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JudithH3 (Ohio)
Posts: 11
Posted:
We have a HOA meeting scheduled in a couple days and I'm unsure about all the proper procedures but I do know the current situation isn't right. According to our bylaws there should be 6 owners elected (with staggered terms) to be on the board. Currently, we have 5 with one person running the show. I had planned to make a motion at the meeting stating the current board members weren't elected and their positions and their decisions should be considered invalid. We received a paper in our door today discussing the upcoming meeting and their decision NOT to elect board members but that the board should SELECT members to be on the board.
This crew is trying to push through raising our monthly dues by about 50% and making unnecessary repairs. At some point can't the rest of us tell them through a vote that they've reached the end of the line.
Any suggestions how I can present this at our meeting?
JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399
Posted:
Hi Judith - before I could respond to your "any suggestions" question, i would need to know whether you are serving on the Board. For a motion to be made at a regular Board meeting, you would need to be serving as a Board member. From your question, I can't tell for sure whether you are on the Board. Are you currently serving on your Board of Directors?

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Along with Jim's question, Judith, would your please cite the exact passage in your bylaws that you ought to have six directors? Almost always, an odd number is stated.

Also, take a look at your other governing documents to see how much dues can be raised in one year. Usually there is a limit; in CA, for instance, it's 20%. so if your own docs don't state a %, your state laws might.

Just for context: how many homes are in your HOA? Do you have a property manager (PM?)
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
The first time you brought this up, I suggested you rally your like minded neighbors to call for a special homeowner's meeting to address the board issue. It seems to me you can still bring up the requirements during the annual meeting and make these folks explain why they will not have an election. All homeowners need to be there to force an election.

When you got this paper, did it have the agenda? Does the agenda include some sort of Q and A section? If so, that's where you'll want to bring this up. Again, you need to have as many like minded people there as possible so if the "person who runs the show" tries to ignore you, someone else can bring it up. Better yet, have all those people sign a petition and present it at the board meeting requesting a formal election be held right then and there.

The key is to rally enough homeowners to push this through because until you make a change there, you won't be able to address the assessment increase and repair issue. You don't say how many days you have, but I suggest you get to work right now and get some people to help you. Good luck!

PS: should you succeed at changing the board, it should take a look at the financials before dumping the 50% increase. Depending on what services the Association provides, you may really have an issue with underfunding and you may still need to have an expert roofer (preferably three) take a look at the roofs and determine once and for all if something needs to be done. I know you said your roof is fine in your last conversation, but you never said if anyone else has complained about a problem, the last time all the roofs were replaced, the condition of your reserves, etc. You don't need to explain all that in this forum, but should take things one step at a time, starting with getting the board issue resolved because they're the ones who will be making these decisions.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
19 units total. In your shoes, I would get proxies signed by 9 other owners that authorized me to vote on their behalf. If you hold a majority (10 votes), you control.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 351
Posted:
How is this a communistic HOA? Not following the CC&Rs really has nothing to do with communism.

Now if they wanted to give your unit away, I would agree.

Please get your ducks in a row when name calling.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
For those who may be interested, here is a link to the thread where Judith first brought this issue up: Subject: not elected board members

My suggestion on how to bring the issue up is to fain ignorance of the issue. Ask a question similar to:

"For those of us who don't understand the process of deciding when a Director is to be elected and when they are to be appointed, could you please go over that process with us?"

This type of question doesn't call anyone to the carpet and shouldn't put them on the defensive. Then see what the answer is.

It's possible that the Board stated that they will select the candidates (i.e. serve as a nomination committee) vs. they will appoint directors (as you indicated will happen).
FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posted:
> How is this a communistic HOA? Not following the CC&Rs really has nothing to do with communism.

Exactly. Autocratic, non-democratic, maybe even fascistic might be right. Words matter.

> fain ignorance

you mean feign ignorance. Spelling matters too, although not as much as words.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
What intrigues me is how many views there are of this topik!!
JudithH3 (Ohio)
Posts: 11
Posted:
I posted my concerns about my managing board because I'm faced with a serious problem that I've had no experience with and asked for some advice. I do not want nor do I need a lesson in choosing the correct word or how to spell. In the future if you don't have anything constructive to say, I am better off without your feedback.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Judith, 19 units and six Board Members? We only have 5 for 132 units. The Board has the right to increase fees unless there is a limit specified in the CC&R's, they also have the right to borrow money, and a duty to maintain the property. Please remember that these Board members are also voting to raise their own assessments.

Also you need to keep in mind that because you have so few units, your share will naturally be larger than communities with more units. i.e. To pay for a $50,000 loan over 5 years each unit would need to pony up approx $45.00 per month just to cover the principle while my fees would only go up approx $6.50 per month.

In addition to your own CC&Rs, I would suggest you become familiar with ORC5311, the statutes governing condominiums. They also lay out powers that the Board has and obligations which might not be found in the CC&Rs.

http://codes.ohio.gov/orc/5311

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 351
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JudithH3 on 01/06/2016 4:41 AM
I posted my concerns about my managing board because I'm faced with a serious problem that I've had no experience with and asked for some advice. I do not want nor do I need a lesson in choosing the correct word or how to spell. In the future if you don't have anything constructive to say, I am better off without your feedback.

Kind of happens when you show up, and on your first post start throwing around incendiary terms like "communistic". Of coarse people are going to respond to that. So there is no reason to act all upset or get mad at all of us. This is a free board, and you deserve the exact answers you pay for.

So the key on any forum to to read the pertinent replies, and quickly scan and ignore the chatter outside the lines. Anger and demands will get you nowhere.
PatriciaP7 (Ohio)
Posts: 9
Posted:
I'm with Glenn on this. Your guideline should be ORC 5311 for Condo associations. We are doing all we can to ensure that our HOA is in line with ORC 5312. I can see however that 5 board members for your size community may make sense. You need executive positions and one more to prevent ties, unless you combined secretary and Treasurer into 1 position. 6 board members makes no sense unless the board president gives up their right to vote, leaving 5 voting members. If I were president and not just a member of the board and an owner myself, I'd have an issue with giving up my vote. We have just under 50 lots/homeowners and a board of 9. I'd say 95% of our homeowners are dual career families with little left over time to volunteer. Our # helps ensure we have a quorum for board mtgs.
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:
This is an aging post but.....

Judith lost me with her assertion that the HOA wants to hike dues to make "unnecessary repairs." I've yet to see an unnecessary repair of any damage on my community's property.

Also, Communism isn't an option for those under it. Buying private property and purposefully agreeing to abide by certain restrictions, when applicable, is free choice.
JudithH3 (Ohio)
Posts: 11
Posted:
Well, here's where we stand today. The individuals on my board were not elected as the bylaws dictate. Some of us not on the board have consulted an attorney and today passed out a notice to all homeowners that we were calling a special meeting to accept the resignations of our invalid board members and immediately hold an election according to our bylaws and elect valid board members. One of the current board members is an attorney and is giving me all kinds of flack: 'I have no authorization to do this' 'I should be ashamed of myself because these people have done such a good job' blah, blah, blah.
I've got a call in to our lawyer for tomorrow but in the mean time, they emailed me that they won't attend our meeting.
By the way, did I mention that we arranged for an inspector from Home Depot to come out and inspect our roofs yesterday. When he arrived, the one member came out screaming at him to put his ladder away and forbade him not to step foot on any of our roofs because they belong to the association. Then she called the cops!
I'm not sure if there's something going on between her and the attorney nor I am confident that all our dues can be accounted for.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
If you can get 9 proxies Judith, you can make all the changes you want. How many proxies do you have?

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
CyrstalB (Maryland)
Posts: 457
Posted:
Judith, I understand your plight, and now that you've engaged attorney's and the cops have been called, just start preparing yourself for a court appearance. These two actions ignite something within both fighting parties that is very hard to extinguish. The current board has dug it's heels in and you have too, and when it's gets to this point, court is and will be the only answer. You're ready to fight, they are ready to fight, but most likely you will have a hard time getting the other neighbors to get into the fight now that it's hit this level. Sorry to be blunt.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JudithH3 on 02/02/2016 10:59 PM

Some of us not on the board have consulted an attorney and today passed out a notice to all homeowners that we were calling a special meeting to accept the resignations of our invalid board members and immediately hold an election according to our bylaws and elect valid board members.

Sounds like the right idea but it is the wrong procedure.

Since elections are challenged in court and sitting Directors are removed by recall, you either:

A) Believe the election was held improperly and thus invalid.
To confirm this belief, you need to challenge the election through the courts.

B) Recognize that the individuals are the Directors of the Association and start a recall effort to remove them.

Trying to do both will muddy any argument you have if it goes to court and cost you more time, energy and money then doing one or the other would have.

You, or a group of you calling a meeting to hold an election is simply wrong procedurally, and any results from such an election would likely be overturned if challenged in court.
Additionally, in my opinion, asking for a resignation does two things:
1) it's a request not a recall and requests can be ignored.
2) It legitimizes the previous election (how can they resign from a position they were improperly elected to).

If you desire to recall the Board, you gather support and petition the Board to hold a special membership meeting for the purpose of recalling the board and, if successful, to elect new directors. The number of signatures you need to call the special membership meeting will be found within your governing documents or applicable State laws (typically corporate laws).

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