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AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Connecticut - Development Year 2013 to present

We have a 13 unit Condo association that was recently turned over from declarant control to unit owner control.

There will be a TOTAL of 13 units when the project is finished. There are presently 8 units sold and the other 5 are still owned by the developer / former declarant.

These units are individual homes on individual "lots". The HOA association set an HOA Fee of approximately 1/4 of the Unit Owner Cost to the lots owned by the developer for their share of landscape/plowing/insurance which is not related to dwellings...ie liability etc.

The developers have failed to pay their HOA fees. What are the options of the HOA in collecting these fees?

Thanks.
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 351
Posted:
Lien
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Are there any exemptions in your organizing docs for the declarant's lots?

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
The bylaws say they are regulated by the Connecticut Common Interest Ownership act which states:

......In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.....

and EVEN if the bylaws said something different (which it doesn't) the bylaws say when there is a conflict the State Act Rules...........

....BUT when the act refers to liens / foreclosures etc for non payment of HOA fees, it always is referring to "unit owners".........

So I was looking for information from someone that knew where it fall under Connecticut Law.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmadorL on 01/08/2016 3:32 PM
The bylaws say they are regulated by the Connecticut Common Interest Ownership act which states:

......In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.....

and EVEN if the bylaws said something different (which it doesn't) the bylaws say when there is a conflict the State Act Rules...........

....BUT when the act refers to liens / foreclosures etc for non payment of HOA fees, it always is referring to "unit owners".........

So I was looking for information from someone that knew where it fall under Connecticut Law.

The first paragraph you quoted from 47-249b acknowledges that a declarant can have liability "as a unit owner". Suggest you scour your organizing docs and statutes for all references to "unit owner", especially any definition sections.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Yes, they do pay HOA on one unit that they haven't sold, but had declared and have it rented. I think that it refers to their liability for HOA for that property ..........they do pay the full HOA on that unit.....
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmadorL on 01/08/2016 4:31 PM
Yes, they do pay HOA on one unit that they haven't sold, but had declared and have it rented. I think that it refers to their liability for HOA for that property ..........they do pay the full HOA on that unit.....

Not sure what you're saying. Before you were talking about total of 5 units owned by developer not making HOA payments. Now you're talking about only 1 and it makes HOA payments. Please clarify.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Developer owns 5 "units". One they have declared and are renting out and are considered a "unit owner" and pay the full monthly HOA fee. The other 4 are vacant lots with no houses on them yet. The HOA fee the association has set for those lots are 1/4 of the full HOA fee. It was calculated, not just pulled out of the air. They refuse to make those payments.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmadorL on 01/08/2016 4:53 PM
Developer owns 5 "units". One they have declared and are renting out and are considered a "unit owner" and pay the full monthly HOA fee. The other 4 are vacant lots with no houses on them yet. The HOA fee the association has set for those lots are 1/4 of the full HOA fee. It was calculated, not just pulled out of the air. They refuse to make those payments.

It is not uncommon for undeveloped lots owned by the developer to be exempt from HOA assessments. I did a quick scan of Ct statute and didn't see anything on it - Doesn't mean that it isn't there. Statutes usually defer to declaration on issues like this, so best for you to wade through your HOA docs thoroughly. Shouldn't be too expensive to get your question answered by a Ct HOA lawyer.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
EllieD (Vermont)
Posts: 446
Posted:
Amador,

I am confused. You posted “a 13 Unit Condo Association” and you wrote “These units are individual homes on individual lots". And you use the term “Unit”, which usually means “Condominium Unit”.

BUT, then later on, you wrote HOA Association. Where HOA usually means a “Home Owner Association of single family homes”. Typically a HOA is different than a Condominium Association.

The “Allocated interests” will be defined differently, and so the “common expense liability” will be different, depending upon "which type" your Association is.

Would you please clarify which type of Association you are?

Thank you.
EllieD (Vermont)
Posts: 446
Posted:
Amador,

Also could you clarify re the 1/4 fee?

You wrote: “The HOA fee the association has set for those lots are 1/4 of the full HOA fee. It was calculated, not just pulled out of the air. They refuse to make those payments.

Who set, calculated, the fee of approximately 1/4 of the Unit Owner cost for the undeveloped lots? And when was this 1/4 fee set, or when did it start, or go into effect?

What reason does the Developer give for not paying “the fee” on the undeveloped lots?
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
It is not uncommon for the dues to be different (usually more) for an occupied unit/home than for a for sale one. Went down this road in one HOA and our lawyer said we might could win a legal battle but it could cost us more than the dues we could have collected. We dropped the idea.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Hi, they are single family detached CONDOMINIUMS. So, even though we have been saying HOA it is really the condo association.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
The newly elected board of directors calculated the "undeveloped" fee in a fair manner. It is a complicated calculation, but included the per unit share of landscaping/plowing less the additional cost for tgese services for sidewalks, driveways, trimming etc since they still need to be mowed and the road for access is plowed. The insurance share was calculated by using per unit cost of all premiums which did NOT include amounts related to "building" coverages etc.

It should be noted, that while the developer was in control, they prepared the budgets and always included a contribution line item with a note on the bottom which stated "developers share of landscape/plowing for undeveloped lots." Our calculation is basically within $10.00 of their per unit contribution since we adjusted for some insurance reimbursement due to the state acts wording of "all expenses" related to.

They claim they only needed to contribute during declarant control, and now only need to pay for units that are declared and that they rent since it is not sold.

NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmadorL on 01/09/2016 4:36 AM
The newly elected board of directors calculated the "undeveloped" fee in a fair manner. It is a complicated calculation, but included the per unit share of landscaping/plowing less the additional cost for tgese services for sidewalks, driveways, trimming etc since they still need to be mowed and the road for access is plowed. The insurance share was calculated by using per unit cost of all premiums which did NOT include amounts related to "building" coverages etc.

It should be noted, that while the developer was in control, they prepared the budgets and always included a contribution line item with a note on the bottom which stated "developers share of landscape/plowing for undeveloped lots." Our calculation is basically within $10.00 of their per unit contribution since we adjusted for some insurance reimbursement due to the state acts wording of "all expenses" related to.

They claim they only needed to contribute during declarant control, and now only need to pay for units that are declared and that they rent since it is not sold.

Declarant's argument sounds like nonsense. You may have to go to court to recover though.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Ama

Help me understand this. There are 13 lots. 8 of them have homes on them. The original declarant has turned the association over to the owners (8 of you) but the "former" declarant still owns 5 empty/undeveloped lots.

Your BOD has worked out what it feels is a fair assessment/dues structure for the empty lots but the former declarant has told you to go pound sand as in refuses to pay anything.

Is this correct.

AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Yes............that is correct........with the exception that they do have a declared home on one of those 5 lots which they have been unable to sell and have it rented out. They pay the FULL assessment on that home and collect the rent to their benefit which seems to be correct.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 01/09/2016 7:02 AM
Ama

Help me understand this. There are 13 lots. 8 of them have homes on them. The original declarant has turned the association over to the owners (8 of you) but the "former" declarant still owns 5 empty/undeveloped lots.

Your BOD has worked out what it feels is a fair assessment/dues structure for the empty lots but the former declarant has told you to go pound sand as in refuses to pay anything.

Is this correct.


Yes............that is correct........with the exception that they do have a declared home on one of those 5 lots which they have been unable to sell and have it rented out. They pay the FULL assessment on that home and collect the rent to their benefit which seems to be correct.

Add Reply
EllieD (Vermont)
Posts: 446
Posted:
Amador,

A few more questions, to help in understanding your “problem”.

Per your Declaration (could be in your Bylaws, but typically would be in your Declaration), would you post the paragraphs that:

1. Define the Boundaries of the Condominium Unit?

2. Define what are the Common Elements and/or Common Areas?

3. Define the “Percentage of Allocated Interests” for each of the Condominium Units.

4. Also, since typically “Association Maintenance Fees” are assessed ONLY against the Condominium Unit Owners, based on percentage of ownership, it would be interesting to know “what words in your Condo Documents” allow for assessing against the 4 vacant lots reserved for 4 declared, but unbuilt Condo Units (assuming that, that vacant land is defined as COMMON Area, and/or Common Elements). Would you be willing to post those words?

Thank you.
AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By EllieD on 01/09/2016 2:11 PM
Amador,

A few more questions, to help in understanding your “problem”.

Per your Declaration (could be in your Bylaws, but typically would be in your Declaration), would you post the paragraphs that:

1. Define the Boundaries of the Condominium Unit?

2. Define what are the Common Elements and/or Common Areas?

3. Define the “Percentage of Allocated Interests” for each of the Condominium Units.

4. Also, since typically “Association Maintenance Fees” are assessed ONLY against the Condominium Unit Owners, based on percentage of ownership, it would be interesting to know “what words in your Condo Documents” allow for assessing against the 4 vacant lots reserved for 4 declared, but unbuilt Condo Units (assuming that, that vacant land is defined as COMMON Area, and/or Common Elements). Would you be willing to post those words?

Thank you.

I have to gather that info and it is very confusing..........but we are hoping on using the state statute. The bylaws say they are regulated by the Connecticut Common Interest Ownership act which states in cases of conflict and that state statute prevails:

......In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.....

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By AmadorL on 01/09/2016 2:26 PM
Posted By EllieD on 01/09/2016 2:11 PM
Amador,

A few more questions, to help in understanding your “problem”.

Per your Declaration (could be in your Bylaws, but typically would be in your Declaration), would you post the paragraphs that:

1. Define the Boundaries of the Condominium Unit?

2. Define what are the Common Elements and/or Common Areas?

3. Define the “Percentage of Allocated Interests” for each of the Condominium Units.

4. Also, since typically “Association Maintenance Fees” are assessed ONLY against the Condominium Unit Owners, based on percentage of ownership, it would be interesting to know “what words in your Condo Documents” allow for assessing against the 4 vacant lots reserved for 4 declared, but unbuilt Condo Units (assuming that, that vacant land is defined as COMMON Area, and/or Common Elements). Would you be willing to post those words?

Thank you.


I have to gather that info and it is very confusing..........but we are hoping on using the state statute. The bylaws say they are regulated by the Connecticut Common Interest Ownership act which states in cases of conflict and that state statute prevails:

......In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.....


Ama

I am confused. You said the Declarant turned the association over to the owners thus the Declarant is no longer a/the Declarant. They are simply the owner of 4 vacant lots.

AmadorL (Connecticut)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 01/09/2016 3:49 PM
Posted By AmadorL on 01/09/2016 2:26 PM
Posted By EllieD on 01/09/2016 2:11 PM
Amador,

A few more questions, to help in understanding your “problem”.

Per your Declaration (could be in your Bylaws, but typically would be in your Declaration), would you post the paragraphs that:

1. Define the Boundaries of the Condominium Unit?

2. Define what are the Common Elements and/or Common Areas?

3. Define the “Percentage of Allocated Interests” for each of the Condominium Units.

4. Also, since typically “Association Maintenance Fees” are assessed ONLY against the Condominium Unit Owners, based on percentage of ownership, it would be interesting to know “what words in your Condo Documents” allow for assessing against the 4 vacant lots reserved for 4 declared, but unbuilt Condo Units (assuming that, that vacant land is defined as COMMON Area, and/or Common Elements). Would you be willing to post those words?

Thank you.


I have to gather that info and it is very confusing..........but we are hoping on using the state statute. The bylaws say they are regulated by the Connecticut Common Interest Ownership act which states in cases of conflict and that state statute prevails:

......In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.....



Ama

I am confused. You said the Declarant turned the association over to the owners thus the Declarant is no longer a/the Declarant. They are simply the owner of 4 vacant lots.


They are the developers and continue to have developmental rights until all re completed or up to 20 years which ever comes first.
EllieD (Vermont)
Posts: 446
Posted:
Amador posted “we are hoping on using the state statute” and then posted the words of paragraph (b) from Section 47-249 of the CT State statute.

For reference: Section 47-249 - Upkeep of common interest community. Liability for expenses.

(a) Except to the extent provided by the declaration, subsection (b) of this section or subsection (h) of section 47-255, the association is responsible for maintenance, repair and replacement of the common elements . . . . . .
--------------------
Note: Section (h) of section 47-255 deals with Insurance Proceeds and the rebuilding or not, of a portion of the community which is damaged or destroyed. And (a) also refers back to words that might be in the Declaration.
-------------------
(b) In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has under this chapter, the declarant alone is liable for all expenses in connection with real property subject to development rights. No other unit owner and no other portion of the common interest community is subject to a claim for payment of those expenses. Unless the declaration provides otherwise, any income or proceeds from real property subject to development rights inures to the declarant.

As I interpret, and I could be wrong, paragraph (b) as it applies to Amador’s Condominium Association, now after turnover, and with the developer retaining the right to build the four (4) remaining Condominium Units:

1. The first sentence states that the developer has to pay for all of the expenses incurred in the building of the Condominium Units (houses), all of the construction costs, labor, materials, etc., and presumably all the costs associated with selling the Condo Unit, after it is built.
2. The second sentence clarifies, by stating that none of the existing Condominium Owners can be charged, or be required to pay for any of the costs associated with the building of the remaining Condo Units (houses).
3. And the third, or last sentence, simply states that the developer has the right keep all profits made.

Does anyone see a connection, or how the words of paragraph 47-249(b) allow Amador’s Condominium Association, now that it has been turned over, to conclude that the costs of the landscaping, and other expenses, for the four (4) remaining VACANT Common Area Lots, should be subtracted from the “fees” due from the current owners of the nine (9) built Condominium Units, and become an obligation of the developer, who now after turnover is no longer the Declarant, but continues to have developmental rights to complete the building of the 4 remaining Condominium Units, or up to 20 years, whichever comes first.?

Per Section 47-202, Definitions: Keep in mind that this is a Condominium Association, and note the use of the word “unit” throughout.

(2) “Allocated interests” means the following interests allocated to each unit: (A) In a condominium, the undivided interest in the common elements, the common expense liability, and votes in the association
(3) “Assessment” means the sums attributable to a unit and due the association pursuant to section 47-257
(6) “Common elements” means (A) in the case of (i) a condominium or cooperative, all portions of the common interest community other than the units; . . . . . . . .
(8) “Common expense liability” means the liability for common expenses allocated to each unit pursuant to section 47-226.

And per Section 47-226 - Allocation of interests.
(a) The declaration shall allocate to each unit: (1) In a condominium, a fraction or percentage of undivided interests in the common elements and in the common expenses of the association, and a portion of the votes . . . . . . .
(b) The declaration shall state the formulas used to establish allocations of interests. . . . . . . .
(c) If units may be added to or withdrawn from the common interest community, the declaration shall state the formulas to be used to reallocate the allocated interests among all units included in the common interest community after the addition or withdrawal.
(f) In a condominium, the common elements are not subject to partition, and any purported conveyance, encumbrance, judicial sale or other voluntary or involuntary transfer of an undivided interest in the common elements made without the unit to which that interest is allocated is void.
------------------------------
Do you agree with the position taken by the developer, that now after turnover, they need to pay only their share of the assessed Fees as Owner of their unsold Condo Unit (the ninth Unit the developer built), and not any additional maintenance fees, just because they still have the right to complete the building of the last four (4) remaining Houses, Buildings, Condominium Units?
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
I think the key phrase in 47-249(b) is: "In addition to the liability that a declarant as a unit owner has ..."

It indicates that the declarant can have separate and distinct responsibilities as a unit owner and as a developer.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.

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