HAO Board Quorum at Committee Meetings-Florida

Your question was a bit hard to follow (then again I haven't had my coffee yet!) Are you asking if committee meeting can morph into a Board meeting because all the Board members happen to be there? If so, I would think no, but that would depend on your documents (you did check them, didn't you?)

Most associations have other types of meetings for information purposes, which is what this one sounds like. The committee will present their proposal, explain why and how it came to be and allow homeowners to ask questions (thus the statement about urging everyone to attend.) Board members are still homeowners, after all and if they aren't part of the committee, it makes sense for them to hear the proposal they may be voting on.

Your documents will also explain when and how the budget becomes official - perhaps your committee wants to get feedback so they can tweak it and then present it to the Board for approval. If the homeowners approve the budget, the committee can then present the revisions and hopefully, explain why some suggestions were incorporated and others weren't.

As for the Board, it meets at regular dates and times, and homeowners should get notification of that as required in the documents. This isn't a Board meeting.

It depends, JohnC, whether FL laws permit members of the Board to speak in this particular setting.

We actually have a written legal opinion that says that in CA, in exactly the same circumstances that Harvey describes, a quorum of directors may attend but may NOT speak. They must remain mute. If less than a quorum, individual directors may speak.

I and 2 other directors often attend our HOA's monthly Finance Committee meetings. The treasurer, a director, is the FC chair and the Prez usually attends as an ex officio member (non-voting per our documents). We're a Board of 7, so often a quorum attends. Because of our attorney's opinion, the directors in the audience must not speak. This can, indeed, be frustrating. But I still can get a feeling for the FC's reasoning for their recs to the Board.

If, Harvey, the Committee wants feedback from the Board at this meeting, they should call a joint meeting of the Budget Committee and the Board.

I Know you hate this JohnC, and you'll probably huff & puff, but it may be the law in FL too. What you "say" may not mater. So, perhaps Harvey wants to check with their HOA counsel. It probably isn't spelled out in their own docs.

It's a good question, Harvey. There are 6 directors in my HOA. 5 of them plus one other homeowner constitute the finance committee. The finance committee meets monthly and proper notice is always posted ahead of time, but we do not count it as a board meeting. Perhaps a judge might disagree. We discuss things and make recommendations to the full board which then votes at the regular board meeting where the finance committee chairman regularly provides a written report that summarizes what went on at the finance committee meeting. All our meetings are open.

Personally I think these "finance committee" meetings ARE, in fact, board meetings as defined by FS 720. Nobody here is going to make an issue of it, however. I would have a bigger problem with the arrangement were it not for the fact that every director on the finance committee - with the exception of the chairman - would gladly step down if someone else in the community came forward and volunteered to serve on it.

It's the same in Florida, Kerry. The statute defines a "board meeting" as any time a quorum of directors comes together to discuss "association business", and finances are certainly association business.

One of the reasons the finance committee is so large is irregular attendance. There are 3 who can be counted on to make every meeting, the president sits in when he has time, and another who travels a lot and is only around every other month or so. The non-board homeowner only ever attends the last couple of meetings leading up to the budget proposal for the next year.

Sorry, JohnC--our lawyer would say your approach is just an obvious method to try to get around the law. "interactive input," indeed!

Hmmm, Geno. Perhaps your HOA doesn't really need an FC. Ours, too, only has decent attendance around budget time. And until very recently never questioned the reports from our PM that they receive.

Please reread my summary of our HOA attorney's opinion, JohnC and point out where I wrote a directors may attend such meetings.

It may not be "fair," but it does guarantee that if a quorum of the Board discusses HOA biz, it happens in a meeting of the Board about which all homeowners have been notified and who can read the agenda too 4 days in advance of an open meeting.

I know you dislike this kind of openness, JohnC, and your Board in SC doesn't need t practice it, but we do have to practice it in CA and it sounds like FL too. I'm not sure who this is "unfair" to.

Look, JohnC, there are state HOA laws that vary. The OP was not about our opinions of whether these laws should exist. You can go on & on about how restrictive, "unfair," limiting or blah, blah, some states' laws are than others. It just doesn't matter what your opinion is.

I've been on our Board for nine years and we accomplish a great deal at our monthly meetings, occasional special meetings and perhaps one emergency mtg. per year.

And yes, I can say with complete honesty that I never have broken the law against a quorum of us directors discussing assoc. biz outside of a duly noticed meeting. It just is not difficult. I, frankly, am offended that you think I do! But I suspect your suspicion says more about you than about me.

I certainly DO discuss HOA biz outside of meetings --with less than a quorum of us directors. A main reason I & some others first ran 9 years ago was because of an abusive & arrogant board that DID violate CA's Open Meeting Act.

I suppose over those nine years, we've had some liars & cheaters on our 7-member board. Does that mean there shouldn't be rules & laws of all kinds--just because some will break them??

Kerry

This discussion is getting somewhat circular.

My belief is CA and FL have introduced so many "whatevers" to try and protect the rights of association members that they have stepped on their own toes doing such.

We can agree to disagree.