Do we need to refile ouor governing documents with the county?

Started by GreggK2 • 6 replies • 1326 views

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GreggK2 (Kansas)
Posts: 86

Posted:

Long story short. Our governing documents are 15 years old. Last January, we amended 15 items (all voted on by the home owners) and we mailed every home owner the results of these votes. Included in the voting was the HOA's ability to issue fines, which was approved by the home owners. Since January, and since we mailed everyone a copy of the changes, we have issued a few fines. One home owner is claiming that the fine he received is illegal because we have yet to refile the CC&R's with the county. In other words, his belief is that nothing we changed in January can be put into effect until it is filed with the county. This sounds like made up, wannabe laywer home owner talk as a means of getting out of the fines.

Does anyone know if you have to refile the governing documents anytime you make changes? Our docs are with the HOA attorney right now for him to revise them but we did notify everyone of what the changes were so, in my opinion, the argument that the fines are illegal until they are with the county, sounds like a lame excuse.

Your thoughts?

PitA
Posts: 1,416

Posted:

YES, the new Covenants and Restrictions MUST be filed with the Register of Deeds.

? What did the Corporate Attorney say ?

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868

Posted:

Gregg

Help me understand something. The homeowners approved a set of amendments and NOW they are at the HOA attorney to be "revised"?, BUT we notified the owners of the changes.

DID the owners approve the new changes. IMO, yes the fines were out of line, as you put it, the amendments are be revised.

FYI, the amendments, should have been corrected or revised PRIOR to the membership voting on them. They should be recorded to make them official. BECAUSE you sent them back for revision the fining process should have been halted!

GreggK2 (Kansas)
Posts: 86

Posted:

I should clarify since I was not clear. So our CC&R's were 15 years and never changed. In January, we put amendments out to be voted on. We had the results at the end of January. Some amendments passed and others failed. We then mailed every home owner a letter to explain the results of the votes. We then sent these changes to our HOA attorney so he could take the original CC&R's and amend them to reflect the results of the changes.

The attorney has had them for a while and said he will have them back to us next week. However, those home owners that have been fined since the January are saying they cannot be fined because the CC&R's haven't been updated with the results of the votes and filed with the county, even though they were mailed the results. The votes included the ability to fine home owners up to $50.00 per month.

So the original question was, since the home owners voted to allow fines, and every home owner was sent a letter explaining this, am I to understand that, until the final copy of the CC&R's is filed with the county, that the results of the voting an unenforceable until they are filed? In my opinion, having notified the home owners in writing about the voting results and fines is enough and we are protected.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868

Posted:

Gregg

Now the story has changed. Originally you said your CCRs were 15 years old and you amended 15 items, all voted on by the members. Now the story has changed. Some passed and some failed. Did all 15 amendments have separate yes or no votes. If you told us one thing, I wonder what the members were told.

I have done blending of amendments into CCRs and I have done them separately and it would take this long to have done and recorded. As I said, IMO wait until the finish product is done before fining. I would also ask your attorney.

Not sure how things are done in Kansas, but in almost every CCRs I have read in many different states, the ABILITY, not the dollar amount is already in your CCRs. All you should have had to do was re do your Rules and Regulations and create a fining schedule. This is done with member notification, not member approval.

GreggK2 (Kansas)
Posts: 86

Posted:

Richard, Richard, Richard...having lived in California I understand your attitude and the way you come across

No...the story didn't change...I just did not clearly present it the first time so GET OFF MY ASS HAHA! You are correct. The CC&R's do allow for "special assessments but things like the dollar amount were not made clear. Yes, every amendment came with its own YES / NO vote and we sent out the vote totals to the home owners.

Don't read too much into it and assume because I typed one thing here that something devious was done on the back side. We came up with a fine schedule, it that it what it is called in SoCal, so that, after 2 written warnings, the home owner could receive a flat $50.00 fine, no more than once per month for a single violation.

The originally question was, since we did notify everyone as to the results of the votes, is it safe to say that those amendments, which we told everyone went into effect February 1st, are in fact in effect even though our attorney has yet to complete changing the CC&R's to reflect the outcome of the votes. Stay focused here, Richard. I'm former Brentwood myself...I play nice until someone treats me like I am stupid.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868

Posted:

Sorry, Gregg, never liked Brentwood, if you get my drift.

Good luck!

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