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DidooG1 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
I filed a complaint with the BBB in Florida against the management company that handles the affairs of my association. When they found out the management company contacted the president of the association who then called a special meeting, indicating it was to go over bylaw changes. This happened in between our regular meetings. Because the president called for this meeting in between our regular meetings it is considered a special meeting. There are 7 members on the board, 4 are identical clones of the president. All are very mature in age, single Caucasian females and never say or do anything against her, they are all friends and she set the board up this way. When the president found out from the management company that I contacted the BBB concerning the management company she contacted her 4 clones and the 5 of them got together (how is unknown either by email, phone or in person) and they decided to give the management representative the first 7 minutes of the special meeting to berate and belittle me in front of my community.
Two bits of info to add here, I am also a board member, but my complaint in no way involved the board. I filed it after a meeting, and never said anything about involving the board at all. Also there is another board member that was not privy to what was going to happen to me, she does not meet the criteria of the other clones. Both of us wear left out of any discussion or information concerning the 5 members of the board choosing to allow the REP. to have his way with me. This REP. treated me like my father would have decades ago, while yelling at me from across the room, calling names, and threatening me he had the audacity to DEMAND I look at him when I turned away. He told the community my personal business while totally, freaking me out. The only good news is I video recorded the whole meeting including the 7 minute rant.
There are so many things the board did wrong here. I have a few ideas, if I miss anything please feel free to help out,
1-They had some kind of meeting and decided to handle association business with out including all the board members also there seems to be no minutes to look over.
2-Special meetings are only for the business that the meeting was called for. The 7 minute rant from the REP. was not on the agenda.
3-Not including all board members in the information that was passed around from the management company and each other.
4-ALL failed in there fiduciary responsibility by allowing the management company REP. to belittle me in front of my community because of a personal vendetta against me. (I also do not fit there cloning criteria, as I am a man and have opinions of my own) What the REP. did in NO WAY benefitted the association.
5-When the president sent out an email asking for the meeting I asked what it was for, she replied, "conforming different things and bylaw changes" nothing else.
6-The REP's. verbal attack on me was unnecessary and he admitted that "HE FELT CCOMPELED TO CONFRONT ME IN PUBLIC", wear he called me several different names.
All this because I discovered that the former president was collecting a crazy amount of money every month from the association, (our bylaws prohibit any financial payments to board members for any reason, as do Florida statues) and she just happens to fit the clone criteria perfectly. She is long time friend of the 5 board members that do not want to look into this issue. I also discovered that the election that the current president won was fixed, well kind of. The old management company that was fired right after the elections admitted they made a mistake counting the votes when I want to see them after they wear let go. I got copies of ALL the paperwork and it seems they wear off by 4 votes. In my community 4 votes is enough to get you on or off the board. These two issues together started what has now consumed my life at least for the last 6 weeks.
I am interested in suing the management company and the board. I also want to use the video recording to get financial help to retain a lawyer as they all want a hefty deposit up front. I had a notice posted about the recording, it is noticeable in the recording itself. I only recorded the board and management company, and the board members wear notified well in advance of the meeting. I am thinking about a "kick starter account and or fund me".....to help get the $7000 I need.
Any thoughts or help would be greatly much appreciated..
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,061
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/08/2014 4:57 PM

There are so many things the board did wrong here. I have a few ideas, if I miss anything please feel free to help out,
1-They had some kind of meeting and decided to handle association business with out including all the board members also there seems to be no minutes to look over.

Yet, per your own posting, how this occurred is not known.
You only suspect that this happened, and your suspicion may be correct, you do not have any proof it actually occurred. Therefore, my advice would be to stick with what you can prove and not what you suspect.

Didoo, I agree that the rant was unprofessional. I agree that the Board should not have allowed it to continue. If I was the one the rant was against, I would have simply responded that that was unprofessional of the MC and make an immediate motion to fire the contractor for cause. You might not have won such a motion but it would have been on the record.

You didn't indicate why you filed a complaint against the MC. Therefore lets discuss the action of filing the complaint instead.

Did you try to resolve the issue directly with the MC first?
If you did and that failed, did you bring the issue to the attention of the Board?
If you did and that failed, or if you didn't do either of those things, I think taking a complaint to the BBB was a little premature. Even though you are a member of the Association, you are also a member of the Board. As a Board member, the MC works for you and the issue should have been resolved internally if possible. If that attempt failed to resolve the issue then, in my opinion, going to a third party would be appropriate. However, the attempt needed to happen first.

Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/08/2014 4:57 PM

All this because I discovered that the former president was collecting a crazy amount of money every month from the association, (our bylaws prohibit any financial payments to board members for any reason, as do Florida statues) and she just happens to fit the clone criteria perfectly.

Well, what are the payments for?
Is the individual still a member of the Board (your posting isn't clear on that)?

Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/08/2014 4:57 PM

I also discovered that the election that the current president won was fixed, well kind of. The old management company that was fired right after the elections admitted they made a mistake counting the votes when I want to see them after they wear let go. I got copies of ALL the paperwork and it seems they wear off by 4 votes. In my community 4 votes is enough to get you on or off the board.

How long ago was the election? Per FL 720.306 (9) you only have 60 days to contest the results of an election.

Has that time elapsed?

If not, Have you properly contested the election yet?

Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/08/2014 4:57 PM

I am interested in suing the management company and the board. Any thoughts or help would be greatly much appreciated..

I'm still not sure why you want to sue the MC or your Association.

Is it for the payments to the past president (who may or may not still be a member of the Board)? Well, until you know what those payments were for, you don't know if there is an actual issue or simply a perceived issue with those payments.

Is it about the election results? Well, as I indicated earlier, has the time frame to contest the elections lapsed? Have you filed a complaint with the FL Ombudsman? Is the other MC willing to testify to the votes not being counted? Do you have proof (copies of the actual ballots, proxies, membership lists and draft minutes of the annual meeting)?

I also think that it may be easier, and certainly less expensive, if you simply gather support to recall your current Board.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
I have to ask why you want to spend $7k? What do you expect to gain?

It seems like a lot of money to prove a point or get vindication that you will probably run out of money before you ever see.

Would you mind sharing what your complaint against the MC involved?

Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
EricH8 (Virginia)
Posts: 116
Posted:
From the Subject: video recording HOA meeting ,
I thought this was going to be about video recording HOA meetings. Silly me.
DidooG1 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
When 5 of 7 board members talk about association business it is a meeting, how they communicated is not the issue. By email, phone or a meeting in person. It is illegal to conduct association business with out informing ALL board members and having an open meeting for the public to attend and minutes must be taken of all meetings also. A decision was reached by 5 of the 7 board members before the meeting even started to give the MC rep. the opportunity to tell the entire community my personal business, and to embarrass and belittle me while the board sat there and enjoyed every minute of it. It was a personal attack on me by the board, when the board allowed the MC rep. to do that to me, they failed in there fiduciary responsibility. The attack on me in NO WAY benefited the association, it was personal. That is a failure of fiduciary responsibility. I can prove they had a meeting because on the video recording, the president makes several statements that indicate 5 members of the 7 member board had discussed several issues. Also another board member said "I know we are going to talk about this later, but I think we should get rid of the old association files". She mentioned that before any one else, In her statement she admitted knowing what was going to be discussed before it was actually brought up.
I filed the complaint against the MC because, during a meeting in April, I brought up the fact that the former president was receiving $600+ monthly (over $24,000 in 3 years) to take care of the clubhouse,(the current president does the same thing for free now which is not permitted under any circumstances according to our bylaws and Florida statues. There is No legal reason a board member can collect compensation while servicing in Florida. I also had evidence that the election of officers was not properly done and votes counted improperly. I mentioned this with in 5 weeks of the election. All of this can be proven beyond a doubt. When I brought these items up the president and her board member friends jumped on me like a fat kid on a Twinkie, the management company sat there looking stupid and did nothing to see that the meeting was help properly. Also they wear unable to properly answer any questions concerning these issues. NOT legal questions, just simple questions about what the board is required to do, like should it be looked into deeper, ect.ect.
I sent to MC and all board members an email after the first horrible meeting indicating my intensions to file with the BBB. I waited 10 days before I did file the complaint, not one person reached out to me and asked what me problem was or how could we work out any issues. In a sense I am a member of a dictatorship, the president and her clones do what they want...The Mc is supposed to advise the board on matters concerning association business to stop the board from making bad decisions, that is one of their jobs. This MC in only doing what the president and her friends want, not what they are supposed to be doing.
We have all heard horror stories like this. Personal attacks are not permitted, by board members or MC.
DidooG1 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
ABOUT RECORDING MY HOA MEETING, One of the important questions I have concerns the video recording I did at the HOA meeting wear this horrible event happened. I did record the entire 7 minute rant, I want to know what I can and cant do with the video. I recorded ONLY the board no residents and I only want to post the first 7 minutes of the MC rant against me. My interest is to post it on kick starter or another sight of that nature to see if I can get enough money donations to sue every one involved. Can I do so, and do I need to blur out the faces of the board members. The meeting was public, the board and MC wear notified about the recording weeks in advance, then again 3 days in advance. I also posted a sigh on the table wear the board sits so the residents also knew about the recording. I know the recording is mine, just a bit unsure what I can do with it.
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
It is certainly unfortunate and inappropriate that you were disrespected and mishandled publicly.

It is nice to learn that you are open to a peacemaking gesture from the Board.

Before you spend $7,000, I would suggest that you pursue mediation. Based on what you have said, someone who is an expert in creating a setting where people can meet face to face without repercussion might be very helpful at this point in time.

You would not lose face by suggesting it. The 5 members would not lose face by accepting your proposal. You can ask that everything discussed in mediation be kept confidential. Or you and the 5 can come to terms on rules of engagement for the meeting through the assistance of a professional mediator.

Would probably be time well spent.


Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
DidooG1 (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
I can prove that the board members set me up and allowed this attack to happen intentionally, that alone is a failure of there fiduciary responsibility, board members are not allowed to let there personal feelings interfere with there duties as officers of the community. It is literally against the law at least in Florida.
Board members cant use there power to Couse or intentionally allow to let members of the community be harassed for any reason. They also with held information from me and another board member, as well as conspiring with the management company to inform the community I live in my personal business. The harassment still continues as I have a request currently denied by the same members of the board that allowed the attack to happen in the first place.
Before you ask, the request is to do some work on my back yard. My bylaws state clearly I am permitted to do what I want to, and it would in no way cause any other residents any problems. Instead of the MC informing the board members that according to our bylaws I can do this, they just stopped comminuting with me and only told me my request was denied because the board wants to eliminate on street parking SOME DAY. The streets are maintained by the county, and are public streets and residents have been parking on the streets for 2 decades.
The 7k would not be mine...Id would be funded by donations from kick starter or another sight of that nature. Also because the board did what they did INTENIONALLY, THE insurance THAT ALL BOARD MEMBERS HAVE will not cover them. If its a wanton and willful act (witch it was) they would have to pay out of there pockets for what they did. If you seen the video you would understand exactly how bad it was. All the planning it took to pull it off
this attack and the lies involved could only have been done intentionally and with malice, just to break me down in front of my community.That makes it illegal.. For that they need to pay....
JonD1
Posts: 2,350
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/09/2014 10:00 AM
I can prove that the board members set me up and allowed this attack to happen intentionally, that alone is a failure of there fiduciary responsibility, board members are not allowed to let there personal feelings interfere with there duties as officers of the community. It is literally against the law at least in Florida.
Board members cant use there power to Couse or intentionally allow to let members of the community be harassed for any reason. They also with held information from me and another board member, as well as conspiring with the management company to inform the community I live in my personal business. The harassment still continues as I have a request currently denied by the same members of the board that allowed the attack to happen in the first place.
Before you ask, the request is to do some work on my back yard. My bylaws state clearly I am permitted to do what I want to, and it would in no way cause any other residents any problems. Instead of the MC informing the board members that according to our bylaws I can do this, they just stopped comminuting with me and only told me my request was denied because the board wants to eliminate on street parking SOME DAY. The streets are maintained by the county, and are public streets and residents have been parking on the streets for 2 decades.
The 7k would not be mine...Id would be funded by donations from kick starter or another sight of that nature. Also because the board did what they did INTENIONALLY, THE insurance THAT ALL BOARD MEMBERS HAVE will not cover them. If its a wanton and willful act (witch it was) they would have to pay out of there pockets for what they did. If you seen the video you would understand exactly how bad it was. All the planning it took to pull it off
this attack and the lies involved could only have been done intentionally and with malice, just to break me down in front of my community.That makes it illegal.. For that they need to pay....

I think you misunderstand fiduciary duty and the board's role. Before you hang your hat on that legal argument best to collect a factual understanding of the law.

You decided to take an action that could damage the ability of your MC to do business do you really not understand their response?

Before you head off on a course on conflict I would suggest you ask yourself do you want to be right or do you want to live a peaceful life.

By publishing your tape recording you will be escalating the conflict. Your view seems to be that scores some points for you. My guess you increase the level of bad feelings and would be shooting yourself in the foot.

When people are attacked some fight back. Seems your MC and board are such people.

Is this a fight you see yourself winning in the end?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I think this was a great misunderstanding on everyone's behalf. Especially NOT understanding the roles you have as a board member or a general member. You did NOT need to go behind the board's back to report this to the BBB. First off, the contract with the MC is the entire HOA's. It was worth a discussion amongst ALL the board for your concerns. If they were then deemed valid, then the PRESIDENT should have initiated a chat with the management company. Plus you all needed to have lined up another potential company to take over if you decided to let them go. Typically, atleast 30 days notice to terminate would have been involved.

Hate to tell you, but you are part of the issue and your communications are to be OPEN to ALL the board. If it's an open meeting, then ALL communications are to be read outloud. There is no "anonymous" letters accepted in my HOA. Names withheld yes. However, we have the obligation to read the communications we receive at meetings in order to address the issue. It's NOT a behind close doors thing. I say if you have a problem with your HOA you either attend a meeting, get involved in making the change, or expect your letters to be read out loud at meetings. End of discussion and the beginning of yours. Complain your HOA handles things behind doors and then complain about them reading correspondence openly, kind of shows your NOT about being open.

Does my advice "If you sue your HOA, your suing yourself and your neighbors"? The same applies to suing your fellow board members. How selfish is it to go after people's PERSONAL money for a decision involving a GROUP decision. This was NOT done as private citizens. It was done as part of a GROUP/Incorporation. One you are also responsible for. You sue, your suing yourself as well in this case.

Simply stop the drama, and learn how to conduct meetings better and draw a line between you and the MC. The MC is a contractor to the HOA. They do NOT run the HOA. They do not have to obey the HOA rules. They are paid to enforce them if in the contract. You do not like them? Then shop for another option and present them to the board. Simple as that.

Former HOA President
NpS (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 4,216
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DidooG1 on 07/09/2014 10:00 AM

The 7k would not be mine...Id would be funded by donations from kick starter or another sight of that nature.

.. For that they need to pay....

1. There's an old saying: "Put your money where your mouth is." If you aren't willing to do that, you have earned zero credibility with me.

2. I took a quick look at kickstarter.com. Surprise surprise. They have 15 categories for contributions and none of them is titled "funds for lawsuits."

3. How much do they "need to pay"? Do you think that you are going to get money awarded to you because your feelings were hurt or a rule was violated? Wake up to reality. There's no money in this other than the $7k going to a lawyer that you think you can raise through "donations."


Sikubali jukumu. Read all posts at your own risk.
JaniceR4 (Florida)
Posts: 5
Posted:
You don't need any permission to record or post the video online. If you post it somewhere send me the link, I want to watch it.
Florida statues 720.306
(10) RECORDING.—Any parcel owner may tape record or videotape meetings of the board of directors and meetings of the members. The board of directors of the association may adopt reasonable rules governing the taping of meetings of the board and the membership.
RwT (Florida)
Posts: 154
Posted:
Complaints against the PM/MC should be filed with the Florida DBPR.
They are the licensing authority for this occupation.

Google it for the necessary information.

* Non-Lawyer spokesperson.

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