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RQ (Mississippi)
Posts: 6
Posted:
First off, I’m sorry to have written a book. I live in a rural community that has an HOA that basically maintains the ditches, keeps the roads paved, maintain community swimming areas, piers, etc…. Our community has around 130 homes and roughly the same number of people who own lots (for hunting and fishing privileges) but do not have a home. We are a close-knit community but we are facing problems that do not have easy or clear solutions.

For many years the BOD was mostly comprised of homeowners who unscrupulously two sought to profit from their position on the board by “selling” the HOA services from the businesses that they owned. In the last three years the BOD has turned over 5 of the 7 BOD positions and the HOA has stopped hemorrhaging money into the coffers of the directors. Of the two remaining directors, “Dan” never shows up for meetings and the other director has no power to write himself checks from the like he did previously.

Over the past year the HOA board has made great strides in improving transparency, catching up on maintenance items that languished over the previous decade, addressing homeowners’ suggestions for future enhancements as well as prioritizing those enhancements and budgeting for them in the coming years.

One of the biggest problems we face comes from the HOA board member Dan. Nearly every single hoodlum that comes into our community and vandalizes signs, destroys property, and generally terrorizes our community starts coming here as a friend of Dan, but usually as a friend of Dan’s daughter’s live-in sociopath boyfriend “Ted” first.

Dan owns four lots and has 14 or more cars. At least a third of them are non running. His house is decently maintained but he has an outbuilding whose roof is collapsing and has a 4’ by 4’ bin full of beer cans in front if it that is overflowing. Ted throws parties nearly every weekend and the residents have to call the cops, who rarely respond. Ted’s friends also come to our community with loud trucks speed up and down our streets. It’s a complete nightmare.

What’s worse, our security building at the community entrance was recently the victim of arson. Most everyone suspects Ted, and Ted has bragged to several in our community that he was the one who torched it. Our local sheriff’s department—the same one that doesn’t respond to complaints filed on Dan—conducted an “investigation” but nothing happened. Nothing ever happens. Just weeks after threatening on social media to throw bricks through residents’ windshields who drive too past his house, he buys a race car and drag races it down the street multiple times a week for months on end. The police would do nothing, even with video recordings of this very illegal and very dangerous activity.

Ted has also been witnessed selling drugs multiple times in the main common area of our community.

It goes without saying that this one household is the root of 90% of our community’s most pressing problems. The sheriff’s department has been no help, even after contacting state representatives. We are at our wit’s end.

That said, our CC&Rs are past due for revision since our bylaws state that they are to be updated every 20 years and they have not been updated since the early 1970s. Our bylaws state that the CC&Rs don’t have to be voted on. We are bringing the CC&Rs up to current
We are setting up a fine schedule to tackle some of the more egregious offenses that are practically unenforceable currently. I feel like our only option is to run Dan (and thus Ted) out of the community by levying fines against him for his transgressions. It’s dirty, I know, but everyone is scared of Ted, since he has a propensity for violent behavior and doesn’t care one bit to torch anyone’s house. (the security building is not the first structure he has bragged about burning). He’ll do it, too. Who can blame him for feeling like the Teflon Don… he’s terrorized this community since the early 2000s with absolutely zero repercussions.

Voting Dan off the board will be easy as pie…he doesn’t attend any of the meetings, but gets voted back in every election cycle because of a small collection of dedicated groupies who think he hung the moon. Getting Dan to clean up his property and oust Ted will be the huge hurdles.

If levying fines is not the way to go, how does this HOA move to end this decade long nightmare if law enforcement isn’t any help?
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
It's frustrating, but the HOA aren't law enforcement, so you and your neighbors will need to continue reporting the criminal matters to the police department, and if you can, get your local representatives involved (city or county - state representatives may not be much help, as you've seen).

If you have some sort of language in your documents about creating or harboring nuisances (even if they are 20 years old), the association may be able to go after Dan in court. To keep him off the board, you and your like minded homeowners will have to rally together to vote him out. Sure, he may have some friends who keep voting him in, but they're succeeding because everyone else is sitting around wringing their hands and not coming to the meetings to vote! You're working on setting up a fine schedule, so as soon as that's done and has been approved by the homeowners, start documenting everything and levying the fines. Be prepared to go to court, as I suspect he'll be yelling about selective enforcement.

Check with your county to see if it has any regulations regarding inoperable cars. In our city, all cars must have current licenses and be operable - if Dan is using his lots for a junkyard, that may be another way to pressure him.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
RQ (Mississippi)
Posts: 6
Posted:
Thank you for your insight. I will make an agenda item to discuss adding language regarding harboring a nuisance. I am in total agreement that increased voter participation is what is needed to keep this troublemaker off the board. We have been having increasing attendance to the fall meetings every year for the last 3 years, and I attribute the turnover from the less-scrupulous old HOA board to this new, enthusiastic board that wants to see the current rules enforced (and fairly).

I will check with our county regarding inoperable cars, but seeing as this is rural Mississippi I doubt there are any ordinances against it.

Dan will probably try to "rally the troops" against the HOA Board if push comes to shove, but 99% of the traffic coming into our neighborhood has to drive past his junk yard/used car lot so it's a vocal minority at best.

We definitely have to get the word out to vote on the new CC&Rs this spring.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
You might consider hiring an off duty deputy or two to patrol your HOA, expensive yes but unlike security guards, they have police powers and can issue tickets and arrest people.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Whoa, RQ, this really is a nightmare!

Can you succinctly say again why you cannot invite Dan to hearings now and fine him? In addition, do you CC&Rs give the Board the ability to withdraw privileges, e.g.., pool access for those who repeatedly break your rules, e.g., speeding?
BobD4 (up north)
Posts: 1,002
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RQ on 11/23/2015 1:59 PM
I live in a rural community ....We are a close-knit community but we are facing problems that do not have easy or clear solutions. . . . One of the biggest problems we face comes from the HOA board member Dan. . . . Dan owns four lots and has 14 or more cars. . . . Our local sheriff’s department—the same one that doesn’t respond to complaints filed on Dan—conducted an “investigation” but nothing happened. Nothing ever happens. . . . The police would do nothing, even with video recordings of this very illegal and very dangerous activity. . . . Ted has also been witnessed selling drugs multiple times in the main common area of our community. . . . We are setting up a fine schedule to tackle some of the more egregious offenses that are practically unenforceable currently. I feel like our only option is to run Dan (and thus Ted) out of the community by levying fines against him for his transgressions. . . . Voting Dan off the board will be easy as pie…he doesn’t attend any of the meetings, but gets voted back in every election cycle because of a small collection of dedicated groupies who think he hung the moon. Getting Dan to clean up his property and oust Ted will be the huge hurdles. If levying fines is not the way to go, how does this HOA move to end this decade long nightmare if law enforcement isn’t any help?

RQ(Mississippi) ; You do not mention your HOA having either a lawyer or professional property manager, but maybe you need both to unseat "Dan" for reasons alleged.

Respectfully, if whatever can be proven about your claims so far - for whatever reason - has not been sufficient to trigger your (rural) law enforcement to your liking, what makes you think that HOA enforcement will do so ?

If HOA enforcement actually curtails Dan & cronies' shenanigans, do you think he will bother choosing merely a lawful response like insisting that HOA rules be applied uniformly / non-discriminatorly ?

Respectfully, might it be easier to just quietly sell with things improving for now ?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
RQ,

I doubt you need any such langauge about harboring a nuisance.

Typically the governing documents already has a nuisance clause.
Typically the governing documents already specify that the member is responsible for the actions of their family members, guests and tenants.

You likely need to simply start enforcing the governing documents.

Of course, you need proof (not an I say you say argument).
Additionally, if you have proof regarding the vandalism, provide that to the police.
PitA
Posts: 1,416
Posted:
Have y'all joined forces with Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson ?

Or hired armed security ?

Or installed web-cams ?

Or instituted any petitions for protective order(s) ?

Or gotten together to 'buy him out' ?



What actions have y'all taken so far ?

Asked the www for advice ?

You have now received same.
RQ (Mississippi)
Posts: 6
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 11/23/2015 6:40 PM
Whoa, RQ, this really is a nightmare!

Can you succinctly say again why you cannot invite Dan to hearings now and fine him? In addition, do you CC&Rs give the Board the ability to withdraw privileges, e.g.., pool access for those who repeatedly break your rules, e.g., speeding?

The CC&Rs were written in 1976 and have not been updated. In its brief six pages, there are no provisions for withdrawing privileges for anything other than non-payment of dues.

Quote:
Posted By GlenL on 11/23/2015 4:14 PM
You might consider hiring an off duty deputy or two to patrol your HOA, expensive yes but unlike security guards, they have police powers and can issue tickets and arrest people.

We had armed security through 2013, but then he was unable to continue guard duty past the summer of that year.

Quote:
Posted By BobD4 on 11/23/2015 7:41 PM

RQ(Mississippi) ; You do not mention your HOA having either a lawyer or professional property manager, but maybe you need both to unseat "Dan" for reasons alleged.

Respectfully, if whatever can be proven about your claims so far - for whatever reason - has not been sufficient to trigger your (rural) law enforcement to your liking, what makes you think that HOA enforcement will do so ?

If HOA enforcement actually curtails Dan & cronies' shenanigans, do you think he will bother choosing merely a lawful response like insisting that HOA rules be applied uniformly / non-discriminatorly ?

Respectfully, might it be easier to just quietly sell with things improving for now ?

We don't have a professional property manager, but the HOA does have a lawyer.

I have no doubt that Dan and cronies will blatantly ignore any action by the HOA, but I suppose financial penalties and the subequent lien may force him to act. 95% of the homes here follow the rules, but the sad fact is that the rules have been unenforced since the 1976. Now that the "good guys" have control of the HOA board things are finally starting to turn around and we will update the CC&Rs and begin uniformly applying the rules after a well-socialized date.

Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 11/23/2015 10:26 PM
RQ,

I doubt you need any such langauge about harboring a nuisance.

Typically the governing documents already has a nuisance clause.
Typically the governing documents already specify that the member is responsible for the actions of their family members, guests and tenants.

You likely need to simply start enforcing the governing documents.

Of course, you need proof (not an I say you say argument).
Additionally, if you have proof regarding the vandalism, provide that to the police.

There is a clause regarding responsibility for the actions of family members and guests, but no consequences or fine schedules have ever been drafted/approved so the prior HOA felt as though the clause had no teeth.

Quote:
Posted By PitA on 11/24/2015 5:56 AM
Have y'all joined forces with Mr. Smith and Mr. Wesson ?

Or hired armed security ?

Or installed web-cams ?

Or instituted any petitions for protective order(s) ?

Or gotten together to 'buy him out' ?



What actions have y'all taken so far ?

Asked the www for advice ?

You have now received same.

See armed security question answer above. We had security cameras installed at our guard shack, but the DVR was destroyed in the fire. Unfortunately our neighborhood does not have broadband internet service so the DVR had to be located with the cameras. Fortunately we are getting gated access next spring and internet service next month so future security cameras will transmit video to an offsite location.

A couple of guys have been banned from property by the district judge for trespassing and felony destruction of property. Once the guard shack burned in October and the security cameras went with it, one of the guys has been seen on the property several times.

Buying Dan out is not an option since it would require participation on his part.
PitA
Posts: 1,416
Posted:
{1} A couple of guys have been banned from property by the district judge for trespassing and felony destruction of property. Once the guard shack burned in October and the security cameras went with it, one of the guys has been seen on the property several times.

{2} Buying Dan out is not an option since it would require participation on his part.


1 - Notify the court and have them arrested.

2 - Make it worth his while - $26,000 over market = $200 per home cost after resale less closing costs

or

make his life so miserable HE decides to move - may cost y'all bigger $$$$$
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Get together with others and draft a fine schedule now. Add withdrawal of common area privileges. Have your Owners vote on it. what % of owners needed to approve it to amend your CC&Rs?

See if there's anything in your state laws that let you set up a fine schedule withOUT amending your CC&Rs.

Fines ARE effective, especially if they potentially double after repeats of the same offenses . The withdrawal of privileges works too.

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