Proxies

Started by MaryS7 • 25 replies • 1964 views

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MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Good day all,
I just received a cover letter and a proxy from our BOD. On the cover letter it states that "all proxies need to be on file 24 hours prior to the annual meeting" which is in May 2007. This is the first time I have ever seen a time frame put on our proxies. Can anyone tell me why the BOD would do this and what they would gain from this?

BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418

Posted:

They want to know how many people will be voting (and assumable certain ways) and they want to be able to verify that certain criteria has been met to validate a proxy. This is typically done within a meeting but if there is a large number of homes and there have been forgery problems in the past or suspect there may be forgery problems they want to time to review each one. If they know the number of proxies in play then they might attempt to get some last minute ones from those who have not submitted it. It might be innocent and it might be a way to stack the box.

I have suggested to several people I know who are not at all happy with their boards to get as many proxies as they can so that at the annual meeting however they vote is how it will be. One lady in a HOA of 120 houses was able to gather 70+ proxies and she alone elected the board. She also shot down a number of things that her and her neighbors felt strongly against. Previously, only 20 or so home owners attended the annual meeting and rarely were there more than one or two proxies in use. My guess is that in the future that association would enact a similar requirement so as not to be blindsided again.

By the way, what state?

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

I am in Texas. This board is full of surprises. If anyone feels there is fraud going on it is we the membership! I was glad to hear your feelings about stacking the deck. My thoughts exactly. Is there anyway to call them on this ...It is not mentioned in our by-laws but this practice has never been done before.

JoeW1 (New York)
Posts: 728

Posted:

MaryS7 - My HOA did the same thing about returning the proxies 24 hours in advance. Stacking the box is difficult IF a copy of the proxy is kept by the proxy holder(s) and the original is turned in at the election meeting. Proxy holders could organize at the meeting amongst themselves and do a quick count on the results, comparing them to the posted results. Challenging the results is in the power of any member (a reason for the challenge as well), and judges are usually picked at the election meeting, so there's an opportunity for volunteers wary of fraud to work against it.

BradD2 (Florida)
Posts: 418

Posted:

What I had suggested was based on a requirement for someone else I know that all proxies had to be back to the management company within 7 days of the annual meeting. Several proxies that arrived on the 6th and 7th day and were expected to be cast against the existing board were considered invalid even though they were post marked prior to 7th day. The person also reported seeing existing board members going door to door after the 7th day period assumable to collect from those home owners who don't care.

Since the "validation" was done by the management company it was hard to prove wrong doing and they refused to answer questions, but there was a lot of circumstantial evidence. Instead of a recount or a challenge which would take months to resolve I suggested a recall of the directors and about half of them (including the President) were successfully recalled and replaced.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Thanks for the responses! Does this mean you don't have to turn the proxies in until the annual meeting even though they say 24hrs prior? How could they not except proxies at the meeting?

JM2 (Oregon)
Posts: 439

Posted:

Hi Mary:

I previously worked for a management company. For us to go out to the meeting to run it cost the association $125/hour. If it was clear that a quorum was not going to be present, it would have been wasting the HOA's money for us to go out...

That said, I'm not sure what the Texas law is (I'm in Oregon). Do you have to send in a proxy, or can you just show up at the meeting to do your voting? If that's the case, round up everybody you know who likes to party, go to the meeting, and then out for drinks afterward...even if they've given a proxy, since if they show up, the proxy should be returned to them....

The management company may need time to verify proxies - sort through in case there are multiple proxies from one lot, etc., as well as to sort them either alphabetically or by Lot, however their sign-in list is organized.

I'm not sure if it's in violation of your documents, you might want to check.

J. Patrick Moore, CMCA

VincentP (Texas)
Posts: 2

Posted:

I am soon to move into our condo at Skillman Bend in Dallas,Texas.Are there any members out there who are a part of this Forum?I have a hard time getting any response from the management company or our HOA president.They NEVER return calls!I do not know any of the owners/residents,and they are pretty reclusive.Any help out there on how I can find their web site and Charter?

VincentP (Texas)
Posts: 2

Posted:

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

Mary:

If you plan on attending this meeting you do not need to send in your proxy ballot. Your proxy is sent only if you do not plan on attending.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Thanks for your replies! Can anyone tell me this,,,
If I am collecting proxies from my neighbors, and the board has asked that all proxies be turned in 24hrs prior to the meeting, does the BOD have to accept proxies the night of the meeting as well??? If No, how can they turn away a members voting rights?

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

Yes, Mary the board would have to accept the proxies that evening. The purpose of a proxy ballot is to have a quorum at the meeting. Since a quorum is difficult to attain, proxies are sought to meet that quorum. The reason the board would want it 24 hours in advance is to make sure they would have a quorum to hold the meeting. You can hold onto them and notify the Board that you have 6, 10 whatever number of proxies, so they are informed they will have a quroum for the meeting.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Thanks Gloria. What if I collected new proxies the night of the meeting? Say, the board did not know of them 24hrs. prior. Would they still have to accept them?

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

Absolutely they would have to count them. Just like if Owners just showed up they wouldn't know how many Owners were coming. The one thing you would not know is how many of the proxies you are holding are in good standing. e.g; if you come with 10 proxies and 4 are delinquent Owners you would then have only 6 votes for that evening.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Okay, thanks. So, I legally don't have to turn them in 24 hrs. prior or let them know how many I am holding until the night of the meeting. They will or should have a list of homeowners that are eligible with them at the meeting. The reason I am doing this is... I don't want them to go behind me collecting proxies and voiding out the ones I am holding. We are trying to replace certain members now serving.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Also, what recourse do we have if they donot accept our proxies the night of the meeting? We are going to nominate canidates from the floor that night.

KevinK5 (California)
Posts: 64

Posted:

One of the members running for our board has been going around asking for proxies. I talked to one of the owners who gave their proxy to him. She told me this person came to her house and he said he was collecting the proxies for the association. She said she thought she was required to give him the proxy and she did not realize she was giving away her vote. Should there be any action taken against this person running for the board? I'm not too concerned because I know this person is not held in very high regard by most.
I'm in Florida.

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

Mary:

As long as the Owners are in good standing they have to accept the proxies you hold.

Kevin:

The proxy any Owner signs is good or should be good for only that meeting. The proxy should be worded correctly (legally) that the Owner can take back their proxy if they come to the meeting. Unfortunately many Owners do not realize what they are giving away when they sign a proxy at the door. Although the proxy should state what they are signing on the form.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Kevin,
I have learned this the hard way! A proxy is only good by the date on it. This said, If your neighbor signed her proxy to someone she does not want to vote for she may sign another over to you. The proxy she signs over to you would supercede the first one. The one with the most current date would be the vaild proxy.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Gloria,
If our board does not accept the proxies I am holding ( because of the 24hr request) what recourse would I have?

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Kevin,
I wanted to say this about going door to door. As shady as it seems, it is legal. At least in our Assoc. I am in Texas. When I have gone door to door asking for proxies, I have explained why I would like their proxies and that it would be a vote that they would be giving to me. Some people are not so honest.

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

Knowledge is power and by you #1 informing them of how many you are holding 24 hours in advance you do not need to give them the proxies until the evening of the meeting) again I stated the purpose of them wanting the proxies is 2-fold: the need to have a quorum, and the second is to see who is eliegable to vote. The latter can be done at the meeting.

What recourse you have is documenting the events and informing them if handled improperly you can get the Attorney General involved that they did not follow the state laws. I do hope you checked your State Laws & CCR's with regards to meetings and that your doc's do not state that Proxies must be handed in 24 hrs. in advance?

Does Texas have a Planned Community Act? If so I would go online and check to see what Texas has to say about meetings and procedures.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Gloria,
I donot know if Texas has a planned community act. I will research and find out. In our by-laws it states that the BOD has the right to adopt new rules. No where does it state that proxies must be turned in 24hrs. prior. This could be a new rule but, it was never told to the membership until our letter and proxies came in the mail. An argument ensued at the last meeting over this and the BOD was told that they should and BETTER accept proxies on the night of the meeting. So, it stands. I still don't know what to do...turn the proxies in or, take a chance and wait till the night of the meeting? What would you do?

GloriaM (North Carolina)
Posts: 829

Posted:

I would inform the board that I will bring with me the # of proxies, hold on to them and bring them with you the evening of the meeting. I hope that helps.

MaryS7 (Texas)
Posts: 37

Posted:

Gloria,
You've been a wonderful help,,,thank you so much. I will post the results on this website to let you know what happens. Thanks again!

MikeM8 (North Carolina)
Posts: 13

Posted:

Gloria,
I would make a copy of all the Proxies that you bring to the meeting. That way if they get their hands on them and then decide not to count them, you will have the copies as evidence. Good luck

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