JoeM10 (California)
Posts: 11
Posts: 11
Posted:
does a garage sale count?
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what is noxious and offensive trade?
Started by JoeM10 • 15 replies • 6034 views
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TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
JM,
Both of these terms are subjective to each individual and are typically included when defining nuisances.
Per USLegal a nuisance is "a substantial interference with the right to use and enjoy land, which may be intentional, negligent or ultra hazardous in origin, and must be a result of defendant's activity." To some individuals, the appearance, noise and extra traffic that results from garage sales is a nuisance and offensive.
I know of Associations that prohibits garage sales. I know of Associations that limit the number of garage sales. I know of Associations that have no rules about garage sales.
As I said, those terms are subjective and are normally defined by the Board. Most Boards will say that they can't define it but know what it is when they see it.
Both of these terms are subjective to each individual and are typically included when defining nuisances.
Per USLegal a nuisance is "a substantial interference with the right to use and enjoy land, which may be intentional, negligent or ultra hazardous in origin, and must be a result of defendant's activity." To some individuals, the appearance, noise and extra traffic that results from garage sales is a nuisance and offensive.
I know of Associations that prohibits garage sales. I know of Associations that limit the number of garage sales. I know of Associations that have no rules about garage sales.
As I said, those terms are subjective and are normally defined by the Board. Most Boards will say that they can't define it but know what it is when they see it.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
I'm curious why you are asking such a question since your previous post talks of abolishing your CC&Rs.
FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posts: 927
Posted:
> what is noxious and offensive trade?
Well, leather tanning would be one.
Garage sales would not be a "trade" unless they were held on a regular basis.
I have heard of associations that forbid or limit garage sales.
Well, leather tanning would be one.
Garage sales would not be a "trade" unless they were held on a regular basis.
I have heard of associations that forbid or limit garage sales.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Many HOA's have restrictions on garage sales. One of the reasons I choose my present HOA is that garage sales are not allowed. Many municipalities have restrictions on garage sales. Start there.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 10/20/2014 4:22 AM
I'm curious why you are asking such a question since your previous post talks of abolishing your CC&Rs.
I'm curious why you are asking such a question since your previous post talks of abolishing your CC&Rs.
I think this is called having your cake and eating it also....LOL
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
I think it's a troll
JoeM10 (California)
Posts: 11
Posts: 11
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 10/20/2014 9:51 AM
I think it's a troll
I think it's a troll
well don't jump to conclusions.
I'm still trying to get rid of the cc&r.
Another household has garage sales, and I was hoping to use the noxious offensive nuisance clause if they didn't want to sign the petition
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By TimB4 on 10/20/2014 4:21 AM
Per USLegal a nuisance is "a substantial interference with the right to use and enjoy land, which may be intentional, negligent or ultra hazardous in origin, and must be a result of defendant's activity." To some individuals, the appearance, noise and extra traffic that results from garage sales is a nuisance and offensive.
Per USLegal a nuisance is "a substantial interference with the right to use and enjoy land, which may be intentional, negligent or ultra hazardous in origin, and must be a result of defendant's activity." To some individuals, the appearance, noise and extra traffic that results from garage sales is a nuisance and offensive.
The keyword here is "substantial." No court is going to find an ordinary garage sale to be a substantial interference. The fact that some people are bothered by a garage sale, which normally runs for a few hours, does not make it a substantial interference.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JoeM10 on 10/20/2014 10:20 AM
Posted By TimB4 on 10/20/2014 9:51 AM
I think it's a troll
I think it's a troll
well don't jump to conclusions.
I'm still trying to get rid of the cc&r.
Another household has garage sales, and I was hoping to use the noxious offensive nuisance clause if they didn't want to sign the petition
You wanted to use extortion to obtain a means?
In your thread about abolishing the CC&Rs, you clearly stated that there is no Association. Taking that as fact, for you to enforce that clause over a garage sale, you would need to take the neighbor to court. This will take time and money. If the Judge doesn't toss you out of court for a frivolous law suit, the reality is the garage sale would be over before you could even file the paperwork to seek an injunction to stop the garage sale.
Now, if there was an Association and if, which yours does not, the CC&Rs allow monetary penalties, the Association could institute imposing monetary penalties for such violations. However, to repeat what you posted in the other thread:
Quote:
Posted By JoeM10 on 10/13/2014 10:25 AM
I forgot to mention, we have no HOA.
I forgot to mention, we have no HOA.
JoeM10 (California)
Posts: 11
Posts: 11
Posted:
Damn. You really jump to conclusions.
not extortion. Just using that clause to make them see how it would be beneficial to remove the cc&r. If there's no noxious nuisance clause, neighbors would have no ammo against them.
Just like the 'no trailers' clause. One of the neighbors has 2 RV trailers parked in his driveway. It would be in his best interest to sign away these cc&rs.
not extortion. Just using that clause to make them see how it would be beneficial to remove the cc&r. If there's no noxious nuisance clause, neighbors would have no ammo against them.
Just like the 'no trailers' clause. One of the neighbors has 2 RV trailers parked in his driveway. It would be in his best interest to sign away these cc&rs.
DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
As Tim mentioned, you would have to threaten to sue your neighbor for your extortion tactic to have any teeth.
Back to the OP of what constitutes noxious and offensive trade, it would depend for me on how often they have garage sales and for what purpose. Selling off excess personal property a couple of times a year doesn't seem like "trade" to me. If they are having garage sales every couple of weeks to sell stuff they have bought for resale, then that is a business and could be considered noxious and offensive trade.
Back to the OP of what constitutes noxious and offensive trade, it would depend for me on how often they have garage sales and for what purpose. Selling off excess personal property a couple of times a year doesn't seem like "trade" to me. If they are having garage sales every couple of weeks to sell stuff they have bought for resale, then that is a business and could be considered noxious and offensive trade.
Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
LarryB13 (Arizona)
Posts: 4,099
Posts: 4,099
Posted:
The OP seems to be relying on the following paragraph of his declaration:
"6. No noxious or offensive trade or activity shall be carried on upon any lot nor shall anything be done thereon which may be or become an annoyance or nuisance to the neighborhood. . ."
It seems to me that you could use that to get rid of anything you don't like. Republicans and Fox News both annoy me.
"6. No noxious or offensive trade or activity shall be carried on upon any lot nor shall anything be done thereon which may be or become an annoyance or nuisance to the neighborhood. . ."
It seems to me that you could use that to get rid of anything you don't like. Republicans and Fox News both annoy me.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
JM,
I wouldn't utilize that passage as a way to explain why it would be good to abolish the CC&Rs.
Instead, I would hold meetings with the members to ask if they would consider abolishing them and if not, why not.
I wouldn't utilize that passage as a way to explain why it would be good to abolish the CC&Rs.
Instead, I would hold meetings with the members to ask if they would consider abolishing them and if not, why not.
FredS7 (Arizona)
Posts: 927
Posts: 927
Posted:
> It seems to me that you could use that to get rid of anything you don't like. Republicans and Fox News both annoy me.
Conversely, removing it would permit commies, toxic waste dumps, and, perhaps worst of all, lawyers.
Conversely, removing it would permit commies, toxic waste dumps, and, perhaps worst of all, lawyers.
KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550
Posts: 14,550
Posted:
What do your documents, Joe, say about home-based businesses, if anything.
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