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security measures

Started by BonnieG1 • 24 replies • 1871 views

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BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Do any of you use either security cameras, key card entry, or both. If so can you give the pros and cons of these security measures and perhaps tell your experience either good or bad with these systems.

We will be voting on security measures at our annual meeting. If 51% of the members vote no additional security measure the issue will be dropped. But if less than 51% vote for not security measure we will continue. I want 67% of our members to agree to any security system before it is installed.

We have had a rash of thefts so our many of our members are open to installing extra security systems.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Keep in mind cameras do NOT stop crime, they just record it to help in prosecution. I would talk to a police representative for them to give you valuable solutions before proceeding. You need to know what will allow court to prosecute or police to press charges...
Former HOA President
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Hi Bonnie:

Nothing is 100% effective as you always have some circumvent. One of our family properties in Las Vegas uses key cards for common area such as pools. I would contend this at least eliminates certain liabilities because if someone accesses without the card with a member as a guest it is blatant trespassing especially if someone ends up injured.
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 01/30/2015 9:28 PM
Keep in mind cameras do NOT stop crime, they just record it to help in prosecution. I would talk to a police representative for them to give you valuable solutions before proceeding. You need to know what will allow court to prosecute or police to press charges...

When we had the assault on our property, the policemen who responded did advise the use of security cameras. I asked if they could mail be a letter indicating recommendation for security cameras. They told me they could not mail this letter or they could get in trouble. I don't know the reason for the police not being allowed to mail the letter.
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Bonnie:

It most likely is because it is opinion of the officers. The gov entity of the department will not give opinions to individuals as liability issues then arise.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Bonnie, not all who read your question know that your HOA is an apt. style condo right?

How many units?

Where do you have in mind to place the cameras? Who would monitor the cameras?

Is the assault the one against the pizza deliver by a resident? if not, what was this assault? Where did it occur?
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 01/31/2015 4:49 PM
Bonnie, not all who read your question know that your HOA is an apt. style condo right?

How many units?

Where do you have in mind to place the cameras? Who would monitor the cameras?

Is the assault the one against the pizza deliver by a resident? if not, what was this assault? Where did it occur?

Yes, not everyone who reads know this is and apartment style condominium.
It is three floors with 43 units.
We have three entry doors. A camera would be placed at each entry door.
We have a 31 car garage in the building. A camera would be placed at the entry and exit to the garage.
One would be placed outside facing the parking lot. There are not enough garage spaces for all the units.

The assault I was referring to is the one against the pizza delivery man by a resident.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Some quick thoughts - not a comprehensive list by any means:

Pros:
Chance of catching someone in the act.
Possible decrease in insurance premiums.

Cons:
People learn rather quickly where the camera blind spots are.
Risk of vandalism.

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
For your maximum safety and security I recommend a 'roving' armed guard equipped with an HK-500 assault rifle.

BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB26 on 02/01/2015 7:38 AM
For your maximum safety and security I recommend a 'roving' armed guard equipped with an HK-500 assault rifle.


I am taking this a tongue in cheek response and not that you seriously recommend this approach.
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BonnieG1 on 02/01/2015 12:42 PM
Posted By JohnB26 on 02/01/2015 7:38 AM
For your maximum safety and security I recommend a 'roving' armed guard equipped with an HK-500 assault rifle.

I am taking this a tongue in cheek response and not that you seriously recommend this approach.

LOL ... Way our country is heading makes a lot of sense to me.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:

The assault I was referring to is the one against the pizza delivery man by a resident.


The only way to protect the world from the geezers is to allow them (the geezers) to construct a privacy wall and hide.

or

Armed Guards

HOPA HOPA - RAH RAH RAH
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
John,
A privacy wall sounds like an excellent idea. How would a person do that in an apartment style building?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
The sites where you want to place the cameras sound reasonable, Bonnie.

And as Melissa pointed out, they can help identify who broke the rules, did some damage, etc. We, for instance, have twin towers and a camera in our lobby showed a group of people take one of our luggage carts out the front door to do a little joyriding. Our security officers knew what unit they were visiting, so when the cart never was recovered, the unit owner paid for replacing it.

And I do think they can help prevent violations to some extent. But the incident when a pizza deliverer was allegedly asserted by a resider at the resident's door (not the building's door) would not have been captured on camera.
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KerryL1 on 02/02/2015 12:56 PM
The sites where you want to place the cameras sound reasonable, Bonnie.

And as Melissa pointed out, they can help identify who broke the rules, did some damage, etc. We, for instance, have twin towers and a camera in our lobby showed a group of people take one of our luggage carts out the front door to do a little joyriding. Our security officers knew what unit they were visiting, so when the cart never was recovered, the unit owner paid for replacing it.

And I do think they can help prevent violations to some extent. But the incident when a pizza deliverer was allegedly asserted by a resider at the resident's door (not the building's door) would not have been captured on camera.

I guess I did not make it clear where the assault happened. It did not happen at the resident's door, it happened in our entry way. The person who assaulted the delivery man was not the person who had ordered the pizza.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
.... we have come full circle to posting armed security at the gate / entrance ....

I, personally, would NOT guard the aged and senile w/o being armed.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
or

MYOB
JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BonnieG1 on 02/02/2015 10:03 AM
John,
A privacy wall sounds like an excellent idea. How would a person do that in an apartment style building?

Bonnie … you would have to be able to fence the land the building sits upon and be able to meet or exceed any local government ordinances regarding setbacks (distance between fence and buildings). It may not fix your problem, as it would depend if the thefts are being engaged by individuals inside or outside your complex. If the thief is outside the complex then it could be a deterrent, but again nothing is 100% effective. Also, that option will be quite pricey.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
aaaaaaah, $$$$$

just try to get it from old folk who 'may not be here tomorrow'

however, if said wall will isolate the old timers, most likely the surrounding community would chip in WILLINGLY
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JanetB2 on 02/04/2015 3:08 PM
Posted By BonnieG1 on 02/02/2015 10:03 AM
John,
A privacy wall sounds like an excellent idea. How would a person do that in an apartment style building?

Bonnie … you would have to be able to fence the land the building sits upon and be able to meet or exceed any local government ordinances regarding setbacks (distance between fence and buildings). It may not fix your problem, as it would depend if the thefts are being engaged by individuals inside or outside your complex. If the thief is outside the complex then it could be a deterrent, but again nothing is 100% effective. Also, that option will be quite pricey.

We believe the owner who police have told us is a convicted felon is letting people in who are stealing items that are easy to take. (except for the car stolen from our garage.) So this would not fix our problem and a fence around our building even if we wanted it would not be possible as we are adjacent to a care center and although have different boundaries than the care center do share land.

When theft first stared in 2012 the President at the time mentioned changing locks. Other Board members vetoed this idea as we felt at the time this was an "inside" job and changing locks would be useless.
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB26 on 02/04/2015 7:51 PM
aaaaaaah, $$$$$

just try to get it from old folk who 'may not be here tomorrow'

however, if said wall will isolate the old timers, most likely the surrounding community would chip in WILLINGLY

Some of these "old folks" are quite willing to spend the money for extra security measures. Of course not every owner is willing to spend money for extra security measures.

I doubt very much that our surrounding community would chip in willingly. Some of our owners have befriended some of the neighbors. But basically the neighbors in the community don't bother us and we don't bother them.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
Sarcasm:

A sharp, bitter, or cutting expression or remark; a bitter gibe or taunt.

Sarcasm may employ ambivalence, although sarcasm is not necessarily ironic.

The sarcastic content of a statement will be dependent upon the context in which it appears.

Unfortunately, the distinctive quality of sarcasm is present in the spoken word and manifested chiefly by vocal inflections.

Chill out, Bonnie
BonnieG1 (Nebraska)
Posts: 1,186
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB26 on 02/05/2015 6:32 AM
Sarcasm:

A sharp, bitter, or cutting expression or remark; a bitter gibe or taunt.

Sarcasm may employ ambivalence, although sarcasm is not necessarily ironic.

The sarcastic content of a statement will be dependent upon the context in which it appears.

Unfortunately, the distinctive quality of sarcasm is present in the spoken word and manifested chiefly by vocal inflections.

Chill out, Bonnie

I don't think I will "Chill out" today. I prefer to stay in. If I went outside I definitely would chill.
I did kind of think the post may have been sarcasm, but I am not good at sarcasm. Maybe my left handed mind is too literally.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
good pun

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By BonnieG1 on 02/04/2015 8:34 PM
Posted By JanetB2 on 02/04/2015 3:08 PM
Posted By BonnieG1 on 02/02/2015 10:03 AM
John,
A privacy wall sounds like an excellent idea. How would a person do that in an apartment style building?

Bonnie … you would have to be able to fence the land the building sits upon and be able to meet or exceed any local government ordinances regarding setbacks (distance between fence and buildings). It may not fix your problem, as it would depend if the thefts are being engaged by individuals inside or outside your complex. If the thief is outside the complex then it could be a deterrent, but again nothing is 100% effective. Also, that option will be quite pricey.


We believe the owner who police have told us is a convicted felon is letting people in who are stealing items that are easy to take. (except for the car stolen from our garage.) So this would not fix our problem and a fence around our building even if we wanted it would not be possible as we are adjacent to a care center and although have different boundaries than the care center do share land.

When theft first stared in 2012 the President at the time mentioned changing locks. Other Board members vetoed this idea as we felt at the time this was an "inside" job and changing locks would be useless.

As I thought if inside possible theft this option would be potentially useless. Potentially best option in catching the theif would be security cameras. The question you face is how many cameras, where to place, and at what cost to members.

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