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Holistic Meetings in Clubhouse

Started by AlexM1 • 15 replies • 1792 views

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AlexM1 (Oklahoma)
Posts: 287
Posted:
One Renter in our condo complex wants to use the clubhouse for holding holistic meetings to explain to people how they
can find peace I this/that, etc. Supposedly he is doing this free to people who come in. Although not clear at this time, but is appears
that he wants to hold weekly meetings....for how long, I do not know. I am questioning as to whether our HOA can get into some sort of trouble
by allowing such meetings.... any ideas?
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
Do residents pay a fee and a refundable security deposit to reserve your clubhouse?
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Are renters allowed to rent? That would be my first question. I would then be concerned about letting general public into the clubhouse if not an owner guest. I don't care what someone rents the clubhouse for except for fire worshipping ceremonies. It's none of my business as long as they pay the rental fee and don't do any damage.
Former HOA President
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 06/04/2014 3:05 PM
Are renters allowed to rent? That would be my first question. I would then be concerned about letting general public into the clubhouse if not an owner guest. I don't care what someone rents the clubhouse for except for fire worshipping ceremonies. It's none of my business as long as they pay the rental fee and don't do any damage.

Mel raised an interesting point about renters and the general public not being an owner's guest. It could get tricky.

DouglasK1 (Florida)
Posts: 2,046
Posted:
I would try to avoid any appearance of discrimination based on the purpose of the use, but that rules defining who the clubhouse can be used by would be fine. Are there currently any rules in the CCRs or any rules developed by the board for use of the clubhouse? My thought is a rule that says the clubhouse can only be used for activities where more than 50% of the attendees live in the association (or are members) would be ok, but a rule saying no "new age kind of stuff" wouldn't be. It would be more difficult to create a rule that would allow a wedding reception, for example, but disallow the holistic meeting.

Assuming that is the goal, maybe a rule that one time events have no requirement to have a minimum percentage of residents, but periodic gatherings should be mainly for residents, not outsiders.
Escaped former treasurer and director of a self managed association.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Alex,

Earlier you had a thread about the clubhouse being used for bible study.

I suggest that you take the info gained from that thread and the comments from this thread and come up with a rental policy for the clubhouse. If the Board wants, they can even seek a legal opinion on the policy before adopting it.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
But, Alex, can't you tell us more? Would this activity be only for your HOA's residents??

Based on Tim's response, which offers really good advice, what are you really driving at?
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
But, Alex, can't you tell us more? Would this activity be only for your HOA's residents??

Based on Tim's response, which offers really good advice, what are you really driving at?
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
New age mumbo jumbo, bible study, transcendental meditation, political fundraiser, Tupperware party, Amway party or whatever, if a renter is allowed to rent or reserve time, then rent it to them and stop trying to find excuses for things you or your fellow Board members don't like or approve of. The only problem I can see would be if the HOA sponsored any of the above but not a homeowner or renter as long as they do not violate the CC&R's or if the Board is idiotic enough to allow say a Baptist bible study but ban another homeowner who wants to study a different religion.

As to not allowing the public to attend or you are opening the HOA to the ADA, IMO is Bravo Sierra, the only way you would open yourself up to something like that would be if you allow the general public to rent the clubhouse.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Keep in mind Glen a renter would be general public technically unless considered resident. Owners have the right to rent typically as they own the resource which is the clubhouse. We had a rule no owner could rent if behind in dues. Their renter could not rent if owner behind. There was a $100 damage deposit refundable if no damage and a $25 rental fee for use.

I do not believe in limiting the meeting or group type. Even if it was those Westboro whackos. It is none of my business as long as paid and no damage. Although holding a press conference on how bad the HOA is may be a fine line...
Former HOA President
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Melissa close but no cigar, a renter is not the general public but a representative of the owner. The renter as a tenant assumes the rights of the homeowner, able to use the common areas, pool, clubhouse etc. The general public is Joe Blow off the street. For instance one of the renters here worked for a local grocery store and she would rent the clubhouse yearly for the store meeting, which was allowed. She moved and wanted to use the clubhouse and we had to tell her no, because she no longer had any rights to rent it.
Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
RwT (Florida)
Posts: 154
Posted:
Remember Melissa is only expressing her opinion

Read your docs. ByLaws often contain the language giving owners/members authorization to delegate their common area and facilities 'rights of enjoyment' to others.

Typically family, tenants, even contract purchasers residing on the property.
* Non-Lawyer spokesperson.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
My first sentances states that. If the renter is considered RESIDENT. Otherwise a renter is treated like a visitor and not subject to follow the HOA rules unless in the lease with the owner. Renters are granted the same rights of the owner as long as the owner is in good standing. If the owner is not qualified, then renter is not either. That is why we only rented to owners in good standing and maybe their renters if they are responsible track record.
Remember that technically renters are NOT HOA members. They do not pay dues except in rare cases in some states. They do not have the right to vote, be in office, or attend meetings. To me that makes them more in the general public arena with some exclusivitivity. They can be in the Neighborhood Watch and still volunteer for some projects.
I would check to see if residents can rent regardless if owner or renter. A non resident owner could they rent too? I think the owners need to define what comfortable with renting to in those regards and not the use.
Former HOA President
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
Melissa, RwT gives sound advice. The OP needs to read their own documents to see who may use the common area amenities. In my HOA and I imagine many others, renters certainly are "residents."

If a resident whether owner or tenant violates our rules, the owner is called to a hearing. Our documents do permit us to suspend common area privileges via an executive session. But not all documents have clauses like that.

Our CC&Rs also state that if the unit is occupied by renters, the offsite owners may not use our amenities.

As our high rises, there's a lounge in each tower that residents may reserve with a fee and a refundable cleaning/security deposit. Because the majority of our condos are relatively small, the most common use of our lounges is for larger gatherings. In these cases the majority of the guests do not live on our premises. this doesn't mean, however, that the lounge is "open to the public."

The unit owner is responsible for the comportment of the resident's party guests, even though the resident fills out a form, which includes lounge use rules, leaves a deposit, etc. Whether a renter rents the lounge or an owner does, it's the owner who would be called to a hearing if party guests break our rules.

But back to
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
Oops. Back to Alex's question: Why should you and/or the Board care if a resident wants to reserve the clubhouse for a legal activity?
PitA1
Posts: 222
Posted:
Carol:

DITTO

and

DITTO

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