is mentioned in your Bylaws.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
I suspect you're right, Richard. the OP is talking about Board of Directors Meetings. The confusion exists because Chris calls them "HOA meetings." HOA meetings usually means meetings of the members, e.g. annual meetings & elections.

What you need to do, Chris is read your Bylaws because that's where the structure of meetings and the various kinds of meetings and how many meetings are discussed. If you're incorporated, you must have bylaws.

I'm curious Chris why you don't just ask a board member to show you where it's written that attendance is mandatory. If they can't show you, don't even worry about some sort of attorney.
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RichardP13 on 06/23/2016 12:59 PM
To all the readers here. What they were doing was making it mandatory to attend BOARD meetings, not ANNUAL meetings.

It appears that part of the problem is that the HOA doesn't even understand the difference between board meetings and member meetings.

Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.

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