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SueT3 (California)
Posts: 4
Posted:
A renter in the condo building where I live has installed a 220 volt outlet in the parking garage to charge his electric car without approval from the HOA. As president of the HOA I am aware that California Senate Bill 880, states that HOA's must try to accommodate homeowners requests to install charging stations, but the homeowner must agree to numerous terms and conditions before the HOA has to give approval. I don't even know if the renter hired a licensed electrician to install the outlet, which legally he should have, and he is ignoring and refusing to give the homeowner information on the electrician he used, or provide copies of the bids that he got. I highly doubt that he got a permit either or had the installation inspected by the City of Los Angeles. I know the HOA cannot do anything to try to evict the tenant, only the homeowner/landlord can do that, but under what grounds can he evict him. I want to remove the outlet, because I don't know if it was legally installed, and the homeowner does not have the mandatory $1,000,000 liability coverage naming the HOA as additional named insured. Also, I am outraged with this renter's attitude of doing whatever he wants, whenever he wants. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343
Posted:
Since this was installed in the parking garage by a renter without approval, I would think the HOA could remove the charger, bill the homeowner, and request a formal proceeding for proper installation.
BobD4 (up north)
Posts: 1,002
Posted:
our tenant-friendly jurisdiction ( not CAL) might nevertheless allow a landlord to terminate under grounds of "interfering with the rights of the landlord / other tenants" / breach of essential condition to comply with condo corporation governance documents. A different jurisdiction in our country actually legislates direct termination of condo lease by a condo corporation without privity of contract and without prior court order, but requires a court order for contested possession. But could this be another right to fly the Blue Star scenario ?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The HOa can have this removed. Give the owner a choice. They can hire an electrician and have it removed or the HOA does it and sends them the bill. The owner is responsible for the damage their tenant does. That should be enough for the owner to want to see if they can evict. Keep in mind there are Tenant's rights and the owner has to have terms in their lease agreement to evict. You are right the HOA can not evict.

Here is the thing you need to find out. Some of these outlets are set up to be PUBLIC,plug ins. There is a website for electric car owners to find a plug in if they travel. We have person in our city who does this. Which that fact alone is an issue. Your HOA is not open for the public.

Read your docs. The HOA can remove violations and then lien the owner if they do not pay the bill. Much stronger than fines or lawsuit. They threaten to sue then let them. See ya in court and countersue for the expense of defense and removal. Do NOT sue! Let them. Much better for you all.

It may be a good idea for this technology but proper channels is best option...

Former HOA President
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
With Kevin, Have the outlet removed and bull the owner. The outlet is not on the owner's separate interest , is it? It's in your common area? Or an exclusive use common area?

All we HOA boards in CA must do is not forbid an owner to install an outlet.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Sue,

Permits are easy to check. Go to the local permit office and ask.

If no permits were done, make a complaint on the individual to the permit office. The Assocaition, prior to making the complaint, should formally contact the owner about the issue (as this may help shield the Association).

Additionally, do you know where the power is coming from (i.e. is the Association or the owner paying for the electricity used in the charging station? If you don't know, send a formal request and, after an appropriate amount of time, hire an electrician to locate the source and charge the owner (not the renter, the owner as the owner is responsible for the actions of their tenants). If the electricity is coming from the Association, have the electrician disconnect it.
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SueT3 on 11/08/2014 8:44 PM

A renter in the condo building where I live has installed a 220 volt outlet in the parking garage to charge his electric car without approval from the HOA. As president of the HOA I am aware that California Senate Bill 880, states that HOA's must try to accommodate homeowners requests to install charging stations, but the homeowner must agree to numerous terms and conditions before the HOA has to give approval.


The statute that governs this is Civil Code §4745; a Senate Bill is only a proposal to enact, amend, or abolish a statute. Your interpretation is basically correct; the condo must allow a charging station but the owner must comply with many requirements.

BTW, it is not appropriate for a tenant to install a charging station as the statute imposes certain requirements on the current owner all subsequent owners.

Quote:

I don't even know if the renter hired a licensed electrician to install the outlet, which legally he should have, and he is ignoring and refusing to give the homeowner information on the electrician he used, or provide copies of the bids that he got. I highly doubt that he got a permit either or had the installation inspected by the City of Los Angeles. I know the HOA cannot do anything to try to evict the tenant, only the homeowner/landlord can do that, but under what grounds can he evict him. I want to remove the outlet, because I don't know if it was legally installed, and the homeowner does not have the mandatory $1,000,000 liability coverage naming the HOA as additional named insured.


Before rushing headlong to remove the outlet, see if it is connected to an electrical service panel on the exterior of the building and a set of breakers. If so, turn off the breakers and lock the panel so the breakers cannot be switched on again. Leave the box locked until the owner shows compliance with the requirements of Civil Code §4745. Most service panels can be locked with a padlock.

If the 220-volt outlet is not wired into a service panel accessible from outside the living quarters, then hire an electrician and notify the owner that the association will make entry into his space and remove the unauthorized electrical equipment. Since there is evidence of a violation of the building codes and an immediate threat to the community you can give as little notice as you see fit, including no notice at all.

Since there is an inherent danger in non-professionals fooling around with the electrical service in a condo setting, you need to look into evicting the tenant and sanctioning the owner. I strongly recommend seeking the advice of an attorney as this tenant may or may not have jeopardized the welfare of everyone in the entire building. At the very least I would recommend getting an injunction to prevent the owner and his tenant from doing any further work that effects the building's common elements.

Quote:

Also, I am outraged with this renter's attitude of doing whatever he wants, whenever he wants. Any suggestions would be appreciated.


Sounds like this guy has a history but you now have him by the, uh, you know. In this situation the law requires the owner to perform certain specific acts and he apparently did none of them. I do not normally recommend using the law as a club to beat people into submission, but in this case you seem to have an irresponsible owner and an irresponsible tenant and I would not hesitate for a second to bury them both under a mountain of legal bills.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Good idea in finding the breaker and turning it off. There is a process called lock out tagout in the electrical industry. When electricians work on boxes they can put multiple locks on so no one is electrucuted until all the work is done. The HOA should find the source breaker and turn it off then lock the box with a lock only the President has.
The owner really is the HOA member not the tenant. So if they want the outlet on for their tenant they have to approach the board to have one installed. However, that outlet is now ALL HOA members outlet. It would be part of the common element. Which then you all can vote it in according to the rules and laws.

If you do shut it down and lock it what is worst case scenerio? Work from that. The tenant has no case against you even if they sue. Let them sue. They have no rights to modify the common element. Counter sue them for the expense of removal. If the owner threatens to sue, they are suing themseleves and their neighbors. They have no case either. They did not follow the rules and modified a common element withou permission. Counter sue them too.

You can NOT evict the tenant but the owner can. Make either of them angry enough and one is going to force one to move out. They have no lawsuit if either the tenant moves out or the owner sales.

So go vote, take pictures, and make sure you sent notices to the HOA property and the owner. Time to get a lock and lock them ou after turning off the breaker. Which take a picture of the inside of box before doing so. You need to show the quality of work and if it properly done.

The permit office is also a great idea to verify first. May not want to report it if they fine the HOA. They could fine your HOA for unpermitted work. Which is something to pass to the owner to pay. May be cheaper just to verify and lock out yourselves.

Former HOA President
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 11/09/2014 2:42 AM

However, that outlet is now ALL HOA members outlet. It would be part of the common element. Which then you all can vote it in according to the rules and laws.

Actually Melissa, per the CA statute, it would not be considered a common element and it is the full responsibility of the current and future owners of the unit. Here is part of CA Civil Code §4745 [emphasis added]

(f) If the electric vehicle charging station is to be placed in a
common area or an exclusive use common area, as designated in the
common interest development's declaration, the following provisions
apply:
(1) The owner first shall obtain approval from the association to
install the electric vehicle charging station and the association
shall approve the installation if the owner agrees in writing to do
all of the following:
(A) Comply with the association's architectural standards for the
installation of the charging station.
(B) Engage a licensed contractor to install the charging station.
(C) Within 14 days of approval, provide a certificate of insurance
that names the association as an additional insured under the owner'
s insurance policy in the amount set forth in paragraph (3).
(D) Pay for the electricity usage associated with the charging
station.
(2) The owner and each successive owner of the charging station
shall be responsible for all of the following:
(A) Costs for damage to the charging station, common area,
exclusive use common area, or separate interests resulting from the
installation, maintenance, repair, removal, or replacement of the
charging station.
(B) Costs for the maintenance, repair, and replacement of the
charging station until it has been removed and for the restoration of
the common area after removal.
(C) The cost of electricity associated with the charging station.
(D) Disclosing to prospective buyers the existence of any charging
station of the owner and the related responsibilities of the owner
under this section.

(3) The owner and each successive owner of the charging station,
at all times, shall maintain a homeowner liability coverage policy in
the amount of one million dollars ($1,000,000) and shall name the
association as a named additional insured under the policy with a
right to notice of cancellation.
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Adams Kessler recommends that a covenant be recorded to show that there is an obligation on the part of a future owner of the unit.

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
Larry,

The above is NOT a covenant but STATE LAW

State law IS recorded, remember; 'Ignorance of the law is no excuse.'

CAVEAT EMPTOR
KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239
Posted:

Before blowing a gasket in anger, ensure it's licensed and permitted electrical job. If so, the HOA board should address its policy on charging stations, which are here to stay. If it's not, this was a negligent act on behalf of the tenant and a electrician should remove the station.

Yes, the rules were broken. But that's a time for assessment and/or enforcement of policies that may be long in the tooth.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
The issues really isn't if this outlet is allowed. Matter of fact, I would encourage every HOA to consider installing an outlet for their HOA.

The issue here is that the TENANT installed the outlet without permission or verifying it is installed correctly. This puts ALL the owner's at risk. Plus considering some electric car owners post their stations for other car owners to use. Something that one should investigate as this should not be for public use.

I would still lock the box out on this outlet. I would then have the board vote to allow an outlet if the owner of the unit applies and proves proper installation. I would also consider the HOA install a generally located outlet for HOA members or tenants to use instead. That way the HOA is "owner" of the outlet and can charge a "USEAGE/MAINTENANCE" fee to those who use it. The can charge like the expense of the electricity plus a maintenance fee or deposit. Let's say $50 a month and you get a key to the box. That way the WHOLE HOA members are not paying the whole bill for the few that use it. Plus can get back some of their money for installation and future maintenance.

Be careful if you lock the box. They may cut the lock. If they do, save the lock if you can and the receipt for each lock you have to buy. That can be part of your countersuit or charges to the owner.

Former HOA President
SueT3 (California)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Big thanks to all of you for your advice and information, it has been really helpful.

The HOA is not opposed to allowing charging stations, the issue here is that the outlet was installed without approval, and that the owner does not have the necessary liability coverage which is a big problem because I now know that the electrician is not licensed. I've checked the state contractors licensing board, and he is not listed. Another board member has contacted him and asked for copies of the permit, and inspection reports, but he didn't pull permits. If there's any fault in the wiring that causes a fire etc we have a big problem. The actions of this renter have put all the homeowners at risk.

The outlet is wired directly into the renter's electrical box for his unit, so I doubt that I can lock their box and restrict their access. Can I legally hire an electrician to go into the electrical box without the owners permission? The CC&R's clearly state that no owner must install any type of wiring, electrical or otherwise to install anything in the common area, and the parking garage is common area. So I can fine the owner, but that is just a slap on the wrist.

LarryB - thanks for the info on code 4745, thankfully is reads pretty much the same as the senate bill in regards to the terms and conditions the owner has to agree to for approval from the HOA. This renter is way out of line, and has no right to install anything anywhere. You are right, not only is this guy a nightmare, he is highly volatile and aggressive and thinks that the HOA must give in to his every whim and change the rules to make him happy. He is constantly announcing that he is going to seek legal advice when he has no cause whatsoever. The owner has allowed him to behave like this and has not put him in check.

From a liability standpoint, the power source to this outlet has to be disconnected until the owner goes through the proper channels, agrees to comply with the code and receives approval from the HOA. The installation work will also have to be inspected for safety. I I think it is time to seek advice from an attorney.
Thanks again.

LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB26 on 11/09/2014 5:55 AM
Larry,

The above is NOT a covenant but STATE LAW

State law IS recorded, remember; 'Ignorance of the law is no excuse.'

John,

The statute, which I referred to earlier, requires that that the owner agree to certain terms that will be binding on subsequent owners. The lawyers advised to take that one step further and record the agreement so future owners could not claim that they did not know what they were obligated to do.

I think I confused you by calling the agreement a "covenant," which is the same word that Adams Kessler used.

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
gotcha

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
Sue, don't your ARC Guidelines state that if ARC approval isn't sought and granted, you HOA has the right to remove the items that are in violation??

Anyway, given what you've said about this guy, spend the money for the attorney. For now, mail your violation notice to the owner and follow through with your normal disciplinary steps.

Developers of new condos HOAs around my general area are installing charging stations. Older ones like our high rise have nowhere to put an extra parking space for a common area charging station, Melissa.

In our underground garage, the spaces are deeded to owners, but they are exclusive use common areas. Our Board wouldn't hesitate granting approval for owners to install their own charging station provided Civil Code 5745 is followed exactly. No owner has wanted to go to the expense...yet.

CCC 5745 probably is enactment of the senate bill you're referring to, Sue. The web site that Tim and Larry refer to, which is wonderful for CA HOA leaders is davis-stirling.com.
SueT3 (California)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Hi Kerry, the owner is in violation of the CC&R's that state that an owner cannot install any kind of wiring in the common area, and yes we can remove it and charge him with a special assessment for the costs. I spoke to the owner today, and of course he doesn't want it removed because sometime in the near future the HOA will have to give him approval for the installation. He said he would speak to his tenant and tell them they could not use the outlet, but of course this tenant pays no attention to him and still has his car plugged in.

I don't know what we are going to do if more owners want charging stations because parking spaces are designated to each unit for exclusive use, and we don't have room in the garage to install a designated charging area without blocking other owners in.

Yes, civil code 4745 reads the same as SB 880 in regards to the terms and conditions that an owner has to agree to before the HOA gives their approval for the installation etc. One of those terms is that the owner has to use a licensed electrician, the renter hired Joe Schmo who was half the price, and of course the renter had no right to choose an electrician or authorize the work. Yes, the Davis Sterling Act is the go to site here in CA. Thanks
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Sue

It seems the real issues are one should have notified the association, had a licensed electrician install the charging station and the user post a bond.

Have you made it clear (as in a letter from the associations attorney) to the unit owner what you want such as a licensed electrician to inspect/approve it and you want the insurance added or are you just going to keep anguishing over it?

Forget the fact that the association was not asked. It is not like you could have said no.

SueT3 (California)
Posts: 4
Posted:
John, I sent the owner a copy of civil code 4745 which outlines the terms and conditions that the owner has to agree to in writing before the HOA has to give approval. This happened over the weekend so I couldn't get hold of the attorney until Monday.

The association could have said no, until the owner was willing to agree to the terms and conditions of installation per the code, then the association would have 60 days from the date of the request to grant approval.

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