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KetanP (Virginia)
Posts: 22
Posted:
I have a hearing with my HOA board and in the letter they sent me it states that " you will be give 5 minutes to address the board". I know they are doing this on purpose, giving only 5 minutes... Is there a statute in Virginia that states how much time needs to be allocated to a homeowner or how an hearing should be conducted?

Thanks

KP.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Ketan,

None that I know of. The statute, ยง 55-513, simply states that you have a right to be heard.

It's not uncommon, especially if there are a lot of hearings, for an Association to limit the time. I look at it this way, you have 5 min. to make an opening statement and then there is time for Q&A.

My suggestion: Summarize the whole issue to one page. Use bullet points where needed. Include additional pages if they provide support to statements made on the first page or a bullet point (pictures, statements from neighbors, list of other addresses with the same or similar issues, citations of applicable statutes or governing docs, etc.).

Realistically, if you can't summarize the issue to one page you need to edit the thing down. Typically individuals will only look at anything past the first page if, and only if, the first page got their interest. Having worked in Radio, 5 minutes is a lot of time, especially if you are referencing the document in hand.

For example: you don't need to say There are others who, to my knowledge, have been approved for (insert issue here) while I am being denied. These include name,address; name,address;etc. and all I am asking is to be have the same opportunity others have had.

Simply say: As pointed out in my handout (page x), there are others who have already been granted exceptions. I am simply asking for something the Association has freely granted to others.

I expect that this has to do with your driveway?
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Don't have Time to to read Tim's entire advice.

But there is no reason why you cannot, if you supply bullet -pointed handouts, make your case in five minutes.
JerryD5 (Colorado)
Posts: 218
Posted:
We have had this issue come up a year or so ago. We had a hearing scheduled for a homeowner that was facing a fine for violations. Before the meeting, the homeowner gave us a 4 page response to our hearing letter. At the meeting, I specifically stated to them that the board received and read their response but they have 5 minutes to either restate their position or add additional information not included. They were incensed. "Why don't we get more time?" I responded that this is not a discussion or back and forth. You know where we stand and we know where you stand. If you have additional information, use your 5 minutes wisely. I went on to tell them that we have a limited time for our meeting (plus our MC charges us $95 an hour to attend). They were upset but complied with the time limit. We ended up having a 2nd hearing because they failed to correct all of their violitions. Again, we received a very long response in writing. At the 2nd hearing, I laid out the same ground rules. They protested saying it was unfair and they should be allowed to take additional time. They they quoted an obscure state regulatory agency that stated homeowners had a right to be heard. At the time we had a board member who was also a lawyer and she said that didn't apply to their situation. The homeowner used her 5 minutes to read a statement. In the end, the board still decided to fine the homeowner.

Our MC was really good in guiding us in the hearing process. Because our documents give the board wide latitude to conduct hearings, we as a board decided on the 5 minute limit. We also said we would allow the homeowner to ask questions but any answers would be in writing. This shortened the meeting considerably. It also reduces, in my opinion, the chance for a heated and emotional exchange. This particular homeowner has a reputation for becoming extremely defensive with people that do not agree with their position (in and outside the HOA).

As others have stated, use your time wisely. 5 minutes should be plenty of time to state your position if you are prepared. Use a few bullet statements that support your position.
FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posted:
Longer is not better.

NinaR (Florida)
Posts: 26
Posted:
Your HOA board may have to comply with Robert's Rules of Order. Per our Covenant, "Robert's Rules of Order (latest edition)shall govern the conduct of the meetings."
Robert's Rules allows members to speak for 2 minutes. You may ask for another 2 minutes from the board. Also, members can only speak twice on any one subject. This is basic Parliamentary rules and any organized meeting uses them, School Boards, City Counsel, in fact all Government meetings.

These rules were written to keep meetings moving along. Plenty of words fit into a two minute time period. You should know what is on the agenda and organize your thoughts. Write down points that you want to hit upon. Your board is being very generous in giving you 5 minutes!
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NinaR on 12/01/2015 7:37 AM
Your HOA board may have to comply with Robert's Rules of Order. Per our Covenant, "Robert's Rules of Order (latest edition)shall govern the conduct of the meetings."
Robert's Rules allows members to speak for 2 minutes. You may ask for another 2 minutes from the board. Also, members can only speak twice on any one subject. This is basic Parliamentary rules and any organized meeting uses them, School Boards, City Counsel, in fact all Government meetings.

These rules were written to keep meetings moving along. Plenty of words fit into a two minute time period. You should know what is on the agenda and organize your thoughts. Write down points that you want to hit upon. Your board is being very generous in giving you 5 minutes!

What meetings are you referring to? Most governing docs will require some form of parliamentary procedure for the Annual Meeting.
NinaR (Florida)
Posts: 26
Posted:
Robert's Rules (RR) apply to every meeting, not just the Annual Meeting. RR allows for small casual meetings as well as formal meetings. Here is a great link for you to keep.
http://westsidetoastmasters.com/resources/roberts_rules/chap16.html
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NinaR on 12/01/2015 8:33 AM
Robert's Rules (RR) apply to every meeting, not just the Annual Meeting. RR allows for small casual meetings as well as formal meetings. Here is a great link for you to keep.
http://westsidetoastmasters.com/resources/roberts_rules/chap16.html

Do you even live in an HOA?
NinaR (Florida)
Posts: 26
Posted:
LOL, yes I do. In fact I am the President and what I have written in quotation marks comes straight from our CC&R. I don't know what your rules are. Perhaps you only have to comply with RR for your Annual Meeting?
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 3,868
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NinaR on 12/01/2015 9:21 AM
LOL, yes I do. In fact I am the President and what I have written in quotation marks comes straight from our CC&R. I don't know what your rules are. Perhaps you only have to comply with RR for your Annual Meeting?

I am sure everyone follows some sort of parliamentary procedure religiously.

Are you saying government legislative bodies use Robert's Rule of Order?
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Nina, our HOA's bylaws only requires RONR for members meetings too, but we loosely follow it for board meetings.

CT law, I believe requires RONR for all HOA meetings, but that's the only state I know of.

HOA hearings are different, I think, than members meetings or board meetings.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Nina, our HOA's bylaws only requires RONR for members meetings too, but we loosely follow it for board meetings.

CT law, I believe requires RONR for all HOA meetings, but that's the only state I know of.

HOA hearings are different, I think, than members meetings or board meetings. At our hearings, anyway, there are no motions. We hear the alleged violator's side of the story and ask if s/he has any questions for us. We do not do any back & forth with the person.

Once the person is dismissed, the Board discusses the case and a director makes a motion to levy a fine, suspend a fine or whatever, and a decision is voted on.

Again, I think 5 minutes is plenty of time for Ketan to present his case, assuming it is solely about one alleged violation.
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NinaR on 12/01/2015 8:33 AM
Robert's Rules (RR) apply to every meeting, not just the Annual Meeting. RR allows for small casual meetings as well as formal meetings. Here is a great link for you to keep.
http://westsidetoastmasters.com/resources/roberts_rules/chap16.html

This is not a meeting, it is a hearing. It is essentially an adjudication of the homeowner's rights and is more akin to a court proceeding than a board meeting. In my state, the courts operate under various rules, with the most common being the Arizona Rules of Civil Procedure. These are taken almost directly from the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure.

I know of no rules for any court proceeding that follow Robert's Rules.

CfD (Virginia)
Posts: 265
Posted:
There are no "fines" in Virginia HOAs as I understand it, but if the association intends to "charge" you for a violation of the arch guidelines you have to be given an opportunity to be heard. I don't believe a board has the authority to restrict your time to make your case "unreasonably" in a due process hearing, but obviously you cannot be given an indefinite amount of time to make your case.

You may want to hire a lawyer to represent you at the due process hearing.
KetanP (Virginia)
Posts: 22
Posted:
Thank you everyone for your replies. I have consulted a lawyer who also is surprised that there is limit of 5 minutes imposed to the hearing or for a matter of fact there is a time limit at all. My lawyer is not going to accompany me for a 5 min hearing, which she thinks is waste of time and says that HOA imposing a time limit will be in seen in my favor if I take this to the small courts. Further, any hearing as I understand is for the homeowner/defendant to provide more input and ask questions to the board about their decision so that a home owner can take appropriate steps after the verdict is given . Without giving enough time or setting a time barrier is in my opinion is violation of my rights. I do not know if imposing a time limit is legally applicable and hence I posted this question.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Ketan, hasn't the board put its concerns in writing when it invited you to a hearing? In other words, do you not already know what the "issues" are? an when the Board gives its decision, won't that be in writing so that you know the reasons?
JerryD5 (Colorado)
Posts: 218
Posted:
Ketan, you have to realize when you buy a home in a HOA, you have given up a lot of rights. You might have given up a right to park in the street or even in your driveway. You give up a right to keep trash cans out any day of the week vs just trash day. You might have even given up your right to speak more than 5 minutes at a hearing. The HOA listed their rules and you agreed to those rules when you bought your home. It may be in your documents how your board conducts their hearings (reading of the violation, date, attempts to notify the homeowner, etc). We have it in ours. It does not specifically state a 5 minute limit for homewowners. It allows us to do hearings as the board sees fit. Since we have been given such a wide latitude to conduct our hearings, we just have to ensure we do it across the board. For example, we can't conduct a hearing for 1 homeowner and do it differently for another homeowner.

I suspect if you dig into your CC&Rs, by-laws or other rules/regulations, you will find either the 5 minute limit or the ability by the board to conduct meetings as they see fit.

IF you think the 5 minutes is too constrictive, you should ask if you can hand over a more in-depth written answer to the violation. Perhaps your board will read it and consider it when they deliberate.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JerryD5 on 12/02/2015 1:47 PM
Ketan, you have to realize when you buy a home in a HOA, you have given up a lot of rights. You might have given up a right to park in the street or even in your driveway. You give up a right to keep trash cans out any day of the week vs just trash day. You might have even given up your right to speak more than 5 minutes at a hearing. The HOA listed their rules and you agreed to those rules when you bought your home. It may be in your documents how your board conducts their hearings (reading of the violation, date, attempts to notify the homeowner, etc). We have it in ours. It does not specifically state a 5 minute limit for homewowners. It allows us to do hearings as the board sees fit. Since we have been given such a wide latitude to conduct our hearings, we just have to ensure we do it across the board. For example, we can't conduct a hearing for 1 homeowner and do it differently for another homeowner.

I suspect if you dig into your CC&Rs, by-laws or other rules/regulations, you will find either the 5 minute limit or the ability by the board to conduct meetings as they see fit.

IF you think the 5 minutes is too constrictive, you should ask if you can hand over a more in-depth written answer to the violation. Perhaps your board will read it and consider it when they deliberate.


While I agree with Jerry, Covenants/Bylaws are generally not as finely specified to say things such as you will have 5 minutes to appeal, but they are typically general enough to say you will abide by the BOD's Rules/Regulations/Decisions which you signed a document/contract to do so.

Now if you care to discuss billable hours with your attorney, I am sure she would love to take it on. Remember what free advice is worth. It is worth what you paid for it. Nothing.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
If you can't make your case in 5 minutes, you don't have a defense worth speaking about. Most only need 2 minutes to speak to make a point. Many City council meetings have such time limits at their meetings.

I don't see 5 minutes as a hindrance or impossibility. The time constraint is irrelevant and seems to be a focus point to distract from the real issue. Which you don't mention what that is. Maybe if we knew what the hearing was about we could assist you in making your point/defense in that 5 minute time frame.

Former HOA President

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