New Roof

Simply ask them what they see that is in violation. That your called the guy they recommended and he saw no issues. You will gladly make the changes required if they tell you what exactly is the issue or descrepency? Is it the color or type? Make them quote it to out of their documents. If they can't, then it's a personal taste issue...

Thank you for responding. They say it is both the make and the color but, as before mentioned their roof guy pretty much disagrees. If it is a personal taste issue what can we do? Are our hands tied and are we forced to shell out another 12 grand to replace a perfectly new roof?

You need to read whatever architectural guidelines your HOA has. They might be a part of your CC&Rs (Covenants, Conditions & Restrictions) or they might a separate document.

There are very strict statutes in CA that protect owners from arbitrary boards. The Board must, for instance, call you to a hearing in writing. This letter might come from your property mgr. if you have one.

If not in the letter (but we always put them in ours) the Board, as Melissa notes, must quote the document that you've violated--the article or page number, etc. The Board must have a written schedule of fines and other penalties (like tear off the roof). All of these need to be in writing.

The Board or property mgr. must mail their written decision to you once again citing the exact violation of your HOA's rules, guideline or whatever, and what you must do to comply.

That you or a director "says" anything does not matter. Everything must be in writing. So, on your end, ask the roofer the Board recommended to write a short letter on his letterhead to the board stating his professional opinion.

We directors on Boards really are supposed to pay attention to expert opinions--it's a part of our job.

Word of future warning besides getting permission 1st... Do NOT assume that those 2 other homes were approved before copying... You may find that odd house is in violation and fighting the issue. You can not tell what situation a violation is in by looking at it. Someone may be protesting, being sued, or waiting on a board decision. It is best to treat your situation as your situation. Do not bring others in it even if they did the same. If you are, then get a majority together and vote to change the rule.

I would like to add that it is our desire to correct our mistake and have sent our sincerest apologies. We expected a fine but not replacing our brand new roof.
Also, they have not cited anything in writing regarding the specifics of what CC&R's we are in violation of. I'll continue to do more research, visit David-striking.com and contact the contractor. He did mention for us not to quote him as this particular HOA gives him a lot of business. As you can imagine, we feel we are up against a wall.

I appreciate all your advice. You have helped me immensely and feel I have some direction.

Tim's idea is a good one, Brenda. Maybe he'll be willing to put the basic facts in a letter to the Board copying you. I can see why he'd be nervous. If he won't, see if the Board will recommend another firm or you find one that is reputable, licensed, etc. and see if they'll help.

If your HOA really has nothing in its documents a bout roofs, I don't think they can make you take it off. But I have to say, our own docs state that if owners don't get ARC approval, the Board CAN have the project taken out. In our high rise, hard surface floors would be the main issue if approval isn't gotten and the wrong materials are used. (Hasn't happened though.)

We replaced wood shingles for asphalt shingles. We are in severe fire hazard zone our sheathing was pretty bad (per the roofers report) Im pretty sure that is covered by a civil code but if only the HOA would relay to us the exact guidelines we are in violating this would be a whole lot easier.

You might want to contact your local Zoning Board, in a lot of areas, wood shingles are being banned HOA regs or not.

BrendaS10

I've been giving your situation some thought since I first read your post yesterday. As a property manager, I'm more than mystified as to why you did not consult with your property manager, architectural committee, or board in advance. Your decision to replace the roof was not made over breakfast on Tuesday as lightly as you would decide what to have for dinner. If insurance was involved, or even if not, your decision making must have taken two or three weeks, at least.

My last word on the subject is advice: in the future, do not make any, repeat any, changes to the exterior of your home or property without talking it through with the HOA first. A five minute telephone call or e-mail could have saved you all this hassle. And, possibly, a lot of money although I hope it does not come to that.

In what follows, I am not giving legal advice, I am not an attorney. I am sharing an experience, which, unfortunately for the parties, has yet to be resolved.

An association we manage is three years into the identical situation as yours. As it is not yet resolved, it is not proper for me to discuss specifics. Others have counseled with you to get everything in writing, and I agree completely.

Going beyond that, ask the Board to provide you with documents which specifically describe the characteristics of the roof you should have installed, the guidelines if you will. The key word is specific--the language may not support the position of the board if it says something like a "muted earth tone" color. What is a "muted earth tone"? We all kinda sorta think we know what it means but, if one had to give testimony as to what a "muted earth tone" is, or is not, the definition would vary with each person.

The language or guidelines of the association should state something along the lines of: "GAF, Owens Corning, or another manufacturer, 240 pound per square foot, 20 year, wind and hail resistant (important here in Texas)"muted brown or muted grey" shingles, specifically GAF Timberline Weathered Wood, Shake Wood, Mission Brown, Hickory, or Slate (or similar colors from another manufacturer). Submission of a sample must be provided and approved, regardless of color selected. The following colors, or similar colors, are unacceptable: (listing of colors)".

The association in the past did not have guidelines as specific as what I described above. It does now.

I'm not going to advise you as to what to do; I will say if the association cannot produce a document with very specific guidelines, which you should have had reasonable access to, then you may have ground to stand on. I don't recall if anyone else has mentioned the "A" word, but I will. I recommend you start looking for a real estate or property law attorney with experience in dealing with the governing documents of homeowner's associations. An estate planning or tax attorney, even if it is your sister, is not what you will need in this situation.

Good luck.

Brenda

You went from cedar to asphalt shingles. Did he other two homes you refer to do the same? Could this be the real issue?

The problem seems to be the color and make. However, I have documentation that states that their Lowes brand approved roofs are the same as our Home Depot brand roof. Our contractor has drafted a letter with detailed information confirming so. The color is that of two other homes (charcoal). We've presented a paragraph citing the CC&R's stating we do not need permission for exterior repairs if they comply with the conformity of neighboring homes. The director said "those are old terms" when we showed him this in our initial meeting. Albeit that is in our current and only copy of CC&R's.

We were in the process of selling our home. We updated the interior and the exterior needed much repairs. We started with the roof because we are in a sever fire hazard zone and in are enduring a terrible drought. On our first open house a board member told our realtor that we were going to have to replace our roof. That the board is strict on such matters. The fact that we didn't get anything in writing for three weeks infuriated us. I couldn't believe she went out of her way to attend the open house and that she would tell our realtor before notifying us. How unprofessional. Our realtor, who has been in realty for over 35 years is appealed at their onerous and highly unreasonable terms.

This is looking messy and I am overwhelmed, but I see plenty of wholes in their process.

We decided to sell our home. In doing so, we knew we needed to give our home curb appeal. We looked at our CC&R's. saw we could proceed without permission. We had our roof replaced.

Upon our first open house, a board member tells our realtor we have to replace the roof. Of course we called the HOA manager, pulled our offer from another house and stopped selling ours. Three weeks later we get a courtesy notice to attend a hearing or meeting. I had just had our second child so my husband went alone. My husband brought all our roof paper work and the paragraph of the only version of the CC&R's that states we don't need permission if exterior renovations comply with neighboring homes, they said that portion is "old". We thereafter received, via email, a newsletter from 2004 stating different common area rules including approved roofing material. That is the only paperwork we have regarding roofing specifications. I spoke to the contractor/installation manager we used and asked him about our HOA's approved roofing material vs ours and he said ours fits the bill and will provide a letter stating so.

Also, the board had the HOA manager schedule their contractor to inspect our new roof. He told us, but won't put it in writing for fear of losing business with the association, that our roof is the correct make and that it should not be replaced.

That is the entire story.