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WestA (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Hi, the covenants in the HOA in our community expired several years ago, but we in the community are only just now finding this out. Now some of my questions I have specifically surround information I have found here on this forum and elsewhere but I didnt quite fully find all the info I needed. Specifically, it involves how it works on whether or not I would have to rejoin the association if its reinstated or not. Ive seen reference to talking about the Root Deed and what it references, but Im not sure exactly what Im looking for on it. Also, I came across this, http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/condoblog/2012/06/mrta-revitalization-of-covenants-what-does-it-mean-for-hoas.html, which mentions something about the house being homesteaded and that eliminating the HOA's ability to enforce anything against you. Any help on understanding any of this would be greatly appreciated.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
There are many on this forum from FL who are knowledgeable about MRTA. Hopefully they can provide some insight.

You may still need to seek an actual legal opinion from an attorney in your area.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Obviously a legal technical issue, and needs a legal professional to do it correctly.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
I am not nor do I play a lawyer especially in FL.

Florida's homestead exemption providing an exemption from forced sale before and at death are among the most protective in the United States as it provides "no limit" to the value of certain real property that can be protected from creditors. The property tax exemption clause of Article VI renders property tax-free to the extent of certain dollar amounts in the value of the homestead.

The above is how to own and keep a multi-million dollar home in FL while undergoing bankruptcy.
KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343
Posted:
I have been involved in two neighborhoods that had covenants expire due to MRTA and in those neighborhoods there was a resulting conflict so I have some insight. Basically MRTA causes the covenants to expire 30 years from the root of title, which my understanding of that is it is the first mention of the covenants in the first deed. HOAS can preserve or revitalize the C&Rs under the law. Preservation maintains what was there while revitalization may only reenact the original document, and I believe only the parties seeking revitalization would be affected.

Now if that had not occurred then the HOA has zero authority to do anything because technically the C&Rs ceased to exist. Required to be a member? Not any more. Pay dues? Nope. Build a shed? Go for it. The only problem is that while the law is on your side HOAs can still take you to court and MRTA is not really understood by the courts. I have found numerous attorneys in the field state I must have been mistaken when I said I was free and clear. A judge said otherwise.

As for being homesteaded, I had never heard that applied to Hoas. Possibly it meant that they could lein but not foreclose on a homestead but I would have to double check. But if you C&Rs are expired, it doesn't matter if you are homesteaded or not. The HOA cannot enforce a thing. Essentially the HOA becomes a voluntary social club. Nothing more.
WestA (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Thanks for the info Kevin. Now I'm kind of curious on the revitalization of the c&r's, if they were voted to be reinstated by the homeowners, but those in the community that maybe don't want to be a part, does it automatically force them to rejoin the Hoa again?
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569
Posted:
then how will the maintenance of the engineered utility known as storm water retention be funded ?

the entry signage ?

the pool ?

insurance ? you now have PERSONAL liability for any occurrence on a common element WHICH YOU STILL OWN - neighbor's flooding may be found to be negligence on YOUR PART

be careful, very very careful, of your wishes
BanksS
Posts: 403
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnB26 on 05/19/2014 9:32 AM
then how will the maintenance of the engineered utility known as storm water retention be funded ?

the entry signage ?

the pool ?

insurance ? you now have PERSONAL liability for any occurrence on a common element WHICH YOU STILL OWN - neighbor's flooding may be found to be negligence on YOUR PART

be careful, very very careful, of your wishes

John,

In my situation, there is no HOA but a nonprofit corporation to maintain the common elements. Consequently the CC&R's can not be enforced. Homeowners can do whatever they want with their property as long as county building codes and county/state codes are adhered to.

If there are no common elements to maintain not necessary to even have a nonprofit corporation. The development just becomes a common ordinary neighborhood. This is in Iowa of course and I am not a lawyer but this is what I have experienced.
WestA (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Well, in our neighborhood, the Country maintains pretty much all of that, the only things the HOA currently maintains is 2 little parks (which havent been maintained anyways as they are a run down mess)and the couple lakes that are in the area, of which both could easily be handed over to the county to maintain as they maintain the rest.
BanksS
Posts: 403
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By WestA on 05/20/2014 5:16 AM
Well, in our neighborhood, the Country maintains pretty much all of that, the only things the HOA currently maintains is 2 little parks (which havent been maintained anyways as they are a run down mess)and the couple lakes that are in the area, of which both could easily be handed over to the county to maintain as they maintain the rest.

In Iowa to revitalize the CC&R's it is basically starting over. There must be 100% approval from every property owner. In my neighborhood, it's not very likely to happen. Some of the neighbors have shown interest in revitalization but it would be an enormous hurdle as the BOD has ticked off about half the homeowners and we are a very small development with only 25 houses. For now, we pay for maintenance for a sanitary sewer and 2 small recreational ponds. Everything else is county controlled or private utility companies. Homeowners don't have to be members of the nonprofit corp. but if you are not a member you are charged 3 times the amount that members pay so there is an incentive to be a member. I question the legality of this since a homeowner's only option for sanitary sewer is the nonprofit corp. The State does not allow privately owned septic tanks.

It's a complicated and unique situation where I live.
KevinK7 (Florida)
Posts: 1,343
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By WestA on 05/19/2014 8:12 AM
Thanks for the info Kevin. Now I'm kind of curious on the revitalization of the c&r's, if they were voted to be reinstated by the homeowners, but those in the community that maybe don't want to be a part, does it automatically force them to rejoin the Hoa again?

Not necessarily. I think it depends on the original covenants. For instance, my original covenants from 1979 were pretty cut and dry. Then the HOA amended them in 2001. They turned the HOA into what the attorneys would later call a voluntary mandatory association, where you can voluntarily join for life (as a loophole around state law). The HOA then threatened legal action against anyone who opposed. When the covenants expired they all expired despite them being amended in 2001. If they ate too be revitalized, I would not be held to the new ones because my property makes no reference to the amendments.

Now I do have to double check whether or not my property would be subject if my neighbors create a new covenant.
WestA (Florida)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Thanks again for the info guys. Yea for our neighborhood it would require a majority vote to revitalize, which pretty much seems like a impossible task, a good majority of the homeowners do not like the current HOA president, not to mention there is some 480 homes. Secondly, our HOA due to the current president has some very serious mismanagement problems as the current board has lost around $70,000 in the past 10 years leaving very little left in reserve. Also, according to a attorney that a couple of Homeowners and a board member consulted with earlier this week, the HOA owes back all the dues they have collected since 2005 when our CC&R's expired. SO, some very serious money troubles and such with ours.

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