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SusieG1 (Idaho)
Posts: 2
Posted:
I purchased a new 4 Plex in Idaho that was to be part of a planned community, closing the sale almost exactly at the time the mortgage crisis hit in 2007. The developer hired an investment company to sell the 4 Plexes to investors (was supposed to be about 75 built in total). Long story short, the investment company went bankrupt, many investors lost their deposits, many could no longer qualify for the loan and the developer now had lots of properties in which he couldn't sell. Needless to say it was a mess, some investors foreclosed, my unit was empty for over a year, etc. Eventually a property management company was hired and things started to improve. There are a total of 57 units of which 19 are owned by individual investors and the other 38 are owned by the developer. For a couple of years he tried to sell them but with the recession and housing collapse, no success. The developer's (husband and wife) daughter has a commercial property management company and the other daughter in 2012 formed a separate division called the multifamily division and was "selected" by the board (her parents) to be the property management company for our HOA. Most of us feel that the property maintenance fees are too high but we have no say. Their hourly rate for $82.50 which seems especially high considering this is in Idaho and I live in California . We have on site maintenance and the property management company says this cost is for the time to create the work order, contact the renter, make arrangement to enter the unit, diagnose problem, contact vendor if necessary and make arrangements between owner an vendor, go to warehouse, collect material, complete work order, enter into system, bill owner, bill resident. All of the money they are making is staying in their family one way or another. The majority owner is the developer and therefore we don't have a say. They remind us the developer has a vested interest because he owns so many units but how do we know he is being billed the same as we are, if he was I would think the fee would seem excessive to him. He is no longer trying to sell his units and actually keeps sending out offers to the rest of us to purchase our units which of course are still under water. I can only assume he would like to now own the entire complex which would enable him to package it up and sell the entire property or take 100% ownership. We feel like its a conflict of interest with the entire family managing the finances, and the property management. The majority of the 19 owners are out of state investors. We don't foresee the developer making any effort to sell therefore the HOA will never be turned over. I feel we have a unique situation here of which none of us 19 owners know exactly what to do.

I am curious as to what others think, are we being paranoid? My maintenance costs alone in 2013 were $3439.48 for my one 4plex, if all 57 units were similar that would be $196,050 in maintenance costs which seems absurd to me. Any thoughts or advice would be greatly appreciated.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Welcome Susie, unfortunately this is one of the risks you take when you buy into a developer owned HOA. Because the developer has so many units you will always be at a disadvantage and they can outvote you at every turn. If you can afford to, my advice would be to sell if possible, even if you have to take a small hit, it may save you in the long run.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Susie

Are you making money from this investment? If not how much of a reduction in the $3,500.00 yearly expenses would it require for you to make a profit?

Is the real issue how/who runs the place or the fact that you bought in at the high and you are underwater?

Thanks
SusieG1 (Idaho)
Posts: 2
Posted:
Thanks for your question. I am not making money, for example, last year, my total expenses were $12,319.47 while my income was $13,202.21, this does not include property taxes and insurance, (an additional $5000). The occupancy rate is high, but I feel like the quality of tenants is low, so turnover is frequent and with that comes the cost to make it rent ready again. I've never owned this type of rental property before, and have never been part of an HOA, it feels unique and that's why I am trying to gain more understanding of HOA's so I know if myself and the other investors who are also upset have a right to be. As an example, we were told over a year ago that all of the water heaters that were installed have some sort of a problem and that as they experience problems they will be replacing them as they are a fire hazard. Some of us have had to replace two at a time within just a few weeks of each other, is it coincidence that they would go out at the same time, I supposed it could be, but it makes us all suspicious. Also, knowing that they would all need to be replaced over time, wouldn't it have made sense to go out and negotiate a really good deal with a vendor knowing that the vendor would ultimately be replacing 228 water heaters? At $1039 each (parts and installation) it's been frustrating. Additionally for one of my units, the property management had to re-light it 3-4 times at $41.50 each time for the half hour billing rate before they decided it needed replacing. How much transparency is required in a typical HOA? In this example, should they have gone out to bid for water heater replacements and then allowed us to see the quotes? Is it fair for them to tack on 10% of the cost of the repair for getting the vendor, etc. as they are doing that as well? We don't see the vendors invoice, only the property management companies invoice after they upload to our on-line portal. If I was making money, yes, it wouldn't be such an issues, but I am 7 years in, and not turning any profit and I feel like I could be if management was better run. Appreciate your feedback, just getting other opinions is helpful, I guess there is something to be said for therapy:-)
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,001
Posted:
cut your losses

stop the bleeding

RUN

you will NEVER make a profit unless you are self managed

the management company will get 20-25% PERIOD, DONE DEAL

absentee landlords are either:

slumlords (won't happen due to the HOA)

or

broke

CAVEAT EMPTOR
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Susie

The bottom line is even with zero management charges you are losing money. It is a bad investment. Cut your losses and move on.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Just curious... Are you deducting these costs from your taxes? If this is rental property, the dues and repairs are tax deductible. If you live in the homes they are NOT. The HOA is only funded by the owners. So it seems that you have to pay to play...

Former HOA President
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:
Is it fair for them to tack on 10% of the cost of the repair for getting the vendor, etc. as they are doing that as well?


Yes. This is normal. The mgmt company is not going to get bids, make sure the work is done and then pay them for FREE. They have payroll expenses and that 10% is paying for that.

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