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LindaK5 (California)
Posts: 242
Posted:
I'm currently the Secretary of our Association Board.

We have a tenant that lives in one of the units who states she is taking over the "property management" of the unit.

I just received an e-mail from her father (homeowner) today and he stated that he has "appointed his daughter to manage the property." He has recently moved out of the area and is probably just passing on the responsibility.

Two concerns here: First, the daughter has known mental health issues which have been a problem in the past. Two, isn't a Limited Power of Attorney required for the homeowner to do something like this?

Is there a civil code citing this or when your CC&Rs/Declaration speaks of "members" (homeowners), that is the extent of whom we should be communicating with?

Thanks!

NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Hi Linda

Isn't this the same issue that you asked about in a prior post?

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Not quite sure what your concerns are or what you now hope to accomplish.

Simply put the homeowner can appoint any person to manage their property such as a real estate agent or property manager.

This would require simple notification without the need for a POA.

We have several units with out of state owners who have their units mama need by others. In this case that other happens to be the owner's daughter.

Why do you wish to hinder this arrangement? Why do you feel the need to impose addition unnecessary paperwork.

Rather simple, the contact person for this property from this point on would be the daughter.
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Not quite sure what your concerns are or what you now hope to accomplish.

Simply put the homeowner can appoint any person to manage their property such as a real estate agent or property manager.

This would require simple notification without the need for a POA.

We have several units with out of state owners who have their units mama need by others. In this case that other happens to be the owner's daughter.

Why do you wish to hinder this arrangement? Why do you feel the need to impose addition unnecessary paperwork.

Rather simple, the contact person for this property from this point on would be the daughter.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
The 'manager' would NOT be a member of the association.

The member/owner may have whomever they wish 'manage', but, the member/owner is still the responsible party and the 'communicant'.

How their mail is 'picked up' is their business.

But they are contractually the member/owner REGARDLESS.

For voting, they need to appoint an actual proxy.

Their POA may, or may not, include proxy powers.

IMO: For any 'official' important business the HOA should deal with the actual member.

"Membership is appurtenant to and may not be separated from ownership." is the general legal wording found in most Covenants.

D'OH
LindaK5 (California)
Posts: 242
Posted:
JonD1 - my concern (and the Board's concern) is that the daughter, whom says she is going to manage the property, has known mental health issues and has been a detriment to the community in many ways. Ongoing problems and issues.

John B26 - thanks for your responses. You covered it completely. I am mainly concerned with her "purported" ability to vote and handle financial issues, but your post cleared that up for me.
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Linda ... Keep in mind it does not matter if the HOA believes the daughter has any mental health issues as that is a mute point. The issue is the parent has put the HOA on notice that his daughter is managing his affairs with regards to his property and is his right to designate. The parent and current owner is elderly and at some point most likely the daughter will inherit. It potentially would be best interest to have somewhat good relationship now than major battles in future because daughter has vendetta for past treatment by HOA. Potentially for voting issues the parent needs to follow the governing docs and your state laws.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Nearly 1 in 5 Americans suffers from some form of mental illness. If you are so concerned, maybe you should start evicting them. Just not sure how you are going to screen out the new buyers and tenants with mental illness - some of them hide it. Or maybe those houses should remain vacant because a person with mental illness once lived there. Now there's a solution for you.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
MarkM31 (Washington)
Posts: 556
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By NpS on 02/17/2015 1:11 AM
Nearly 1 in 5 Americans suffers from some form of mental illness. If you are so concerned, maybe you should start evicting them. Just not sure how you are going to screen out the new buyers and tenants with mental illness - some of them hide it. Or maybe those houses should remain vacant because a person with mental illness once lived there. Now there's a solution for you.

Of coarse NpS knows it is impossible to "evict" any property owner anywhere in the US
LindaK5 (California)
Posts: 242
Posted:
Thanks, Janet - your input was well received.

NpS - I'm appalled at your response to my post. I merely pointed out that there are mental health issues here because this person is volatile and has a history of pretty much being the only person in the community that causes problems. Some years ago she attended an HOA meeting and caused a severe disruption. Hence, I mentioned that when asking about management. As to your other "snide" comments regarding mental health issues in the community .... I'm very familiar with mental health issues, having been diagnosed with one 35 years ago. I also facilitate support groups. It's ridiculous to even consider what you "proposed" in your post, but I suspect it was either an ignorant response or as I said before, a "snide" remark. I'm sorry you feel a need to respond in that way.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LindaK5 on 02/17/2015 8:49 AM
NpS - I'm appalled at your response to my post. I merely pointed out that there are mental health issues here because this person is volatile and has a history of pretty much being the only person in the community that causes problems. Some years ago she attended an HOA meeting and caused a severe disruption. Hence, I mentioned that when asking about management. As to your other "snide" comments regarding mental health issues in the community .... I'm very familiar with mental health issues, having been diagnosed with one 35 years ago. I also facilitate support groups. It's ridiculous to even consider what you "proposed" in your post, but I suspect it was either an ignorant response or as I said before, a "snide" remark. I'm sorry you feel a need to respond in that way.

I make no apologies for my tongue-in-cheek comments. My opening remark was that nearly 1 in 5 Americans suffers from some form of mental illness. If yours is a 100 unit community with 200 residents, that means that nearly 40 people in your community are afflicted. Yet you want to take action against one person because she is mentally ill and she and her dad informed you that she will be taking care of things now that her dad has moved away. In this latest post, you add that you consider her disruptive and she made a scene one time.

In your prior thread, which I consider to be identical to this one, I made the following recommendation:

Quote:
Posted By NpS on 02/09/2015 11:04 PM
You seem to have 2 specific concerns Linda

1. Email that she is now going to manage the unit. I can envision a conversation that dad had with her in which he said that he is moving away, and she now has to take care of certain things herself. And she communicated that to you. If I was in your shoes, I would not make anything of it. He'll continue to pay the assessments. And so far, she hasn't made any unusual demands. So I don't see why it would be necessary to send something formal-looking to her - which could in itself be confusing and disturbing to her. I would simply email her back thanking her for letting the HOA know of the change.

2. Nasty and volatile emails. In my experience, the best approach is to respond to all emails from this person with consistency, friendliness, and simplicity. Be polite and respectful. If she is disrespectful to you, you can always escalate it to her dad.

Many people with emotional limitations are more afraid of you than you are of them. IMO, taking actions that heighten those fears are likely to be counter-productive.


Apparently you didn't like the empathetic approach. So you started a new thread. And when I asked why you were raising the same issue again, you never responded.

Let me offer another scenario that could just border on reality. After you received the daughter's letter that she was taking over, your response was so "snide" that she turned to her dad in distress. He then wrote a second letter confirming what the daughter had said in her first letter. His letter settled her down, because as we know, he is trying to keep the peace.

But you seem to want to pursue this mental health issue even further. Maybe it's time for you to reconsider your own actions before taking offense at a few tongue-in-cheek comments I made.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
LindaK5 (California)
Posts: 242
Posted:
Actually, per the Board's recommendation, I never responded to her e-mail regarding this issue. Per the Board's request, I drafted a letter to her father asking about "to what extent" did he want his daughter to manage the property.

And, no, I wasn't looking for another response to a question I already posed. Please excuse me for making an error in not recognizing that an answer was in another thread. I accept that I'm not perfect, but apparently that must be a requirement to participate in this forum.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LindaK5 on 02/17/2015 9:58 AM
Please excuse me for making an error in not recognizing that an answer was in another thread. I accept that I'm not perfect, but apparently that must be a requirement to participate in this forum.

We're not always nice to each other. But we do all care about each other. Kind of like a family. Nice to see that you've got a little tongue-in-cheek going on yourself. Welcome to the fray.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LindaK5 on 02/17/2015 9:58 AM
Actually, per the Board's recommendation, I never responded to her e-mail regarding this issue. Per the Board's request, I drafted a letter to her father asking about "to what extent" did he want his daughter to manage the property.

BTW, I think that was the right thing to do.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LindaK5 on 02/17/2015 9:58 AM
Actually, per the Board's recommendation, I never responded to her e-mail regarding this issue. Per the Board's request, I drafted a letter to her father asking about "to what extent" did he want his daughter to manage the property.

And, no, I wasn't looking for another response to a question I already posed. Please excuse me for making an error in not recognizing that an answer was in another thread. I accept that I'm not perfect, but apparently that must be a requirement to participate in this forum.

Linda,

I think that asking the father was the right move. After all, such notification should come from the member.

Trust me, if being perfect was a requirement to participate in this forum, nobody would be here (at least I know I wouldn't be). To see it from our perspective, when a question about an issue gets asked a different way, it looks like the member was shopping for answers (i.e. looking for the answer they wanted to hear). Shopping for answers typically doesn't help anyone. Fortunately, it appears our perspective was wrong and you were simply asking for clarification.

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