Problem with Neighbor who's also on the Board.

First post so please bear with me.

We purchased a second home back in April with an HOA.

It's in a beautiful lake community with more than half the homes being used as weekend retreats.

One of my neighbors, a full time resident is on the board and has been for over 20 years.
He's made it abundantly clear that his word is "law" with the board. Since we're in the middle of a major renovation, he takes every opportunity to remind us that everything needs to go
through the board- in other words, through him.

At first, it was amusing, now, not so much. The house is two hours away from us so we're only up their on the weekends to meet with our contractor, landscaper etc. I'm tired of him knowing exactly what we're doing on the inside. There's nothing in the by-laws that says I need to discuss an internal make-over with him.
The landscaping only requires that we check to make sure the trees,shrubs and plants are allowed. But now, he's insisting I do certain things that my landscapers thinks is absolutely ridiculous, and that he hasn't done on his own property!

Spoke with a few of the residents. They say he likes to feel important and to just ignore him. Thing is, we can't! He's constantly in our business. Also, he gets paid a salary by the board (which he's on!!) to do various tasks that gives him the right to be on my property whenever he wants.

My question is, isn't it a conflict of interest to be on the board for this long, and then get paid by the board to perform certain jobs? I mean that's all he does- he doesn't work anywhere but there. His entire life is all about the HOA.

What are my rights as a home owner? Can I tell him to stay off my property, and request every correspondence in writing? I'm starting to feel harassed.

I'm sorry.. what??

OK, I don't know what you guys are talking about- but I'd appreciate some advice on how to handle this.

You know, it's kinda rude to ignore a post and mention some kind of obvious internal joke that only a few of you get.

I'm at my wits end- this situation is beyond frustrating and this is the only forum I was able to find- was hoping for advice.

If I presumed incorrectly, and you guys don't offer help, then mods please feel free to delete this thread.

First of all, exactly how does his job allow him to come onto your property?

Second of all, have you thought of getting agro? Just tell him to STFU?

Thanks, appreciate this.

Thanks, Richard.

Yes. Feel free to get involved with the HOA


Yes

Is this not a whole board decision? It is NOT up to one member, it should be brought to ALL the board. It may be annoying or time consuming to do so. However, the proper process should be to present changes/ideas to the board as a whole. Plus put it in writing. Make sure it's signed off by the board and not just one member. The President should sign off or the head of the ACC if you have one.

There is a reason why I said it would be nice for JonD1 to respond as he is the President of his Board in New York.

So from what I can gather, the person you have been in contact with is, and I am just assuming, is the President of the Board. Most other Board members generally wouldn't be saying "their word is law". Second, if he is the President, by his title, is the spokesperson for the Board and Association. In addition, unlike other states, Board meetings, according to Jon, are NOT open to members.

Him being "Security" and getting paid for it, yes, I do believe that is a conflict of interest.

If this is a self managed HOA, with no professional management company, think you are going to have to research your governing documents very thoroughly to possibly recall or vote him out at election time.

Thanks everyone.

There is no management company, it's just the HOA.

He is not the president, but that doesn't matter. For whatever reason everything goes through him. As one homeowner put it "he has the board in his pocket". I think it's because he does favors for free. Like fix things up on their property, mows the lawn, clears the snow, things of that sort. So they let him do what he wants.

@RichardP13 I'm not familiar with NY State law regarding meetings, but our board of director meetings did allow home owners to attend, they're just not allowed to participate. In fact, the first meeting we went to was a director meeting, but like I said, we couldn't speak.

@JerryD5 You called it- extreme power trip.

I requested the articles of incorporation, and the CC&R as we didn't receive anything but the condensed version of the by-laws at closing. I was told there was a fee, gave him a check but still don't have the documents, this was almost a month ago.

We will be installing cameras as part of a security system. Thing is, there's a major renovation going on right now so we can't do it for at least another 3-4 months.

@MARKM31- These are houses. We all own our own house and land. Everyone's property is also at least an acre so there's no reason to ever be near another persons house.

In my state, he would need to have state-approved training and be licensed as a security guard. Don't know about NY.

In most states the HOA's insurance carrier would have a fit if it knew that a board member was out "patrolling" with or without a firearm.

Just because he is the HOA's security guard does not mean he is your security guard. The HOA normally has no authority to enter onto its members' properties.

If this guy is really bugging you this much then hire an attorney and seek an injunction to keep his nose out of your business.

Sorry to hear about your troubles. Sounds like this gentleman is quite a PIA.
My guess if what the neighbors say is true going to the board will be ineffective.
So you are left with two choices handle this yourself or involve the police.
In most cases the work being done inside the homes is none of his business.
As to the landscaping in many cases the HOA might have a say about how that is handled.

First off I would avoid dealing with directly in his capacity as a board representative. That gives him power. Make all requests directly to the board either at a meeting or in writing. Do not put yourself in the position where you depend on him for anything.

Now if you,plan to handle this yourself I would suggest you request he not enter onto your property uninvited again or the police will be called.
Depending on the type of person you are dealing with this might fix the problem if not then you must follow up with a call to the police.
You mentioned WE bought a house. Is their a husband in the picture? Perhaps he could impress upon this gentleman the ignorance of visiting someone else's property uninvited. If not perhaps you could invite some large, unpleasant male friends who just had a real bad day to enlighten this man to the reality he is not a welcomed guest on your property. Sometimes some men feel they have more wiggle room imposing on women rather than a man. Sad but true.
Perhaps, swing by the police station introduce yourself and ask what they might be able to do. My suggestion use the state police rather than the local Mayberry police.

In life people test you and try to determine just how much they can get away with. They will push. It is important to teach those folks they will be subject to
pushback. My hope if you send the message clear enough he will find someone else upon whom to impose his importance. Be direct!

I must apologize for the ignorant behavior of Richard and Banks. People such as yourself come here with a serious problem and they see this as an opportunity to score some points like grade schoolers.

Richard is an ignoramus from California who used to sell bad mortgage products to unsuspecting clients. When that gig dried up he got into property management although for years you was unable to manage the affairs within his own HOA. His comment about NY being a state where meetings were closed as you found out was in fact wrong. Like much of what Richard says. But not actually knowing never stops folks like Richard from explaining everything to everybody. Plainly put he is a blowhard who would like everyone to think he is the burning bush on all things HOA. Yeah right....

Banks offered to you the best she has. To many years spent out in the cornfields of Iowa have taken a toll. Her one accomplishment as it pertains to HOAs was being sued by her own. So she trolls on sites like this designed for board members and those that actually volunteer their time, never having served in any capacity in HOA governance with nothing to offer but the blind support of fools who tell her what she wants to hear. Banks is an empty suit. You will get nothing of value from her.

Now ignorant people need to join forces to convince themselves someone sees it their way. Not understanding the person supporting them is dumber than they are. And that person's support reflects poorly on their positions. That is far to complicated for either Richard or Banks to comprehend as combined they have the IQ of a carrot.

Sometimes it is necessary to be direct. Hopefully, my example above gives you some idea of how to send a clear message to morons.

Good luck Michelle

Keep in mind you agreed to the terms of the CC&Rs when you purchased the property. If that requires sending things through the Board for approval, then that is what is required.

This individual, regardless of how this individual is presenting things, is simply one vote on the Board.


A conflict of interest doesn't mean that it's illegal (unless it wasn't disclosed ahead of time).
Conflict of interests are certainly ill-advised, but if the Board is aware and fine with the conflict, then that is how it works.


Your rights are outlined with the Association governing documents and applicable laws.
As far as approvals/disapprovals, I would absolutely insist on everything being in writing. This provides documentation for everyone and eliminates some issues when things are not understood.


Normally I would say yes. However, you had already posted that his job with the association gives him the right to enter your property. Therefore, this will depend on what your governing documents say.

However, simply because he works security doesn't mean that he may enter your property. Even the police do not enter private property without permission, unless they are chasing a suspect.

You should first read the job description of the security position and see if this individual is overstepping their authority.


This may be your biggest issue. If the Board is mainly made up of those who are not (as I call them) resident members, then the Board may be relying on this individual to do a bulk of the work and won't want to upset that arrangement.

You may need to find out who is on the Board and see about talking to one of them about the issues you are experiencing.

I think his being there for 20 years is part of why he has so much influence, as TimB4 says. Others who are part-time residents will see him as having his finger on the pulse of the community and may be fine with that. I'm curious what sort of landscaping he wants you to do, having not done it himself. Your association's governing documents will tell you what kind of landscaping restrictions are in place.

I wouldn't start off immediately with a hostile confrontational stance, although you may need to go there eventually. A simple and still-sorta-friendly, "You know, the HOA doesn't really have any say on what we do to the inside of the house, and we'd like you to stay out of it."

See how that goes. And be prepared for starting to deal with the board through the US mail. If you're a few hours away the last thing you want is a bunch of phone calls, unless you are able (legally) to record them and create transcripts. Start with written communication and stick with it for the most contentious issues.

MichelleK5 (NY)

Presuming that you have bought a resale existing home in lake country with some renovations no closer to completion than 3 or 4 months, you may be well served to discreetly hire a competent lawyer - maybe not local - and retrieve and master the full CCRs/governance documents backwards & forwards yourself.

This gentleman - annoying or otherwise - will be your neighbour and either a BIG help to you (as a non resident ) or big PIA for years with some scope to make life miserable big time.

As a lakefront community owner I know how deep the cronyism can go but how valuable it can be if put to work for you.

Once you know the full docs thoroughly, you may ( ? ) even want to sit down with the guy to run your tentative plans past him. You (may)want to at least listen to him or fake listening.

At that time you will be in a credible position to know how much he ( and other neighbours) can be accommodated, and where the intervention boundary line can be drawn. Whatever the scenario, you are now in a slightly different time zone, not onsite, not in an inner city.

Consider if there may be concerns about "where you are going" within the mature community.

One of the first things may also be to locate monumented survey boundaries and - through CCRs, state & local fence law - determine what type of offset or boundary line fencing can be erected.

You may need to ultimately plant CCR-compliant privacy trees/shrubs in lieu of medieval moat.

Hopefully you can redirect him to be an asset to you as a non-resident owner.

Good luck to you and your husband. Sorry we all got off on the wrong foot here, but in general it's a pretty helpful place. The signal-to-noise ratio is very good once you figure out how to get past the rough edges. Please stick around, or at least give us an update in a few months when things have settled down.

Hi there -

While you're right, he can be a tremendous asset for part timers such as us, I just can't bring myself to have much more to do with him.
We tried listening to him, but all he does is boast and make demands. We tried laughing it off and that didn't work either. I believe there's something really wrong with him.

We did a survey to determine where our exactly our property lines were. We did so in the hopes of getting a fence, we were denied. Fencing is not allowed. I did not know this. In fact, I was told they were allowed and saw a few myself. Turns out, that was changed and I didn't receive the by-laws until closing. Since I didn't confirm the fencing myself, I can't blame anyone.

We are doing privacy shrubs though. I even went over them with him before committing. He said he was fine with it, but of course a week later I got an earful about prior approval. Even though, the only thing the board needs to see (according to the bylaws) is what I'm planting since not everything is allowed. Other than that, no prior approval is needed. I just think he took an instant dislike to us for the sheer fact that now he has neighbors. The previous owners lived out of state and were never there. They paid him to look after the property.

Sounds, good, Michelle. The "writing" that you want, I'd think, is from the board president, not from Mr. J. UNLESS he can show you something in writing that gives him the authority to do x, y or z.

MichelleK5( NY) :
". . . We did a survey to determine where our exactly our property lines were. We did so in the hopes of getting a fence, we were denied. Fencing is not allowed. I did not know this. In fact, I was told they were allowed and saw a few myself. Turns out, that was changed and I didn't receive the by-laws until closing. Since I didn't confirm the fencing myself, I can't blame anyone. . . "

Rarely are bucks wasted on competent (boundary)survey professionals.

The last thing you would want are your plantings & disturbance straying onto this particular neighbour's domain.

You may want to have additional pins placed if there is a loss of sightlines, bearing in mind that they need to be placed & visible enough to be marked to avoid tractor/lawnmower cutter damage. There may be alternative ways to trigger your future non-intrusive surveillance devices.

Worth going the extra mile to avoid lots of negative interactions down the road. As the 'outsider' you readily can be made to look like the Taliban.

Contacted the records department at my county clerks office this morning.

They said I need to come in and get it, and they charge .25₵ a page.

The original CC&R has a ton of amendments. Then a few years ago, it was revised. After the revision, there were more amendments.

I'll be driving up early this Friday and getting a copy. She gave me all the book numbers and pages so it should be a quick.

Unfortunately, they don't take payment over the phone, nor will they email anything.