More on Commercial Vehicles

I posted my question to another thread about restrictions on commercial vehicles. Am moving it here.

Unfortunately, ladder racks aren't mentioned in our docs. Wish they were.

We have 2 long time residents who would have a hard time with such a rule and we wouldn't want to antagonize them unnecessarily. Any thoughts?

We do have a weight restriction. But it looks like auto manufacturers are getting smarter - on some models, we haven't been able to find anything published - apparently there are many options and the published weight would depend on the options ordered.

Thanks John.

Our definition of commercial vehicles is not as comprehensive as some of those mentioned in the previous thread on commercial vehicles.

We don't allow signs or ladders. We don't have major issues with either of these.

None of the vehicles with ladder racks would fit inside a garage. This leaves driveway and on-street parking.

When I saw that in some HOAs, the docs banned "ladder racks," I had an aha moment. If we could ban them here, it would improve the general appearance. But my next thought was, what do we do about the homeowners who already have vehicles with ladder racks?

That's where I am stuck.

Hi dave
No objection to contractors working on site. No objection to owners loading and unloading materials from their house.
Objection is to the appearance of the community shifting from residential to commercial in nature.
So our original restrictions said no signs and no ladders, but didn't mention ladder racks.

.

Good to hear from you Dave. That's a perspective we'll have to address if we move forward with the idea. Thanks.

It shouldn't even be discussed. I dont know why your pursuing this domineering social behavior. Its not normal.

No problem. Happens a lot since Steve is my brother. Just not the Steve that's posting here :-)

Since this is a forum of dysfunctional HOA's, I wouldn't regard anything you see in this forum as "normal" Its typically the abnormal HOA's that are having all the problems.

I clearly understand your perspective. But what I am more interested in is how you have dealt with the issue of commercial vehicles in your own HOA. Do you have no restrictions at all? And if you tried to change what you have, do you think people would object?

Thanks Jon

Appreciate your added perspective.

It's interesting that you mentioned # of vehicles - both of the current homeowners who have ladder racks on their trucks are painting contractors. Both own multiple trucks in addition to their cars/SUVs. As a townhouse community, parking is always tight - and we would not want any increase in vehicles. Along with that, non-commercial trucks/SUVs are getting longer which only makes things tighter.

I was wondering if we could somehow grandfather these two contractors, but institute a new rule moving forward. What problems do you think this might cause?

Below are our current vehicle regs. Would appreciate any recommendations on how we could improve them given our current circumstances and objectives. Thanks.

Motor Vehicle Usage & Restrictions
• The speed limit within the Property is 15 m.p.h.
• No owner or occupant shall park, store or keep on any Lot or street or any parking space so as to be visible from anywhere on the Property, any commercial or other non-passenger type vehicle with a gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) above 9,200 pounds (including, but not limited to; trailers, campers, mobile homes, tractor trucks, "semis", trailer trucks, commercial machinery, vehicles with dual rear wheels, or any vehicle with a commercial body such as: utility, dump, stake, van box, delivery, flatbed, tank, etc.), or any vehicle with commercial signage or logos of any type, or any vehicle deemed to be a nuisance, safety hazard or incompatible with the residential character of the Community as determined by the Board of Directors.
• No unregistered, inoperable or abandoned motor vehicle may be parked, permitted, maintained, stored or kept on or about a Lot, or within the Property for more than forty-eight (48) hours per year without prior approval and/or notification to the Board of Directors. An exception is allowable providing (a) said vehicle is completely garaged and (b) the garage door can be properly closed with no part of the vehicle extending beyond the garage door entrance.
• No ladders, building materials or other commercial accessories shall be attached and/or stored on any vehicle parked in, on or about any Lot or common area.
• No vehicle shall cause or contribute to any damage to the road surface or adjacent curbing. Major car repairs are NOT permitted in driveways, roads or parking areas.
• Motor vehicles shall be operated in a safe and reasonable manner while in, on, or about the Community.
- All operators of motor vehicles shall comply with all traffic signs, devices and all local, state and federal rules, regulations and laws.
- All operators of motor vehicles shall comply with the vehicle traffic flow pattern as illustrated in Exhibits¬¬” attached hereto.
- Homeowners are required to communicate these rules to their guests and those to whom they entrust their vehicle.
• To accommodate short breaks and lunch periods between the hours of 8:00 AM to 5:00 PM, residents may park a commercial vehicle with signs displayed in their driveway for a period not to exceed one (1) hour.
- Said vehicle cannot exceed 9,200 pounds.
• Excessive resident vehicle noise of any type is prohibited in, on or about the ------------ Community.
• No vehicle shall be repaired, tuned, or otherwise mechanically serviced or attended in driveways, roads, or parking areas, except for emergency road service.
• Since water is a common expense, Lot Owners are permitted to wash one (1) vehicle no more than twice (2 times) per week, or two (2) vehicles no more than once (1-time) per week for each vehicle.
- Cleaning of vehicles is permitted only in Lot Owners driveway.
- Cleaning of vehicles in the street and common areas is prohibited.

Thanks Tim

oops: 9,000 lbs.

NP

Another thought. Our tough restriction HOA said no over night parking of commercial vehicles. You need not try to fix the hours.

A plumbing truck in my driveway at 10pm is more then likely not mine nor of my choosing nor desire.

Thanks everyone. We haven't had any problems with alarms going off, so we're lucky there.

I did get a chance to look at the trucks today. I wanted to make sure that the ladder racks are in fact accessories and not built into the vehicles. They could be removed. However, we have a hard enough time getting one of the owners to remember to remove the magnetic signs from the side of his truck when he parks for the night. Asking him to remove the ladder racks every night wouldn't work.

Two questions:

1. Both of the owners have lived here with these or similar trucks on site for decades. Do you think we can grandfather them on this basis alone?

2. Do you think that by taking no action for decades against ladder racks (which we could apparently do under our "no commercial accessories" provision), we have given up the right to enforce the rule moving forward?

From Connecticut DMV:

Hi Rw

Not sure that a HOA would be subject to the defense of laches.

If laches applied, then anytime a new board decides to beef up enforcement, they could be stopped.

On the other hand, our HOA has been through many boards, and none of them has attempted to enforce a restriction against ladder racks.

Thanks for the input though.

Interesting stuff Tim. Thanks.

I think I have a decent picture of how laches could be a defense to construction violations like your fence example.

But there are so many ways that vehicles aren't like fences.

So let's assume there's an HOA that has a lazy board that does nothing about abandoned cars for years, and the definition of abandoned cars includes unregistered cars. Finally, after a long battle, that board gets ousted and a new board is established. The new board goes after the abandoned cars. A homeowner who has an unregistered car on the street claims laches because his car has been parked on premises for over 3 years.

As you can see, I am struggling with the overlap of 2 issues - the difference between vehicles and real property - and the ability of a new board to dig itself out of a hole created by prior boards.

Would appreciate your feedback.

There are a number of defenses available for the HO. This lists a few:

http://www.hindmansanchez.com/resources/article/avoiding-common-covenant-enforcement-defenses

I am good with everything you recommended Tim. Thanks.

One twist. How do you think that things would be affected if we grandfathered the 2 homeowners who currently have ladder racks on their trucks? We would still follow your four steps outlined and announce the clarification (and the 2 waivers).