CC&R replace my roof

Started by WilliamB16 • 35 replies • 6909 views

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WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

My association is of the type to run on what they think the rules should be. I have copies of the recorded documents (bylaws and CC&R). Anyway, on to my question.

Our president has stated on our hoa website that the covenants specifically require cedar roofs. I took this at face value and didn't check the CCR's until now. I want to replace my roof with a normal, safe and efficient asphalt shingle one. I have had issues with poor roof performance, high insurance costs, high maintenance costs, etc with the cedar shingled roof. These are all single family homes btw.

Needless to say, the ccrs do not mention roofing at all nor do they mention cedar. Surprisingly it also doesn't mention any recourse that can be taken against a homeowner for any violation other than an interest rate for late payments. The most relevant paragraphs I see regarding building restrictions are the following:

"The construction of Dwelling units or any other building or structure, including fences, permitted by this declaration by any party (a "builder") other than developer (or its agents) shall be subject to the prior approval of the partnership, which approval shall not be unreasonably withheld or delayed. Prior to commencing any such construction, a builder shall submit to the partnership written plans and specification for any proposed construction and the partnership shall notify such builder of approval or denial. All approval rights of the partnership shall transfer to the HOA."

*** This paragraph to me seems to indicate new home or out building construction needs to be approved ***

and under the paragraph saying "restrictions to property":

"Section 4.5 No buildings other than detached residences for a single family occupancy shall be constructed on any lot. There shall be no construction on any lot which results in a building or structure inconsistent with the general architectural design and aesthetic flavor of either (a) the dwelling unit on such lot or (b) the remainder of the dwelling units on the property. In addition any construction undertaken upon any lot by a builder must be completed within one year of commencement"

As far as enforcement there is a section on the powers and duties of the HOA with respect to the common areas. This section gives the right for the hoa to collect annual dues and to file a lien or foreclose for non payment. There is no mention of fines, etc.

My question given this is, can I just go ahead and replace my roof the way I want, or can I expect some sort of backlash?

thanks for any advice.

Bill

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

Many HOAs have architectural guidelines in addition to the CC&Rs and bylaws. Or they may have Rules and Regulations in addition to the two docs you mentioned. Often fines, etc., are embedded in that document. Very often HOAs have an Architectural Committee (often called an ARC)--our CC&Rs require such a committee, which has the authority to approve (or deny) submissions from owners about altering the exterior appearance of their homes. Sometimes Boards themselves fill this role.

You seem to have correctly interpreted the passages that you've cited; they are about adding new structures.

So I think you need to make sure there are no additional documents! If you have a property mgr., that person should know. But even if there aren't more docs, don't even think about starting a roof without the approval of the board at a Board meeting or the approval of a Committee. If you don't see any authority granted to your HOA about roof replacements, you may have to seek legal advice.

Do not accept solely the president's verbal OK or denial. If the prez insists the roofs must be cedar, politely ask to see the relevant document or meeting minutes (in which a Board approved only cedar roofs).

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Hi William:

I would recommend you submit your request in writing to your ACC to cover your tail. Also, in the letter you can ask about what is stated on the website and for the ACC or Board to please supply you with the section in the governing documents requiring cedar shingles. Have you checked your local County Records website to make sure you have current copy of your CCR's?

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Bill … Here is a link to your State Statutes:

http://www.ilga.gov/legislation/ilcs/ilcs2.asp?ChapterID=62

The section for single family HOA is:

765 ILCS 160/ Common Interest Community Association Act.

I quickly glanced but did not see anything where the legislators might limit “cedar roofs”. I have seen this in some states where there is high fire danger.

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Hi Janet,

Yes, I got all of my documents from the county recorders office. The only recorded documents are the CCR and bylaws. We have an architecture committee, but again, the legal documents governing this subdivision do not give authority or reference an ACC in any way.

The president seems to be using the "asethetic flavor of neighborhood" to support his belief that cedar shake is a requirement. The builder of the homes used cedar shake.

I am certain that the ACC would deny my request and that is why for me this boils down to a legal hurdle. What would I gain from a legal perspective by having my request denied?

-Bill

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/01/2014 2:50 PM

My question given this is, can I just go ahead and replace my roof the way I want, or can I expect some sort of backlash?

William,

I suspect that there is something within your CC&Rs or Bylaws that require prior approval from the Association for any exterior changes. Changing what material your roof is made of is indeed an exterior change. Therefore, you should seek prior approval and not make any changes without receiving written approval.

If you simply replace your roof using a different material without approval, you can, and should, expect backlash from the Association.

I also suspect that even though there is no authority for monetary penalties for violating the covenants, there is some sort of enforcement clause within your CC&Rs. The typical enforcement clause goes along the lines of: "The Association or any Owner shall have the right to enforce, by any proceeding at law or in equity, all restrictions, conditions, covenants, reservations, liens and charges now or hereafter imposed by the provisions of this Declaration. Failure by the Association or by any Owner to enforce any covenant or restriction herein contained shall in no event be deemed a waiver of the right to do so thereafter."

Some States, like VA, have started to interpret this enforcement clause exactly as written (which they should) and if there is no authority for monetary penalties in the CC&Rs, then the Association can not impose monetary penalties. However, other States have taken the position that as long as the Association adopts a resolution that allows monetary penalties, then they may assess those penalties. I have no idea how your State addresses this issue. Regardless of how it is addressed, worst case, you could find yourself in court over the issue. If the issue does go to court, the bottom line will be - was prior permission required and, if it was, was it sought for and received?

Either way, it will cost you time, energy and money (not only for your legal expenses but for your share of the Associations legal expenses) to see who the court will say is right and who the court will say was wrong. Of course, all of this could be easily avoided if you simply request prior approval.

On another note: Typically, when prior approval is needed for exterior changes, the Association adopts some sort of architectural guidelines so the approving authority has a standard for what should and should not be approved. I suspect, based on your posting, that your Association has such guidelines and this is where it specifies what roofing material would be approved.

Hope this helps,

Tim

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/01/2014 4:01 PM

I am certain that the ACC would deny my request and that is why for me this boils down to a legal hurdle.

In that case, you should take all of your governing documents (those recorded with the county/State (Bylaws, CC&Rs, Articles of Incorporation) and those simply adopted and maintained within the Association (resolutions, rules/regs, etc.)) to a local attorney and seek a legal opinion.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

In some or many HOAs, William, only the CC&Rs are recorded. The other documents, though, still are legal. In addition, if your HOA is incorporated, there should be Articles of Incorporation, but they may not be helpful.

I see the passage about the "aesthetic flavor," that appears to only apply to new structures. Still, as Janet suggests, give the ACC a whirl in writing. In many HOAs that committee has the final word, but not in others. I'm not in the legal profession, but can only surmise that by applying in writing you could show a court that you did everything you could to act in concert with your HOA's docs. But they are silent on authorizing this committee.

Still, if the ACC only recommends to the Board and doesn't actually make decisions, then the Board is your last recourse at the HOA level.

Double check your bylaws. Some give the Board the authority to form any committee it wishes. Could be only one buried sentence.

I'm surprised you're not getting additional replies!

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Thanks for the additional replies. I am familiar with corporate bylaws myself and the process of setting up and running a for profit corp. The CCR and bylaws are the documents that enumerate what powers the hoa board has. They have the right to amend both documents with a 75% full vote. In fact they have done this 4 times over the years. If you want to get more color on my other dealings with this board, just search my name for my other thread (2 years ago - a stolen election).

From what I can tell its pretty much been the same board of people for the entirety of the subdivisions history. I don't think the board really understand how the governing process works. It's been more of a ... Hey we told you this so its law kind of thing. I'm the king! Most people haven't challenged them.

These are not townhomes, they are single family homes. My guess is the developer put in place rules for building the homes so they were consistent, but probably left it to the owner board to modify the CCR's and bylaws as necessary early on. They chose not to do this. To me reading the document (I can send it to you privately), it has many holes in it compared to other CCR's I've seen which detail recourse, etc.

And yes, there is language that says that "any homeowner can take another to a valid court of law regarding violation of the convenants and restrictions, which there are some (fencing, dogs, RV's, clothes lines, antenna's, etc)". But surprisingly there is no mention of recourse or an amendment mentioning recourse (monetary fines, etc). Also no mention of an ACC and what powers they would have.

My main concern legally are the two paragraphs I posted and how they would be interpreted. Our president is chosing pick the middle sentence of a paragraph out of context. I interpreted both paragraphs as dealing with new home construction. I will send them an email asking where specifically it mentions the requirements so that I have a paper trail if I have to go to court.

Also, on the topic of attorneys, what skills should I look for in selecting one. The ones I've dealt with in the past didn't seem that competent. Also, what can I expect to pay? there is a total of about 15 pages between the bylaws and CCR.

thanks again

Bill

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/01/2014 8:10 PM

Also, on the topic of attorneys, what skills should I look for in selecting one. The ones I've dealt with in the past didn't seem that competent. Also, what can I expect to pay? there is a total of about 15 pages between the bylaws and CCR.

Hi Bill:

LOL ... you seem to know your governing documents well and also somewhat familiar with your statutes. This helps alot when looking at attorneys, because if one feeds you BS you will immediately know what has been dished out. However, having said that and been in legal battle that option should be your last resort ... this is mostly due to the issue of the cost of roof vs. attorney fees. If you do choose to look for an attorney check around and many will usually give a short 20-30 minute "free" consultation. When you go in be sure to have your ducks in a row and your most important questions asked first ... in other words be prepared to make the most of your time allotted.

If during any consultation the attorney gives you info you know is in vioation of your governing document or state statues, then look for another.

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Hi Janet,

I should clarify. My dealings with attorney's in the past were not related to hoa issues. I would like an attorney to basically read these docs and give me a legal opinion as to whether I am in my rights or not. A written letter stating this would be ideal. Could this be done for less than $500?

Bill

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

I forgot to mention look for an attorney who has knowledge in Contract, HOA, and Real Estate Law, if at all possible. Also, cheapest is not always best in the long run, but many are willing to negotiate their fees.

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/01/2014 8:51 PM

Could this be done for less than $500?

I am not an attorney; however, I would state in my area yes. However, not sure about your area of the world. I would try to get the best answers possible from any potential "free" consultations then make your decision based on their facts and laws stated.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/01/2014 8:51 PM

I would like an attorney to basically read these docs and give me a legal opinion as to whether I am in my rights or not. A written letter stating this would be ideal. Could this be done for less than $500?

Bill,

It depends on the skill, time and who is doing the work (paralegal or attorney).

The last time we asked a question to our attorney it cost around $600. So, I suspect that it would be between $500 and $1,000.

GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491

Posted:

William this you can do for free, contact your local Zoning Board and ask if cedar shingles are still allowed in your community, building codes change all of the time and what was in code when your home was built may not now be.

You asked in an earlier post what could happen if you went ahead without HOA approval. If they have all of their ducks in a row, they could conceivably take you to court and if successful make you tear off your brand new unapproved roof and replace it with a cedar roof, in effect making you pay twice for your new roof. Don't assume that you can thumb your nose at them and get your way because YOU interpret the documents one way, self help can end up costing more in the long run.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Glen, yes I agree with you. Not to air too much dirty laundry but this same subdivision went after a homeowner about ten years ago. The homeowner removed a walking trail from his property. Let's just say that it ended in a very expensive stalemate ($100k legal fees for hoa), over $1k per homeowner. I believe the homeowner was represented by his insurance company so he didn't have to pay anything. The entire fiasco left a really bad taste in the other homeowners mouths about wasting money on a nowhere lawsuit. They ended up with an agreement (after the lawyers took all the money for doing little else than filing motions in a civil court), however, the agreement letter had (surprise surprise) no teeth in it. It turns out, many other homeowners in the past took their trails out also, but the king must have decided that this one was going to be the last. Of course the hoa board doesn't mention any details of the lawsuit except their one sided view on how this homeowner's lawyer was somehow "in good" with the judge. I took it upon myself to pull the lawsuit from the clerks office and look it over myself.

Anyway, here in Illinois, there are no real fire hazards like there are in other states such as CO, CA, AZ, and others. Cedar roofing is horrible, but it is allowed by the state and county.

My plan is to first get an estimate to see the price difference between cedar and architectural asphalt shingles. I know cedar would be about twenty one thousand. My guess is that asphalt is about eight thousand. If you also consider the $150 premium in insurance every year, plus the average of $200 maintenance per year, you can make a strong case against cedar. Couple this with the fact that there is no old growth cedar left, so the anti rot properties of the shingle is poor.

I will inquire as to the cedar roof clause and ask for any related documents. I will point out (I think I'm right on this one) that these other documents would have to be supported by a mention of them in the CCR or bylaws. My understanding is that the CCR enumerates what authority the hoa board has. Depending on how they answer, I may not have to get permission.

Bill

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Putting on a roof that is not cedar can effect your home value and attractiveness. It will stick out like a sore thumb. Potential buyers will question why your roof is different. Plus the cedar roof is more desirable look and adds value to the home. Using cheaper materials on a home effects not only your home values but those around you. Cedar roof is what makes this HOA of aesthetic value to potential buyers and anything less or different effects that purpose.

Example: We have a house for sale in our neighborhood. The person remodeled it and put in really nice appliances, flooring, and tile. They priced the house around $150,000. The problem? The houses in the neighborhood only sale for around $100K. They are older homes. The rule of thumb is that you never remodel a home with expensive materials expecting a higher return. If the homes in the neighborhood all have carpet flooring and tile, you don't install wood and marble. It's the same in reverse. Don't ever repair or remodel a home not to the level of the homes around it. In this case, it's having cedar roofs. A more expensive option but it is the standard.

Former HOA President

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

William,

I just did an internet search for cedar roof shingles and there are products that try to give the appearance of a cedar roof. You may have better luck getting a sample of one of those products and ask the Association if those can be used.

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Yes, I have done that also. You can go really high end on some of this stuff. They offer really long warranties, but there have been issues with a lot of these heavy weight products (warranties, fading, performance). They are really too new to be worth it and in most cases cost more than cedar. Again, not sure if you read the whole thread, but I don't believe our CCR as written and recorded even gives them the authority to make these decisions and that is the real issue.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

I think, William, that Janet & Tim are close to what you'd have to pay for an attorney's opinion. Follow Janet's advice about having your ducks in a row. With so few pages in your governing docs, it shouldn't take a competent HOA attorney long to interpret them. Do see if you have articles of incorporation--you should if your HOA is a corporation.

JonD1
Posts: 2,350

Posted:

William:

I just have to ask. With the 100 or so homes in your community what roofing material is now installed on the other 99 homes?

Any others vary from cedar roofing?

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/02/2014 10:13 AM

Again, not sure if you read the whole thread, but I don't believe our CCR as written and recorded even gives them the authority to make these decisions and that is the real issue.

I've read it. You want to find a loophole and are hoping someone will agree with you on the loophole or that the Association won't go after you if you just put on the roof without permission.

Well, per your own postings, you've pointed out that the Association is willing to go after individual members through the courts. It even cost you $1,000 in special assessments to cover your share of the Assocaitions legal expenses. Yes, the association might be gun shy or they might choose to fight harder on the next issue that is taken to court. Nobody really knows for sure until it happens.

Per your interpretation of the CC&Rs, you think the Association doesn't have the authority to keep you from changing the type of roofing material. Many on here have read what you posted and simply disagree with you. You have indicated that the Association also disagrees with that interpretation. When two parties disagree on the terms of the contract, the issue usually is brought before a third party who has the authority (courts or mediator) to determine what the interpretation actually is.

Regardless of who agrees with you (unknown individuals on the internet or a local attorney you paid for a legal opinion), the Association still disagrees with you. Considering that, based on this thread, you appear unlikely to back down, you will likely have some sort of legal battle between yourself and the Association in your future. Otherwise, if your interpretation does prove to be correct, there would be nothing to prevent your neighbor from painting their house bright pink. Therefore, I'm fairly certain that the Association would be willing to take the issue through the courts.

The choice is yours on what to do. I offered some suggestions of using different products that have the same look. You dismissed that option. From my perspective, this leaves you with the option of complying with the Associations interpretation or take the issue before the courts and deal with the time, energy, expense and all intended and unintended consequences that come with that decision.

Good luck. Hopefully, you can now make an informed decision.

Tim

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Hi Tim,

I disagree with you on my intent. My reading of the CCR is clear. I posted the vague part of the ccr that I was not 100% clear on so I could get others opinions. I believe other folks on here are either on an hoa board or are knowledgeable on the many nuances of these things. Many seem to want to make sure things are done in a proper manner and according to rules. I got a rough idea that my interpretation on this is correct. Now I will spend money to consult with an attorney who can advise me for sure as to my rights. My hoa board has been run like a sheriff who doesn't understand the underlying law he/she is supposed to enforce (no point in airing dirty laundry). If they don't have the authority to decide for me I am not going to give them that right.

Bill

BanksS
Posts: 403

Posted:

William,

I agree with you that roof types not being included in your CC&R's prohibits the HOA from enforcing a cedar roof only policy. In my HOA the Architecture Committee reviews building plans for new construction to make sure that they adhere to the CC&R's. In my CC&R's no mention is made of roof type, house color, window or door color or anything that specific. The CC&R's include things like size of the home and siding requirements. Out buildings must match the house but no out-houses (It really does say that. I live in rural Iowa LOL.) When was your neighborhood developed? There was a time when cedar shingles were in vogue but have lost their appeal because of the reasons you stated, fire hazard, increased maintenance and insurance, etc. Over time, the rest of the homes may replace their roofs with a similar material as yours because of the very same reasons. Cost can be a big influence on people. If you present to the board facts about roof types and how much cheaper and more efficient they are, and safer, the Board may come around. Presumably they are homeowners in your HOA too. Products change over the years and what was seen as attractive at one point may seem really ugly now.

With that being said, I would not approach the issue by just replacing the roof without first having a discussion with the Board. You are just asking for trouble. Speak to them first and express your views in a respectful manner. I would not rush to the expense of an attorney just yet. Speak your mind, then wait for their response. If you can't come to an agreement or compromise at first try again. Gather as many facts as you can. Research Illinois cases for a precedent that is similar. Do whatever you can before you go the legal route. It can get so ugly and bad feelings remain for a long, long time. I know this from experience. And the legal expenses can climb very quickly. It sounds like your HOA has experienced some pretty hefty legal costs recently, so may not be so eager to take on an expensive legal battle.

You might also check to see if Illinois has a law similar to Florida's MRTA. Iowa does. The covenants have to be renewed in those 2 states. If no renewal occurs within the statute's time limit (Iowa's is 21 years), the covenants are unenforceable.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

William

Your original post opened with:

My association is of the type to run on what they think the rules should be.

Based on this, I believe this may not be, nor will it be, the first issue you will have with the association.

I agree with Tim that you are looking for a loop hole. I believe you will always will be a loop hole looker as long as you live under any other "set of rules" then your own beliefs.

Could a case be made that certain shingle types are not safe? I expect one could be made, but I am not sure your confrontational nature can do so. Are you the type that wins battles but loses wars and never understands why?

Of course, I could be wrong.

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Bank and John - I know there are a lot of people here looking for "loopholes" as John calls them or trying to justify an action that goes against the rules. I am not that person. Let me add that the board has stated that to put up anything other than cedar will require an amendment (which is a seventy five percent majority vote). I have shared with you all the info in the CCR related to my issue. Clearly, it does not require an amendment. As I said before imagine someone running your hoa like a king would do. How do you handle a situation like this other than by rule of law? As I'm sure you are aware hoa's are setup as a democracy.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/02/2014 7:35 PM

How do you handle a situation like this other than by rule of law?

Exercise your right as a member, gather support and recall the Board or simply don't reelect the Board. Then replace them with those who think along the same lines as you.

BanksS
Posts: 403

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/02/2014 7:35 PM
Bank and John - I know there are a lot of people here looking for "loopholes" as John calls them or trying to justify an action that goes against the rules. I am not that person. Let me add that the board has stated that to put up anything other than cedar will require an amendment (which is a seventy five percent majority vote). I have shared with you all the info in the CCR related to my issue. Clearly, it does not require an amendment. As I said before imagine someone running your hoa like a king would do. How do you handle a situation like this other than by rule of law? As I'm sure you are aware hoa's are setup as a democracy.

Bill,

I agree with you but I am not a lawyer or work in the legal profession. I was just suggesting a way to approach the situation without lawyers and courts. It is certainly your choice to install the roof and see what happens.

My HOA sued me and it got very, very ugly. From my experience the best approach is discussion and compromise. It may not be possible in your HOA. I understand that. My HOA Board wouldn't even give me an opportunity to discuss the issue. Only you know what the climate is in your HOA. Best of luck to you.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

William

If there is no reference to shingles in the CC&R's then
it is not necessary to change/modify them. What is necessary is to change enough people on the BOD so that the new BOD will appoint an ARC Committee that will
"consider/approve" roofing material other then cedar shingles.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

May I ask what your reaction would be if one of your neighbors decided to install a metal roof? What action would you or want to be taken then? What if the shingles they choose were green? What color of shingle that's not cedar is then appropriate for all houses? The shingle approval may need to extend into the right color of shingle or if they should be archetectual or plain?

Shingle selection is NOT about your home alone. If your in a HOA, things have to be consistent and in like of other homes around it. So you get your roof... What roof do you think your neighbors should have too has to be considered when your wanting these changes. Who says the other neighbors in majority don't already like the cedar shingles? What then if they decide in majority to keep the cedar look? Keep removing board members till you fill up the board with people that only agree with you? Boy isn't that the democratic way your looking for?

Seriously, what can the HOA do to you? They can remove your shingles, replace your roof with cedar, place a lien on your home until you pay that bill. Oh, and they special assess you and your neighbors for the cost of doing so. If they sued, then it would have to be for the cost of removing and replacing those unapproved shingles. So are you willing to pay the legal costs and sue your HOA when it is suing yourself and your neighbors? Your not the only one in this HOA. Your just one of the members of the HOA.

Former HOA President

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569

Posted:

As I'm sure you are aware hoa's are setup as a democracy.

NO NO NO

A HOA is set up to administer contractual obligations.

While there may be debate as to the actual obligations, there is no question as to their enforcement.

The members do NOT vote on whether to apply the contract or not.

They may, however, vote to amend the contract.

If the HOA is incorporated (for liability purposes) then the Board of Directors will administer the operation of the corp. while they are in office.

YOU ALWAYS HAVE THE OPTION OF:

Moving

OR

The Court System

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

Melissa,

Some things are left up to the owner to decide. I will live with their decision. That is life. There is an unfortunate element of hoa's where there are people who are simply control freaks. That is why things are written down and recorded as law.

I will pose a question to you. If your association did not have the authority (as written in the CCR) to tell me what color my home was would you let me paint it a color of my choosing? Would your world end if our tastes were to differ? Would you stomp your feet and tell people how unfair it is that I have that right?

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

The HOA purpose is to make your neighborhood ATTRACTIVE to potential buyers. It is NOT to hold, increase, or decrease home VALUES. A HOA rules are set to up to keep thing uniform and looking attractive to potential buyers. Having a house out of color scheme of pastel as a dark blue, could effect any looking to buy. No buyers, then how does one sale?

My best example of HOA purpose is this... What if your neighbor puts an outhouse in their front yard? A HOA could act more quickly and have the item removed. They have the power to levy fines or remove it and lien forthe money owed in refusal to pay. The property out of a HOA has similar powers. The city can fine and take it away. However, one has to report it to the city and wait several months for action. Plus your tax dollars are paying for this. The city will not lien so will not get your money back. A HOA does get paid back with a lien or lawsuit.

Former HOA President

JanetB2 (Colorado)
Posts: 4,219

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/03/2014 2:30 PM

If your association did not have the authority (as written in the CCR) to tell me what color my home ...

If the HOA does not have authority I don't ask, nor do I expect anyone else to ask. However, my HOA has the "Construction Guidelines" within our CCR's and not as a separate document. Just be sure you have ALL documents and not missing any piece of the puzzle.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By WilliamB16 on 04/03/2014 2:30 PM
Melissa,

Some things are left up to the owner to decide. I will live with their decision. That is life. There is an unfortunate element of hoa's where there are people who are simply control freaks. That is why things are written down and recorded as law.

I will pose a question to you. If your association did not have the authority (as written in the CCR) to tell me what color my home was would you let me paint it a color of my choosing? Would your world end if our tastes were to differ? Would you stomp your feet and tell people how unfair it is that I have that right?

William

Quite often CC&R's are not as direct and specific as many might like. We joke about purple houses and some can argue that fuschia is not purple when purple is banned.

Often CC&R's are filled with vague terms like maintain the "common" look of the association. Well if all existing homes all earth tone colored homes this does not allow for purple though purple is not allowed is not specified.

Like a Supreme Court Judge once said: Not sure I can define pornography, but I know it when I see it...........LOL

WilliamB16 (Illinois)
Posts: 16

Posted:

haha. yes. I agree with you 100%.

Thank you everyone for your help on this matter.

Bill

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