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DavidW14 (Florida)
Posts: 8
Posted:
Our Florida HOA Association Documents state:
"Any Assessment not paid within thirty (30) days after the due date shall be considered "Delinquent" and Past Due. Past due General and Special Assessments shall bear interest at the highest rate permitted by law, together with a late fee of $25.00 per month. General and Special Assessments and interest, late fees, costs and Attorneys Fees shall be a charge on the Lot, Unit or Parcel and shall be a continuing lien upon the Lot, Unit or Parcel, against which each General and/or Special Assessment is made."

Further, it states:
"Any assessments which are not paid when due shall be delinquent. If the assessment is not paid within thirty (30) days after the due date, the assessment shall bear interest from the date of delinquency at the maximum rate allowed by Florida law from time to time, and the Association may bring an action at law against the Owner personally obligated to pay the same or foreclose the lien against the property, and interest, costs and reasonable attorneys' fees of any such action shall be added to the amount of such assessment."

Further, it states:
"As more fully provided in the Declaration, each member is obligated to pay to the Association annual and special assessments which are secured by a continuing lien upon the property against which the assessment is made."

Further, it states:
"Upon recording of a notice of lien, there shall exist a perfected lien for unpaid General and/or Special Assessments on the respective Lot, Unit or Parcel prior and superior to all other liens, except (1) all taxes, bonds, assessments, and other levies which by law would be superior thereto, and (2) the lien or charge of any Institutional first Mortgage."

Lastly, it states:
"It shall be the duty of the Board of Directors as more fully provided in the Declaration, to foreclose the lien against any property for which assessments are not paid within thirty (30) days after due date, or to bring an action at law against the Owner personally obligated to pay the same"

I am confused as to what "foreclose the lien" means in the last paragraph. Do our Documents imply that we send out a notice for the assessment and if the assessment is not paid within 30 days of the due date, we file a lien? Also, do our Documents state that we can charge a late fee after the 30 days and add the late fee to the lien? In other words, a homeowner is 30 days past due. We charge a late fee but also immediately file a lien.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
David, a delinquent account has an automatic lien against the property. No lien has to be filed; this lien is already covered under the deed restrictions. The late charge and interest are added to the delinquent account and if the Board desires a lien can also be filed in addition to the automatic lien. These amounts can be used to "encourage" payment prior to further action.

Lastly, It is the duty of the Board of Directors, as more fully provided in the Declaration, to foreclose the lien against any property for which assessments are not paid within thirty (30) days after due date, or to bring an action at law against the Owner personally obligated to pay the same. I suggest first an action to garnish wages and bank accounts before forecloseing against the property.
JM2 (Oregon)
Posts: 439
Posted:
Hi David:

Foreclose the lien = force a sale of the house. There are plenty of "horror stories" of people getting forced out of houses for small amounts. The power to foreclose is an "ultimate power" that the HOA has over the homeowners to collect assessments. Unfortunately, it's sometimes used as a first resort, rather than a last resort.

Most HOA law firms handle collections issues. Typical is that they seek a monetary judgment and then go through the requisite processes to get the money, if possible (garnish wages, empty bank accounts, etc.).

One problem with foreclosures is that the HOA can end up without any money from that process, if the homeowner owes more than the home is worth; this can happen if property values fall, if they have an interest-only loan, or if they've stopped making mortgage payments.

Has anybody talked to the homeowner? There may be some temporary circumstances that would not allow them to pay assessments now, but be able to soon (such as an extended illness). A payment plan might be in order.

J. Patrick Moore, CMCA
BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418
Posted:
One warning about liens in Florida. You can't have the basis of the lien be anything more than the Association dues. If the homeowner is late and gets a late fee but pays the base dues, you can not place a lien. If the homeowner has fines but continues to pay his dues, you can not place a lien.

Some Associations get into a grey area of having an order of payment where the dues are the last thing in order, such as:

Legal Fees
NSF Charges
Late Fees
Fines
Dues

Our Association has this order, unless otherwise specified:

Legal Fees
NSF Charges
Dues
Late Fees
Fines

Since we invoice each quarter it would be tough for us to argue that the coupon which is included with the check was not meant for dues. To prevent future boards from trying the first order and getting the Association in trouble we elected the second order. However, it is almost always accompanied by a dues slip so it is specified.

Some Associations "convert" the fines and late fees and other expenses into a generic Assessment because their governing documents say all fines and expenses are Assessments. Florida Statute 720.305 says that is not permitted and I have seen reports of some Associations being fined or sued for doing this. Back in 2004, Florida took much of the lien rights away from the Associations because many were abusing it and taking houses for small amounts of money, often based on fines.

We are left with the annual assessment as the only thing that can form the basis of the lien. Once you have the lien you can add the other things but if the homeowner knows what they are doing they can avoid this.
HaroldS1 (Arizona)
Posts: 314
Posted:
Brad is correct. In Arizona the statues clearly insist any payment received must first be applied to outstanding assessments. That is to prevent applying a payment to say a lawyer's fee, and leaving the assessment outstanding. In Arizona an HOA can foreclose on unpaid assessments, but cannot foceclose on unpaid fines, interest, lawyer's fees, etc. so the law wants any payment received to be applied first to outstanding assessments. Harold
DavidW14 (Florida)
Posts: 8
Posted:
I guess my question is this. Look at this passage in our Documents:
"It shall be the duty of the Board of Directors as more fully provided in the Declaration, to foreclose the lien against any property for which assessments are not paid within thirty (30) days after due date, or to bring an action at law against the Owner personally obligated to pay the same"

Is that saying we MUST foreclose the lien or bring an action at law after 30 days? Is does it indicate we can do that if we so desire? It seems to me that the passage tells us we MUST foreclose the lien after 30 days. That we have no option.
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
David, while "it SHALL be the duty", if you read carefully it does not say explicitly when this action must be taken. Except it must be taken sometime after 30 days since it states "if not paid within 30 days". Therefore I believe the Board can use good business judgement as to when to bring legal action.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I've done a foreclosure before. It wasn't in the original 30 days. It was about 2 years AFTER the original dues were owed. Basically, we agreed as a majority of the homeowner's and board, that after 6 months of non-payment of dues, we would pursue a lien on a person's house. We gave them 30 days to respond and pay up and then placed the lien if ignored.
If you have a "tough" HOA who wants to pursue non-payers, then the 30 days rule applies. However, if your HOA is pretty "loose", the non-payer may get some more time or a payment plan to catch-up. I used to give an informal notice to the person after 3 months of non-payment, just to know why they were behind. If it were personal and reasonable (surgery, death in family etc...) I would tell them to double their payment the next month sans the late fee. We charged $20 late fee for anything paid after the 15th of the month. That way they could catch-up before the 6 month rule took effect.
Some states it does cost money to file a lien. My state of Alabama, it is about $300 to place a lien. That means the HOA is out the $300 PLUS the money the member owes. That member can keep refusing to pay for years but can't sell the house until they pay it off. The lien keeps going up with each missed payment.
We did decide on one house to pursue foreclosure. It did have a lien on it for over 2 years. The lien wasn't getting the owner's attention and we needed the money. I gave them notice that we were officially pursuing foreclosing on the filed lien. The owner refused to pay and the house was foreclosed on. The owner just had to pay $2K and they would have kept the house. It was a board's and majority members vote that we did go and pursue the foreclosure route. Although it was waay past the 30 days.
Our HOA waited so long to file basically because no one knew what they were doing. I had legal knowledge and the means to pursue it. Your HOA may be doing the same thing. No one on the board or in office is confident enough to pursue what is the legal right of the HOA to pursue non-payers. So even though your documents say 30 days, if no one wants to take the action, they won't.
I will say that foreclosure is NOT the money maker for an HOA as people assume it is. It is WAAAY more complicated than the "horror" stories detail. I will say this... A foreclosure can stop at anytime during the process if the owner just pays what is owed.

Former HOA President
KimberlyS2 (Georgia)
Posts: 32
Posted:
I would really like to know what this country is coming to...We have troops fighting for our freedom and civil liberties when that means nothing to associations...I do not believe that an association should put a lein against anyones home they should find other ways...people work hard for what they have and to have someone use scare tactics to take what they earned away.
I do not understand how associations sleep at night. I do not believe that associations should be above the law nor do I feel there laws should be above state laws to force homes into foreclosure for their own bottom dollar.

I live in an association and they left alot out of their books when I moved in which now its to late, now I have to deal with their changes when ever they feel like it peoples voices mean nothing they do what they want, they hold elections which mean nothing they elect who they want anyway.

I bought a house not a town house and not a condo.

I worked hard to own my first home to have someone run my life and not care what they do to the people that live under their association.

I think associations should be outlawed.

a committee for grounds keeping and for the up keep of the property is cheaper
then paying for these half cocked board members to do what they want.

I guarantee they most likely do not even live under their own rules.

signed
a concerned association member
DavidW14 (Florida)
Posts: 8
Posted:
Well, I did not mean to stir the pot on this one. I joined the Board because our Board has run rampant over the homeowners. I have no desire to foreclose a lien after 30 days. I was just curious as to whether our Documents REQUIRE it based on the passage I copied.
BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418
Posted:
KimberlyS2, what do you suggest an association do to get people to pay their fair share? We have a home owner that hasn't paid dues in three years, another that has paid occasionally for two and a half years; a third house that hasn't paid for two years and is currently being foreclosed on their mortgage company and one house that owe years worth. We have 50 houses and an annual budget of $22,500; those four houses alone owe more than $4,500 to the Association.

Do we ask the landscaper to wait on his payment until they start paying? How about the electric company? When Homeowners don’t contribute their fair share then either we have to cut things out of the budget or have to raise everyone’s dues so that those that pay are cover for those that don’t. If someone moves without paying, what is the Association supposed to do? You feel strongly, so what do you suggest?

I have considered the options and the problem is that the laws were created to benefit the lawyers. I don’t want to add an extra $300 to someone for legal fees but I can’t find a legal alternative. I can’t contact someone’s mortgage company and have them pressure the Homeowners into paying; that would be a violation of the Federal Fair Debt Collections Act. I can’t post who hasn’t paid in either the newsletter or on a bulletin for the same reason. There is no alternative that I can find other than involving an attorney that doesn’t create some form of liability.

These people to owe money to the Association have received several notices and been offered an opportunity to appear before the board to work out a payment plan. Not one has ever showed up in person to a board meeting. When we did hear from them either on the phone or by the mail, they just used our offer of good will as a delay tactic and outright lied to us about their intentions. No extra payments were made and we never received the checks that we were promised. Deadbeats know the rules and while I feel bad about adding $300 legal fees to a $300 outstanding balance, I won’t endanger the Association.

In the end, the choice is do I let people who have received several notices and have failed to even contact the Association just not pay or do I put a lien on the house so that when it sells the Association gets paid? After a period of time, the choice is do I wait for the house to sell and the Homeowner possible is foreclosed on by someone else or do I start the proceedings myself? An interesting observation we have had is the same people who don’t pay their dues don’t keep up their house. They clearly don’t want to be in a deed restricted community, but they are and they must participate the same as everyone else.

The board is not paid at all. Virtually all Associations are non-profit organizations and if the board is reimbursed for their time that would endanger the corporate status. The board is made up of volunteers who pay the dues themselves on top of the time they donate. If you don’t like what is going on try getting involved and doing something. If you don’t you are the only one to blame.

Disputes between Homeowners and Associations are matters of Corporate law and the judge typically sees it as the Homeowner trying to not abide by the terms of a contract. If you don’t like Associations don’t buy a house in a deed restricted community. If you didn’t read the governing documents, then you only have yourself to blame. Whether you like it or not, you agreed to be part of an Association and abide by the rules of it.
KimberlyS2 (Georgia)
Posts: 32
Posted:
I'm glad you asked, their are legal things that can be done so people don't lose their houses.

1)Garnish wages

2)you can put judgements on bank accounts if money goes in it is taken out and given to the person that took the judgement out.

I know this because my X did not pay for or canceled a check on car repairs the checking account was frozen and money in their was taken out.

Why do Associations have to go to extreme, people work hard for someone to have that kind of authority.

BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418
Posted:
Those suggests cost even more than a lien; remember, all of that requires a lawyer. So instead of adding $300 to get a lien I would be adding $1,500 to garnish wages or get a judgement. In addition to costing more, those options are less secure. If the person changes jobs or bank accounts, what has that gotten me?
KimberlyS2 (Georgia)
Posts: 32
Posted:
Brad,

your full of many words but I hope you never fall into hardship and they foreclose on your house even though you have been keeping up the mortgage payments and the associations won't work with you.

my situation is bad but manageable, but I will never move into a community that has an association ever again.

I want to live my life without someone telling me how, when, with who and how often.

If you want to pay for that because its pretty that is fine.

Most associations are in it for the $$$$$$$ not the people.

BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418
Posted:
I understand your viewpoint but please understand mine for a minute. I am the President of an Association in Florida who got involved because it kept getting worse. Basic maintenance wasn't done in many of the public areas, our management company kept screwing things up and we had about 8 houses that were behind in thier payments.

We have an annual budget of $22,500 and last year we were $4,400 in the hole and our insurance went up by $1,600. I persuaded the board to become self managed to save $7,000 and we have been doing much of the work ourselves.

Part of that is getting the houses that are past due caught up. About half have sent in the past due amounts and we have not recently heard from any of the others. We have had to have involve collections attorneys on two of those people. They have been sent several letters and haven't responded so a lien and persueing a foreclosure is all we can do. If they won't contact the board about working out a payment plan then there is nothing we can do.

What should I say to the Homeowners that do pay if I don't pursue those that won't?
RonaldW (South Carolina)
Posts: 901
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KimberlyS2 on 05/02/2007 9:24 AM
Brad,

your full of many words but I hope you never fall into hardship and they foreclose on your house even though you have been keeping up the mortgage payments and the associations won't work with you.

my situation is bad but manageable, but I will never move into a community that has an association ever again.

I want to live my life without someone telling me how, when, with who and how often.

If you want to pay for that because its pretty that is fine.

Most associations are in it for the $$$$$$$ not the people.


Kimberly, you really need to sell that house and move to the country. This is driving you insane and getting you nowhere. Did you miss the part about each member paying his/her share? Do you feel that your neighbors should pay their assessments but you shouldn't have to because of personal money issues?

Did you miss the part about association officers volunteering their time (and effort in many cases)? It's not about the "$$$$$$$", this is what it takes to run an association and keep the property in good repair.

Ron
SC

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