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Buying or Renting in a 55+ community if you are only 50

Started by RobertB48 • 12 replies • 5275 views

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RobertB48 (Florida)
Posts: 1
Posted:
I would like to buy or rent in a 55+ community in Florida and I've heard differing opinions. Specifically, I want to buy or rent a specific house in Spruce Creek South, Summerfield, Fl. My wife and I are only 50 and have both recently gotten hired in the area. We have rented until the end of December and have the backing to buy NOW, but are getting conflicting "rules" from the real estate agent yet we are renting in The Villages?!?! I know of a state law of these communities are able to have up to 20% under 55 and for God's sake we're quiet, grown, and professional. Could anyone shed light on this subject soon as we would love to settle in to a wonderful home that the owner gentleman just lost his wife of 66 yrs in July and wants to sell and move back to NY to be with family.

Thank you to anyone that could help!!!!

Robert CB
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Robert,

You are asking about the Housing For Older Persons Act, or HOPA (for short).

Per that act, a community that is a senior community, may have up to 20% of the homes/units that do not have at least one individual who is 55 or older. However, that does not mean that the Association that is governing the community has to allow any at all.

Since you are in FL, you may want to check out the FL Commission on Human Relations as they seem to have a lot of resources on this topic.

My suggestion is to make an offer contingent on the Association accepting the sale to one who is under 55. Then make your case to the Association.

Hope this helps,

Tim
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Robert,

There are two distinct issues here: ownership and occupancy.

As I understand it, an association cannot prevent anyone from purchasing and owning a home in an age-restricted community. Occupancy is the real issue.

I suspect (but do not know for sure) that if you were to purchase the home and move into it quietly that there would be no problem. I do not believe that an association has the legal authority to demand proof of your age so if you do not offer that information they will have no grounds for demanding that you move out. It's a gamble and since you are so close to the minimum age I cannot see any compelling reason for the association to seek your removal.

If you were to try to rent the same home I think you would run into far more problems. If the association has approval over rentals one of the first questions they will ask is your age. Unlike a sale, the association may have the power to deny a rental application.

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
Larry,

as per HOPA the HOA is REQUIRED to survey ANNUALLY for 'proof of age'

however

they MUST accept a 'self certification' from any resident

(form up the circle and ...)

GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Robert you are correct in that a age restricted HOA may allow up to 20% of residents to be under 55. The two big questions that I would have is what is the current percentage of under 55'ers and what do the Covenants require? There are some Covenants that require 100% of at least one of all residents to be over 55.
Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RayC4 (Virginia)
Posts: 173
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RobertB48 on 11/17/2014 7:50 PM
but are getting conflicting "rules" from the real estate agent

Not sure what you mean by this -- can you be more specific?

Other thoughts:

Rules are rules. In this case, the Fed HOPA Guidelines which are presumably reflected in the community covenants say "55 and older (occupied)." You and your wife don't qualify.

The fact that you may be attractive, upstanding citizens with no criminal record counts for nothing.

And the issue is not all about the two of you. If you bull your way thru the deal with the hope that no one 'notices,' you are jeopardizing others to serious litigation (plus yourselves of course). After you move in, say some other couple wants to sell their unit. An underage couple makes them an offer, which the sellers say they cannot accept due to the 'age restrictions' (which you just violated). The prospective purchaser then sues the seller, and possibly the HOA) for age discrimination. OR......alternatively, the seller goes along with the sale to the same underage couple. Then the HOA, or perhaps another unit owner, sues the seller for breaking the age restriction rules. Do you see the potential untenable position you put others in? And I haven't even mentioned the potential liability that the Realtor may be facing. Or the HOA itself (if they are the ones burdened with the enforcement of the rules).

I would stay clear of this, especially since you are still five years shy of 55. Just my opinion.
EllieD (Vermont)
Posts: 446
Posted:
RobertB48,

As has already been posted, you need to understand HOPA (Housing for Older Persons Act). Here are some links that should help you understand the requirements.

http://www.hud.gov/offices/fheo/library/hopa95.pdf

http://www.leadingage.org/uploadedFiles/Content/Members/Legal/Fair_Housing/HOPA%20-%20Housing%20for%20Older%20Persons%20Act.pdf

Since you are in Florida, here are a couple more, from Florida sources, which you may already have found.

http://fchr.state.fl.us/resources/55_housing

http://www.richardslawgroup.com/rlg/55-and-older-restrictions/

And, of course, you need to find out what it states in the Documents and Declaration of the Association where you want to purchase, and live, reside.

Does the Declaration of that community have stricter requirements than HOPA?

If not, then, as has already been posted, you need to find out from the Association, how close they are to the 80% requirement, and/or how much cushion they want to keep so as not to risk jeopardizing their status as, 55 or older housing.

Keep in mind that when calculating whether a community meets the 80 percent requirement, it is the occupants of the dwelling units (at least one person 55 years of age or older), who are counted, not the owners.

The above is my understanding – I am not an attorney, nor do I work in the legal profession.
GeorgeR8 (Arizona)
Posts: 182
Posted:
I live in a 55+. I had to show proof of age at closing. The 80/20 is misunderstood by most. That mostly covers disabled adult children, adult children living with elderly parents, (we allow no one under 19), and spouses under 55. It does not mean that 20% have to be occupied by people under 55. 80% is a floor not a ceiling.

I live in a large community. We have an enforcement arm that gets rid of hundreds of underage people a year. I called them in on one of our units. He lived with his mom, she died, he had to go. We gave him a year. Some 55+ communities have lost their age minimum by being too nice. That happened to a place next to ours.

Underage people is one thing we will not tolerate.

RayC4 (Virginia)
Posts: 173
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By GeorgeR8 on 11/18/2014 7:21 PM
"The 80/20 is misunderstood by most. That mostly covers..... adult children living with elderly parents"

But the 'elderly parents WOULD qualify as 55+,....no? I don't understand why you say the 20% 'covers them'...

"I called them in on one of our units. He lived with his mom, she died, he had to go."

This is quite interesting. The "20%" bogey was enacted by HUD for this very reason (i.e. so that 'wiggle room' be maintained in the event a qualified unit became suddenly unqualified due to a death, and the community wind up 'out of compliance'). The son may have been intimidated, but he did not have to leave.

"Underage people is one thing we will not tolerate."

Based on that statement, and your tale of the mother/son, your community should not be HOPA. You should be "100% 55 and older." HOPA is an option that the community declares itself and then must follow certain guidelines (e.g. maintain the 80%; certify ages; etc) But you can be age-restricted without being HOPA.


SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RobertB48 on 11/17/2014 7:50 PM
I would like to buy or rent in a 55+ community in Florida and I've heard differing opinions.


I doubt a bank would give you a loan on a 55+ community if you were not 55+. As a rental, it would be up to the landlord if he wants to rent to you and ignore that your not 55+ or he may not want to risk it and simply say no.
GeorgeR8 (Arizona)
Posts: 182
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By RayC4 on 11/19/2014 5:12 AM
Posted By GeorgeR8 on 11/18/2014 7:21 PM
"The 80/20 is misunderstood by most. That mostly covers..... adult children living with elderly parents"

But the 'elderly parents WOULD qualify as 55+,....no? I don't understand why you say the 20% 'covers them'...

"I called them in on one of our units. He lived with his mom, she died, he had to go."

This is quite interesting. The "20%" bogey was enacted by HUD for this very reason (i.e. so that 'wiggle room' be maintained in the event a qualified unit became suddenly unqualified due to a death, and the community wind up 'out of compliance'). The son may have been intimidated, but he did not have to leave.

"Underage people is one thing we will not tolerate."

Based on that statement, and your tale of the mother/son, your community should not be HOPA. You should be "100% 55 and older." HOPA is an option that the community declares itself and then must follow certain guidelines (e.g. maintain the 80%; certify ages; etc) But you can be age-restricted without being HOPA.




In the case of the son there was no one over 55 living in the unit. There must be a 55+ person living in the unit. We are the original 55+. I may not be explaining the right way but the people here know the law inside and out. When I mentioned the elderly parents I was referring to the adult children, not the parents. In 54 years and 27,000 homes, people have tried to fight this and I don't think they have ever been successful. I am sure every technicality has been tried. If you are an attorney I think you may have covered our community in law school. I heard that they do or did in the past.
RayC4 (Virginia)
Posts: 173
Posted:
"In the case of the son there was no one over 55 living in the unit. There must be a 55+ person living in the unit."

If that is the case, George, what is the "20%" all about???

BTW, you mentioned in your first post above that you "have an enforcement arm that gets rid of hundreds of underage people a year." Did you guys have some kind of ebola epidemic going on out there?

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
an HOPA community is PERMITTED to have up to 20% of 'units' under 55

but

is NOT required to do so

If the HOA's 'docs' specify 100% 'units' over 55, that is COMPLIANT with HOPA, and enforceable

that is ONE person over 55 'in residence' in each unit

said person is permitted to 'self certify' on the annual 'audit' with no ID required to be shown, by affidavit

what, exactly, constitutes 'residence' is a whole other 'can-o-worms'

y'all enjoy your mcmansions

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