rules committee (description)...

Started by JimR24 • 9 replies • 1932 views

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JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399

Posted:

Hi everybody - we are in the process of forming a Covenants (uh Rules) Committee. We have a chairperson named and several of homeowners are willing to serve. We are pleased with how this going....and, so far, we've had considerable interest and participation. The first task of this group (re: an evaluaton of our existing rules) has already been completed.

I am on the Board of Directors and i have been asked to help the group come up with a narrative descripton (with some specifics) of what this Committee will be expected to do.

I was wondering if any of you, who have this kind of Committee, would be willing to share your description....or some thinking about this. What do you think?

Thanks in advance...

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas

GenoS (Florida)
Posts: 4,276

Posted:

Hi, Jim. I think it's a good idea to give your committee some scope so that everyone knows what's expected of it. There's a clear distinction (in FL at least) between covenants, at the highest level of the governing documents, and enacted rules & regulations at the lowest level.

Many people get confused between the two and if a committee gets bogged down without really understanding the difference then the committee will generally go nowhere fast.

I'd start by laying down the distinction between covenants and rules and making it clear which, or possibly both, areas the committee should consider. My HOA did something similar some years back before we moved here. It lasted 3 years, cost several thousand in (wasted) attorney fees, and produced no results other than lowering the amendment provisions of our documents and a couple of new swimming pool rules.

The reason it went awry was one loud voice on the committee that belonged to a woman with a forceful personality who didn't really understand the difference between covenants and ordinary rules & regulations. Nobody ever challenged her interpretation of anything because they understood even less than she did.

I think it's a very good idea to give your committee specific and detailed marching orders about what its remit should be.

JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By GenoS on 12/17/2015 1:36 PM
Hi, Jim. I think it's a good idea to give your committee some scope so that everyone knows what's expected of it. There's a clear distinction (in FL at least) between covenants, at the highest level of the governing documents, and enacted rules & regulations at the lowest level.

Many people get confused between the two and if a committee gets bogged down without really understanding the difference then the committee will generally go nowhere fast.

I'd start by laying down the distinction between covenants and rules and making it clear which, or possibly both, areas the committee should consider. My HOA did something similar some years back before we moved here. It lasted 3 years, cost several thousand in (wasted) attorney fees, and produced no results other than lowering the amendment provisions of our documents and a couple of new swimming pool rules.

The reason it went awry was one loud voice on the committee that belonged to a woman with a forceful personality who didn't really understand the difference between covenants and ordinary rules & regulations. Nobody ever challenged her interpretation of anything because they understood even less than she did.

I think it's a very good idea to give your committee specific and detailed marching orders about what its remit should be.

Excellent GenoS - and i have been thinking the same. And hey, been there-done that on the forceful personality influence...lol...(seems like we all have one or two of those).. ;-) Fortunately, that personality has calmed down considerably with all the other homeowners involved to give their opinions too. So far, i've been real proud of what this group has been able to accomplish.

And yes, i agree about needing to be real clear upfront....and making sure everybody is on the same page. I believe that a clear description is gonna be real important.

Thanks!

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

With Geno, I agree that it's crucial your Board understand & make the distinction between ordinary Rules & Regs which generally are easy to change, and your Covenants (Covenants, Conditions & Restrictions, aka, CC&Rs, aka Declaration) , which generally are difficult to change.

And it should be your Board that writes a charter for this ad hoc Committee, and they've picked you. And I agree you must be very specific as to the Committee's task or scope of work.

I know others who post here have revised their CC&Rs.

We had an ad hoc Rules Committee a few years back, but I don't have the charter that the Board prepared.

JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/17/2015 2:11 PM
With Geno, I agree that it's crucial your Board understand & make the distinction between ordinary Rules & Regs which generally are easy to change, and your Covenants (Covenants, Conditions & Restrictions, aka, CC&Rs, aka Declaration) , which generally are difficult to change.

And it should be your Board that writes a charter for this ad hoc Committee, and they've picked you. And I agree you must be very specific as to the Committee's task or scope of work.

I know others who post here have revised their CC&Rs.

We had an ad hoc Rules Committee a few years back, but I don't have the charter that the Board prepared.

KerryL1, I like the idea about the Board writing the charter for this Committee...and i've already begun making some notes about this. I have on hand the CAI publication titled "Reinventing the Rules: A Step-by-Step Guide to Being Reasonable." Several of our homeowners have already read this publication and believe it gives a good blueprint for how this will be handled in the future.

Thanks!

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

But, Jim is the "Rules" or the Covenants that you want to change???

JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/17/2015 4:56 PM
But, Jim is the "Rules" or the Covenants that you want to change???

Hi Kerry - right now, the only documents which are being addressed are the Rules documents. The Committee prefers to call itself the Covenant Committee and i am fine with that.

Our Rules can be changed by the Board of Directors. If someone were to desire to change the Covenants/Restrictions in our DCC&R, that requires a 2/3 vote of our membership at a meeting in which a quorum is present.

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

In all honesty, I truly think it best if call it the Rules Committee. Rules are NOT covenants though some covenants are rules. You'll avoid a lot of confusion if y'all use the right lingo.

Btw, when we redid our rules, we got rid of several because they were just plain silly or because they are unenforceable.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Jim

I agree with Kerry. Calling it the Covenants Committee only adds to the confusion many have. Call it what it is. Rules and Regulations Committee.

JimR24 (Texas)
Posts: 399

Posted:

Thanks for all of your responses to my question. I have written up a description that i will be sharing with others.

oljim, in texas

Lovin' life with my honey!
and, President of HOA in Texas

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