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IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Our HOA had a board election recently in which the total number of the votes assigned to the 6 candidates for the three board positions exceeded the maximum possible votes from the 26 valid ballots. Each homeowner had a maximum of 3 votes, so that there could only have been a maximum of 3X26= 78 votes. Yet the 6 candidates votes total was 96, or 18 votes (the equivalent of 6 ballots) more than the maximum possible.

Here's the problem: When the management company rep was asked to reaffirm the vote count and explain the discrepancy between the number of ballots received, and the number of votes announced by her at the meeting, despite repeated requests, she has refused to disclose or confirm them.

There were also two other problems with the election. The rep had permitted the 17 year old son of one of the candidates to open the ballot envelopes and to hand her the ballots. The mother of this boy subsequently ended up with the highest votes. And, our association has 54 homes. Therefore a quorum (51% or more) would be 28 (not 27) ballots.

My Question is:

How can I get the management company rep to make available to me the full count of the number of votes received by each candidate? I have requested the numbers from the rep 3 times since the mid-September election, but have not received these, to date. She provided the ballot count at 27 less 1, which had 6 votes.

Does the State Attorney's office help homeowners with election dispute or fraud? To whom can a homeowner turn for help in situations such as this?

Thank you.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Unless you are still under developer control, then its impossible. Understand, in your case a developer has 9 votes to your 3. By law, ballots must be made available for inspection. No, the attorney general does not handle such cases. Grievances would be filed through small claims court.Civil Code does not allow relatives of a candidate or Board member to act as an inspector or assistant.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Ishita,

Instead of asking for a recount and an explanation, ask to see the ballots and do the recount yourself.

Are you on the Board? If not, bring this issue to the Board as well and have one of them do a recount with you.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By IshitaE on 10/09/2014 10:39 PM
our association has 54 homes. Therefore a quorum (51% or more) would be 28 (not 27) ballots.

Are you saying that your organizing docs require 51% to be present for a quorum at elections?

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By IshitaE on 10/09/2014 10:39 PM

Therefore a quorum (51% or more) would be 28 (not 27) ballots.

She provided the ballot count at 27 less 1, which had 6 votes.

If there were 28 ballots (but one was deemed invalid) then there were 28 lots/units represented at the meeting. This means that there was a quorum.

Keep in mind that a quorum is not determined by the number of ballots cast. It is determined by the number of lots/units represented (in person or, if allowed, by proxy) at the meeting. This number would be obtained by the Associations sign-in sheet for the meeting.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Tim

In California, secret ballots count toward obtaining quorum.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Understood. However, that would be similar to counting proxies, as I understand it. If voting by mail is allowed, then the number of ballots received by mail (in addition to those who chose to attend the meeting and cast a ballot in person) would be counted.

From Davisp-Stirling site: A "quorum" of the membership is the required minimum of number of member votes present in person, by proxy and/or by ballot before the association may conduct business at a membership meeting. (Robert's Rules, 11th ed., pp. 21, 345.)

Either way you count it, since there were 28 ballots, then there was a quorum.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
According to the management company rep, she came to the meeting with 26 ballots,then one homeowner brought her an additional ballot at the meeting. That made the total ballots received by the management company rep to 27. The rep writes (via email) that one of these 27 ballots had 6 votes (the maximum permitted in your CC&Rs is 3 votes per home) and therefore she disqualified this ballot. With 54 homes in our neighborhood, and quorum being defined as 51% of the homes, we would need 28 ballots for quorum. According to the information provided to me by the management company rep she had 27 ballots including the one she disqualified.

That there were various errors committed at the vote count meeting is obvious. I am interested in the legal procedure to get the management company to let the board and the homeowners know the actual ballot and vote counts and disclose the string of errors that place in question the validity of the election results.

Thanks for your input.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Quorum is based on in person, by proxy or secret ballot. An invalid outer envelope, if someone did't sign, will not count towards quorum. The ballot, if it had 6 votes would be invalidated from the election, not quorum.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
No, our HOA has been around for 20 years and is not under developer control. We have 54 homes, each of which is permitted 3 votes, the management company rep says that she received 27 ballots in all, one of which she disqualified because it had 6 votes, which gave her 26 valid ballots from which to draw her votes. Our quorum at 51% should have been 28 ballots (and not 27). The vote total for all 6 candidates adds up to 96 votes. Yet 26 ballots X 3 votes each can only give a maximum of 78 votes. Therefore the election gave us 18 more votes than would be possible with 26 valid ballots. Based on these unexplained additional votes, the rep announced a 3-way tie between the three second-highest vote receivers (myself and two others) for the two remaining board slots (in the 3 member BOD).

The management company rep has refused to explain this discrepancy. She permitted the 17 year old son of one of the candidates (who also ended up with getting the highest number of votes) to remove the ballots from their unmarked envelopes and to hand them to her for counting. The rep did the counting of the votes. There is no doubt that there are some serious problems with this vote counting process.

My question is, what legal recourse do I (as a homeowner and one of the candidates with the highest votes) have to get the management company rep to take the legally correct action: to disclose the discrepancy between the ballots and the votes, and to conduct a new election? It is in this that I need help on this discussion board.

Thanks very much.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
No, our HOA has been around for 20 years and is not under developer control. We have 54 homes, each of which is permitted 3 votes, the management company rep says that she received 27 ballots in all, one of which she disqualified because it had 6 votes, which gave her 26 valid ballots from which to draw her votes. Our quorum at 51% should have been 28 ballots (and not 27). The vote total for all 6 candidates adds up to 96 votes. Yet 26 ballots X 3 votes each can only give a maximum of 78 votes. Therefore the election gave us 18 more votes than would be possible with 26 valid ballots. Based on these unexplained additional votes, the rep announced a 3-way tie between the three second-highest vote receivers (myself and two others) for the two remaining board slots (in the 3 member BOD).

The management company rep has refused to explain this discrepancy. She permitted the 17 year old son of one of the candidates (who also ended up with getting the highest number of votes) to remove the ballots from their unmarked envelopes and to hand them to her for counting. The rep did the counting of the votes. There is no doubt that there are some serious problems with this vote counting process.

My question is, what legal recourse do I (as a homeowner and one of the candidates with the highest votes) have to get the management company rep to take the legally correct action: to disclose the discrepancy between the ballots and the votes, and to conduct a new election? It is in this that I need help on this discussion board.

Thanks very much.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By IshitaE on 10/10/2014 8:09 AM
I am interested in the legal procedure to get the management company to let the board and the homeowners know the actual ballot and vote counts and disclose the string of errors that place in question the validity of the election results.

From http://www.davis-stirling.com/tabid/1725/Default.aspx#axzz3FkvLZBfE

SMALL CLAIMS COURT
"Small Claims" is a special court of limited jurisdiction where disputes are resolved quickly and inexpensively. Hearings are less formal than superior courts and attorneys are not allowed to participate unless they are a party to the dispute. An agent of the association may represent homeowners associations in small claims court. Cases are often heard by pro tem judges.

Equitable-Injunctive Relief. Small claims judges have the power to grant equitable and injunctive relief when authorized by other statutes to award such relief. (Code Civ. Proc. ยง116.220.) Examples are:
ordering associations to produce records for inspection and
ordering actions related to association elections and meetings.

Initiating the Claim. Once a claim is filed with the court and the filing fee paid, a hearing is scheduled usually 20 to 70 days from the filing of the claim.

Giving Notice. The defendant must be given notice of the action at least 15 days before the hearing date. The claim may be served personally or by the court via certified mail. (See Code Civ. Proc. ยง116.340 for requirements.)


Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
I am on the old Board, but also a candidate for the new Board. Therefore, I am hesitant to touch the ballots myself, lest I get accused of votes tampering. All three members of the old board were candidates were candidates for the election. One of the old board members has her friend on this newly elected board, and is therefore very content with the results, and does like the questioning of the votes discrepancy. The other one received the lowest number of votes and would rather leave the election results alone. I received the second highest number of votes, along with two others. The highest number of votes went to woman whose 17-year old son helped the management company rep count the votes by handing her the ballots. Since there were two open board positions and 3 people with tied votes for these positions, there should have been a runoff election. The management company rep said that she would not do a runoff election. So, people who had served on the previous board were asked to step down to give new people a chance. All that may have been fine if we didn't end up with 96 votes from 26 valid ballots, when the maximum votes any ballot could have is 3.

My question on this HOAtalk discussion board is: What legal recourse do I have to force the management company rep to make an open declaration to the previous and "newly elected" board that the election results are unreliable at best, and fraudulent at worst? She also needs to get an attorney's advice on this issue, which she has refused to do so far. I have suggested that she conduct a new election, but she has screamed that she is being harassed by these questions and it is causing her to have health issues. She will not conduct a re-election unless the "newly elected" board asks her to do so.

What is my legal recourse? In which court does such a complaint get filed? Does it need to go to court, or is there another authority that can intervene to resolve this issue?

Thanks for your input.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
So, are you saying that an invalidated ballot does not count toward "quorum"? The rep had only 27 ballots to start with (54 homes), and then she invalidates one because it has 6 votes instead of 3. So, does that mean that she had less than even 27 votes to establish her quorum (which should have been 28 ballots)?

Thanks.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
I thought that Small Claims Courts only dealt with monetary disputes of $5000 or less. We have no monetary dispute in this election votes discrepancy issue. So is there another court that reviews such complaints?

Thanks.
IshitaE (California)
Posts: 10
Posted:
Richard and Tim,

Yes, the election was conducted with secret ballots. The election process began correctly and the secret ballot requirements of the Davis-Sterling Act were followed closely. The election process fell apart at the vote counting which took place on September 17.

We have 54 homes, each of which is permitted 3 votes, the management company rep says that she received 27 ballots in all, one of which she disqualified because it had 6 votes, which gave her 26 valid ballots from which to draw her votes. Our quorum at 51% should have been 28 ballots (and not 27). The vote total for all 6 candidates adds up to 96 votes. Yet 26 ballots X 3 votes each can only give a maximum of 78 votes. Therefore the election gave us 18 more votes than would be possible with 26 valid ballots. Based on these unexplained additional votes, the rep announced a 3-way tie between the three second-highest vote receivers (myself and two others) for the two remaining board slots (in the 3 member BOD).

The management company rep has refused to explain this discrepancy. She permitted the 17 year old son of one of the candidates (who also ended up with getting the highest number of votes) to remove the ballots from their unmarked envelopes and to hand them to her for counting. The rep did the counting of the votes. There is no doubt that there are some serious problems with this vote counting process.

My question is, what legal recourse do I (as a homeowner and one of the candidates with the highest votes) have to get the management company rep to take the legally correct action: to disclose the discrepancy between the ballots and the votes, and to conduct a new election? It is in this that I need help on this discussion board.

Thanks very much.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By IshitaE on 10/10/2014 9:02 AM
Richard and Tim,

Yes, the election was conducted with secret ballots. The election process began correctly and the secret ballot requirements of the Davis-Sterling Act were followed closely. The election process fell apart at the vote counting which took place on September 17.

We have 54 homes, each of which is permitted 3 votes, the management company rep says that she received 27 ballots in all, one of which she disqualified because it had 6 votes, which gave her 26 valid ballots from which to draw her votes. Our quorum at 51% should have been 28 ballots (and not 27). The vote total for all 6 candidates adds up to 96 votes. Yet 26 ballots X 3 votes each can only give a maximum of 78 votes. Therefore the election gave us 18 more votes than would be possible with 26 valid ballots. Based on these unexplained additional votes, the rep announced a 3-way tie between the three second-highest vote receivers (myself and two others) for the two remaining board slots (in the 3 member BOD).

The management company rep has refused to explain this discrepancy. She permitted the 17 year old son of one of the candidates (who also ended up with getting the highest number of votes) to remove the ballots from their unmarked envelopes and to hand them to her for counting. The rep did the counting of the votes. There is no doubt that there are some serious problems with this vote counting process.

My question is, what legal recourse do I (as a homeowner and one of the candidates with the highest votes) have to get the management company rep to take the legally correct action: to disclose the discrepancy between the ballots and the votes, and to conduct a new election? It is in this that I need help on this discussion board.

Thanks very much.

Only Small Claims Court
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By IshitaE on 10/10/2014 8:58 AM
I thought that Small Claims Courts only dealt with monetary disputes of $5000 or less. We have no monetary dispute in this election votes discrepancy issue. So is there another court that reviews such complaints?

Thanks.

Small Claims Court does handle monetary claims of less than $10k. It also handles injunctive and equitable relief which can be non-monetary.

Read the full link, not just the excerpt I posted.

Also read the D-S tab on Injunctive and Equitable Relieve here:

http://www.davis-stirling.com/InjunctiveRelief/tabid/2648/Default.aspx#axzz3FkvLZBfE

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767
Posted:
I'm not saying this happened, but generally quorum is going to based upon Voting Power, though eligible to vote and have not had their voting rights suspended. If 4 owners were delinquent and properly had their voting rights suspended, then quorum would be 26 in your case. The ballot with 6 votes still would count toward quorum. The candidate's son should not have been allowed to handle any of the ballots, that is a clear violation of Civil Code.
CarolM11 (North Carolina)
Posts: 7
Posted:
First check out California Laws for HOA. If the law requires you to follow the Robert Rules of Order 11 edition then at the actual meeting you would have to object to the count and make a motion. If the meeting was adjourned without an objection and a motion then the count stands as stated.

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