INTENT TO LIEN & LIEN

Started by MG6 • 11 replies • 2399 views

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MG6 (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Under Florida statute 720, the HOA has to notice you of its intent to lien based on the last address on file with the HOA.

So on

day 1 a Notice of intent to liens is files.
day 63, home owner contacts HOA, updates address adn asks if there is a balance due. HOA does not reply
Day 111, Attorney & Agent for HOA files Claim of lien based on address used on day 1.

Home owner is claiming negligance by HOA stateing 46 days passed between the filing of the intent to lien and Claim of Lien filing and states HOA could have responded to the question of the balance due.

HOA appears to have satisfied its obligation unders statute 720 for notice of intent to lien but the statute does not speak to what the obligations of CAM during during between notice of intent to lien and the claim of lien filed 111 days later.

Input/thoughts

Thanks

EmmaH1
Posts: 674

Posted:

By what method did the homeowner (you?) make contact with the HOA updating your address change and if you had a balance? do you have proof in writing or email?

MG6 (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

I called the office, was told the CAM was not in until after 1pm. Was directed to their website. I updated my address, received a confirmation email from their website. I took the liberty of asking the receptionist for an email address for the CAM; I also emailed the CAM stating we moved, here is our new address, and to please confirm the balance due.

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

I would think the notice to lien might have been prepared by the attorney and his/her name and address would have been listed on the notice. Our association tells homeowners that once the case is referred to the attorney, all subsequent information needs to be directed to him, so you should have sent your change of address notice to the attorney AND the property manager to cover your bases.

You have the confirmation email, so that should help you, but a lien tells me your top priority should be settling what you owe. Start with checking your bank accounts to see if your checks have cleared the bank and compare that to whatever correspondence you've received from the property manager stating what you owe and then reconcile those figures.

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

MG6 (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

Thanks for your insight. The notice of intent to lien came from the CAM office but at some point between day 1 and day 111 it was ultimatly handed over to the attorney.

When I contacted the CAM to settle the account and update my address on day 63, I actually had no idea that I was sent a letter because everything was going to my old address from 2012.

I subsequantly paid what was due to the the attorney to prevent the start of forclosure shortly after day 111.

I undestand your point on contacting the attorney but what is your opinion the CAM not 1.) responding to my inquireis or 2.) not forwarding the information to the attorney (if it was indeed at their office) and simply ignoring it?

THanks

BobD4 (up north)
Posts: 1,002

Posted:

MG6 you have already looked into FLA ch 720 Homeowners Associations (2014) and noticed it shows absolutely no literal obligation whatsoever on the part of the HOA ( and thereby its PMgr ) after futile requests & reminders for payment - before day 1 - were sent to the address not changed.

Is it your claim that you never received those "before Day 1" requests sent to the unchanged address ? At day 1 how aged were the arrears / ? just for the current payment period ? When did you actually even submit partial payment, having a suspicion by Day 63 ?

Not helpful to you , but some jurisdictions allow liening to occur with much shorter prior warning than Florida's 45 days. A Fla HOA arrearant liened at day 46 or 47 etc perhaps should note a calculation discrepancy oversight - potential short notice objection - in subsection (4)A of Chapter 720.3085 between the start of the warning period ( after MAILING DATE of the Day 1 warning letter ) and in the actual Form itself ( 45 days after RECEIPT of the warning letter ).

How expensive was it ( above actual arrears ) to retire the lien ?

MG6 (Florida)
Posts: 4

Posted:

So it was the annual assessment that was missed at the master association only.

Day (1)..May 28th, letters of intent sent to old address(never got them). was sent by CAM; not lawyer.

Day (63)..July 31, called and email CAM,and changed to new address(all i writing) asked balance due,etc with no reply. All of this was done without my knowing of the letters on Day (1); I simply know I hand seen the bill.

Day (111)...Sept 16, Notice of lien filed by Master association lawyer.

I paid everything in full, assessment, interest, legal fees, etc... and am not disputing it after the fact.

Unable to see where the statute helps because my new address was not on file prior to day 1. However, I was cimpletly ignored in my attempts to get the bill in pay it on day 63. CAM also had my address 46 days prior and an email asking what the balance was to settle the account all 46 days prior to the filing of the lien on 16-September.

A bit frustrating. 3 people at the CAM office are blaming other people in the office and finger pointing but are claiming they were simply following the statute.

EmmaH1
Posts: 674

Posted:

You say you paid everything in full, that's good but did you ask them to withdraw/expunge the lien? If not then the records where the lien was filed with show that you simply "satisfied" the lien. This is not great on your credit report. (Since you feel you were wronged and feel you have proof and you were still paying legal fees to them without disputing that, If it were me I would have sent a letter along with the payment stating you wanted them to remove any record of that lien.) I know you've already done it now but it wouldn't hurt to ask that they do that now and explain your reasoning in the letter, send it certified. Anything like that on a credit report or record is there for years (7 I believe).

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

MG6

Address changes aside, were you unaware that you owed the annual assessment?

EmmaH1
Posts: 674

Posted:

John does have a point. It would be your responsibility to be aware what your dues are and when your money is due especially if you moved (how long had you lived there?). In your case if having it recorded as a "satisfied lien" on your credit history does not bother you then, probably best to let it go. (If you want it removed you may have to go so far as to offer to pay for the attorney to do that IF he would even agree to do it.)
Sorry for your situation and good luck

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

HOA's are typically required to notify the address of the owner of the HOA property. Which they consider the HOA property the owner's address. Another address is a "courtesy" but not necessarily responsible for finding the other address. If it is not supplied to them or kept up to date, they should always send correspondence to the HOA property.

Former HOA President

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MG6 on 11/19/2014 7:12 PM
Thanks for your insight. The notice of intent to lien came from the CAM office but at some point between day 1 and day 111 it was ultimatly handed over to the attorney.

When I contacted the CAM to settle the account and update my address on day 63, I actually had no idea that I was sent a letter because everything was going to my old address from 2012.

I subsequantly paid what was due to the the attorney to prevent the start of forclosure shortly after day 111.

I undestand your point on contacting the attorney but what is your opinion the CAM not 1.) responding to my inquireis or 2.) not forwarding the information to the attorney (if it was indeed at their office) and simply ignoring it?

THanks

Certainly, it's not appropriate for a property manager to ignore email, but before you say he/she ignored it, you need to find out what happened to the one you sent. It may have been caught up in an anti-spam program (occasionally my emails wind up in mine although I've listed the address as safe). The property manager's assistant may have received it, but didn't forward it, it may have been deleted by accident, etc. You might also contact the attorney to see if that email was ever forwarded to his/her office (the communication breakdown may be on that end).

At this point, there may be no way to find out what happened, but it would be nice for the property manager to apologize anyway for any inconvenience - and both of you will have to chalk it up as lessons learned. Write a letter to the property manager with a copy to the board, asking for an investigation and written response. Be sure to follow up with the BOARD if you don't get one - good luck!

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

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