Should I accept a gift from a member?

Started by TinoS • 27 replies • 2124 views

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TinoS (California)
Posts: 85

Posted:

I am the president of a HOA board in California. 16 units. I am serving reluctantly because there are not many others willing to do this. A developer wants to build a big condo right next to us that will block our light so it falls on me to represent us at the planning commission. Others signed a petition and wrote letters. A few of us showed up for a meeting in city hall.

I do 80% of the work and I am the most responsible member of our community.

A husband and wife have given me a $50 gift certificate for a dinner out at the local restaurant, thanking me for stepping up to take on the developer. I have mixed feelings about them. They provide a lot of advice about what I should and shouldn't be doing, what needs to be fixed and what doesn't. they are not unpleasant with their suggestions. But they have lived in the complex for 35 years (me and my wife 11 years) and from looking back in the records it seems they never had the pleasure to serve on the board. -- they did take on the task of managing the landscaping company until I showed up.

I think they gave the gift in sincerity and appreciation, not with any motives to try to manipulate me, but I wonder if it is a good move to accept their gift.
I'm getting to hate the feeling that I work for all these other people for free and I'm wondering if that meal will taste good or bad. $50 of course does not compensate me for micro portion of the work I've been doing for the association over the last five years, after the last president got a stroke.

Tino

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

I got free potato salad once! My advice: Give the card to someone else if you would feel guilty of using it. Just don't tell them you did that. Your ONLY a volunteer and this is NOT compensation. It is a gift. Appreciate it until it's not appreciated anymore.

It is nice to get a gift like this. Just don't ever do the same thing out of the HOA budget. If your going to thank someone with a gift card, do it out of your own pocket. Never ever out of the HOA funds. The HOA funds are EVERYONE's money not just yours. Not everyone appreciates the work someone does as a volunteer for their HOA, so their money shouldn't be used as a reflection of that.

So enjoy eating out, invite them to go with you, or bring them a desert back with the money. That's the other options when it comes to such gifts to be "politically" correct. Not accepting it may not be an option.

Former HOA President

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

Accept the gift graciously. It was unsolicited and there is no policy under consideration for which anyone can say you took "bribe" or anything else.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Tino,

I understand your concern of the perception others may have if knowledge of this gift is discovered.

Like you I'm torn. I appreciate the thought but am concerned of the perception others (who may see it as a bribe).

I would like to say that I would turn the gift down. Fortunately, I'm not in that situation.

My instinct says to thank them profusely but mention the concern that others may have a different perception. Since you are in a fight with a developer, it's best for the Association that you minimize any perceptions that may undermine your credibility in this fight with the developer.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KellyM3 on 10/18/2013 8:30 PM
Accept the gift graciously. It was unsolicited and there is no policy under consideration for which anyone can say you took "bribe" or anything else.

I agree.

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569

Posted:

thank them

take THEM out to dinner and make sure their bill is $50+

enjoy the evening out with friends

(mention that you were uncomfortable with the gift because of the president's position you hold)

everyone goes home happy

TinoS (California)
Posts: 85

Posted:

I really like this forum. Lot's of good advice and the opportunity to write out my concerns is very good for helping me focus in on what the real issue is. That issue is that I resent the couple because while they meant well with the gift they seem to have never put themselves out to be on the board and take some responsibility. They are now old and probably not as capable as they once were. And they did jump into action researching about the building next door, when it seemed to them that I was going to ignore the whole thing. But it's things like them telling me that WE need to go down to the city planning commission meeting and speak out, and then when I asked whether they were going to go they said that they get migraines at night, kind of rubs me the wrong way.

So still it is an issue not of board ethics but personal ethics. Should I accept a gift from those I don't really respect? I would certainly not want to go out to dinner with them.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Welcome to being President or a board member. You are now "They or Them"... "They should do something about this... Them other members don't do a thing etc..." It is WHY we are board members or in office. We realize there is no "They or them" it is me and my neighbors...

It's the "leadership" gene I call it. I often reference to this as "Living and breathing the job". Accept it is you and this is what you do. Yes, there is a million other things you would rather be doing. Yes, you are NOT always "President of the HOA". You don't want this to take over your life. It doesn't have to. Just realize that once you become a representative of your HOA as a board or officer, that's what you become. You represent. Represent how you want someone to represent you.

That's my best advice to give someone who has crossed the line between "Wish and do". It is part of accepting responsibility. It's not always puppies and sunshine. Stepping up to the plate means balls will be thrown in your direction. You have to decide to stay at bat, sit on the bench, or yell at the batter...

Instead of being resentful to these people, accept their help. Understand they will never stand up like you do, and they don't have to. They have you to do it. Just like the other members. So don't look a gift horse in the mouth and resent it because it doesn't move. No one said it had to be a "live" horse... Step up and be satisfied in your work that you do.

Former HOA President

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569

Posted:

Should I accept a gift from those I don't really respect? I would certainly not want to go out to dinner with them.

? Then why accept their money/gift ?

I believe you have answered your own question.

JonD1
Posts: 2,350

Posted:

Tino:

I have read your posts through several times. Come on now we are talking about $50. No sense wondering how the food brought with this ill-gotten payoff would taste. Either accept the gift as their gesture of appreciation or decline the gift and pay for your own meal. Perhaps you can convince yourself you found the money and it does not now affect the taste of the food!

Sounds to me like you have some serious resentment over your Board service and despite this gesture which you seem to thing has no other secret motives it does not sit well with you that IMO is a tough place to be. People offering thanks become resented.

And IMO $50 is not capable of being a bribe. Just what might you get back for $50 in today's world????

Let your conscience be your guide. But it is very difficult if not impossible to be thanked when you don't allow people to ever thank you.

These two folks aren't the DEVIL after all..........................Or requiring you sell your soul.....

FionaC1 (Washington)
Posts: 93

Posted:

There is nothing wrong with this.

Board members here have been given a few small items as thank you gifts from many homeowners.. even if it's cookies.

It's all good, not like it's$500 to assist in a bribe, or a kick back for using a mutual friend as a contractor..

NancyG3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 342

Posted:

Tino - Personally I would not accept a $50. gift from a homeowner especially one that I didn't like. Volunteers serve without compensation. I would thank the person for their generous offer and explain that you cannot accept the gift because you are a volunteer for the community and part of your job as President is to represent the homeowners without compensation. Don't set yourself up for any talk among the homeowners. Good luck.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

Here's the rub on not taking that certificate from someone you don't like in a HOA... How do you plan on getting elected next time? Are they going to vote for you back into office once they know you do not like them? Plus they are going to go bend someone else's ear to run you out of office. Most likely your competitor who may not have good intentions.

Take the gift certificate and understand your position as HOA president. It's NOT because you like and love everybody in your HOA. Your not going to. It's because you represent the HOA as a WHOLE. Sometimes you have to deal with people you wouldn't have as your personal friends when you act as President. I know I had several that would never be on my Christmas card list. However, would never let them know it and would not stop doing my best job possible as president because of it. I even represented the guy who was a con-man ripping of the HOA with the same gusto as someone who was there helping me get things done. It's called being a leader and leading.

Former HOA President

JohnP47 (Washington)
Posts: 31

Posted:

I also love HOATalk because where else would these type of fine-line discussions occur? They make a lot of sense to condo "make sures" like ourselves.

My take: as officers and other unpaid owners serve the whole association, there's a general question about the mutual understanding among owners about how the whole thing works. When something new comes up we have to work our way through.

I would tell the owners offering the gift card that it makes you uncomfortable because the full set of owners don't know about it. With their fore-knowledge and consent, tell them you would like to poll the other owners, naming names. **If that makes them uncomfortable, return the gift.** If not, a poll might be:
----------------
"Hi Folks, we have a question to resolve. The Smiths have given me a gift card for $50 in partial recognition of the hard work and hours I've put in representing our common interests before the City Council. Our questions are:

A. Should gifts like this be disclosed to the whole association? [ ] yes [ ] no

B. Do these gifts somehow replace the time and effort that would be the owner's share of the work of keeping our condo going? [ ] yes [ ] no

C. Comments:

----------------

Enjoy the responses, but reserve the final decision to yourself.

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

This is an old thread.

If you'd like to discuss the topic, please start a new conversation. We occasionally discuss things like codes of conduct, and bad behavior by board members is a frequent topic.

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

For the archives:

-- In my experience, nearly all HOAs' and COAs' governing documents state the president and directors shall serve without compensation.

-- Compensation that is accepted may remove protections provided by the Federal Volunteer Protection Act.

-- If one wants to rationalize that a gift certificate from an owner is not compensation, then as others pointed out, the only problem that seems to remain is that when other owners learn of the President-Director accepting the gift, it gives the appearance that the recipient may be biased toward the gift-giver.

-- I think anyone receiving such a gift will battle with not playing favorites.

-- I can understand HOA/COA Board officers and directors feeling like they should be able to accept such gifts, given all the work they do. But this almost always is inconsistent with the 'contract' they signed. Said contract being the governing documents' section on compensation.

-- If a person is unhappy about all the work they are doing, and with no compensation pursuant to the governing documents, I believe the correct response is to resign or adjust one's hours being donated.

-- I think that mentally, it is easy to fall into the trap of violating an important covenant, thinking it's no big deal. But when does this stop? When does one's sense of what the governing documents should say stop trumping what the governing documents actually say? I think it's best for everyone if directors and officers, and owners all follow what the governing documents say (with the Board as needed consulting the HOA attorney). If there is something an owner does not like in the governing documents, then follow the requirements of the governing document to seek an amendment.

-- It is not uncommon for the governing documents to state that the Treasurer may be compensated. I support doing so.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Governing documents across the country will state that directors receive no compensation for service. But, if directors can't receive compensation, why would an association "encourage" their members to contribute, say, a minimum of $250.00 each, to a fund to give out to some of their vendors. Aren't they well compensated already?

PatJ1 (North Carolina)
Posts: 568

Posted:

Good read - https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/G/Gifts-vs-Bribes

HenryS7 (Pennsylvania)
Posts: 336

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By PatJ1 on 12/14/2021 12:02 PM
Good read - https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/G/Gifts-vs-Bribes

I disagree with the Davis-Sterling website on this topic.

Board members should not receive any gifts from vendors. If they do receive a gift, then it is owned by the association and might make for a good item to give away by raffle at an annual meeting, but honestly should be declined.

I don't accept gifts in my role as a board member. Of any sort or any type. Just say no.

Homeowners are cynical and you don't want to give them the idea that the high bidder was used because the high bidder offered the board member a $6 bottle of wine.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HenryS7 on 12/14/2021 12:34 PM

Posted By PatJ1 on 12/14/2021 12:02 PM
Good read - https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/G/Gifts-vs-Bribes

Would you take up a collection form your homeowners and give vendors and/or employees large cash gifts during Christmas?

KerryL1 (California)
Posts: 14,550

Posted:

If you want to discuss your last two posts, Max, and start a new topic instead of sabotaging this one.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KerryL1 on 12/14/2021 1:12 PM
If you want to discuss your last two posts, Max, and start a new topic instead of sabotaging this one.

DON'T ever tell me what to do!

AugustinD
Posts: 3,698

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HenryS7 on 12/14/2021 12:34 PM
I disagree with the Davis-Sterling website on this topic.

Me too. I think this is the first time I had a major objection to the davis-stirling site.

I agree with all HenryS7 posted on this.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By HenryS7 on 12/14/2021 12:34 PM

Posted By PatJ1 on 12/14/2021 12:02 PM
Good read - https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/G/Gifts-vs-Bribes

The topic was, "Should directors accept gifts from Members, not vendors."?

CathyA3 (Ohio)
Posts: 6,299

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By AugustinD on 12/14/2021 2:34 PM

Posted By HenryS7 on 12/14/2021 12:34 PM
I disagree with the Davis-Sterling website on this topic.

Me too. I think this is the first time I had a major objection to the davis-stirling site.

I agree with all HenryS7 posted on this.

Add me to the group that disagrees with Davis-Stirling on this topic.

Even if accepting small gifts from anyone isn't unethical board behavior, it can still give the appearance of wrongdoing and can create expectations that should be avoided.

Our former (top notch) PM said that her company has a strict "no gifts" policy - she couldn't accept anything from anyone in the communities she managed, which seems like a good policy for everyone.

My main issue with any of these holiday gifts is that they confuse the personal with the professional/economic. As a board member, I felt that a homeowner's gift to me was complying with the terms of our governing documents and not making my life harder than it needed to be. With vendors, their "gift" was their professionalism and skill, for which the association paid a mutually acceptable fair price. Gifts muddy the waters by going outside of the contract, and nobody is sure where they stand.

Personally, I'd like to see a line of holiday greeting cards that say "Thank you for not being a PITA this past year", but I doubt that Hallmark would go for it. :-)

JohnP47 (Washington)
Posts: 31

Posted:

Onboard with the "no gift" stance, as well. If a member truly wants to offer a gift, the first most valuable is a gift of time and service to the community. The second is loud applause to the whole community for the service of other owners.

If that $50 just has to go, they can give it to the whole association and not any specific other owners.

JohnP47 (Washington)
Posts: 31

Posted:

A federal circuit court weighed in on the meaning of the federal bribery and gratuity law:

https://uknowledge.uky.edu/klj/vol68/iss4/8 page 1043

What is proscribed, simply put, is a public official's receipt of a gratuity, to which he was not legally entitled, given to him in the course of his everyday duties, for or because of any official act performed or to be performed by such public official, and he was in a position to use his authority in a manner which could affect the gift."

This works as my standard when serving as a board officer.

PS - Thanks Cathy for alerting me this was an old thread. I'll take more notice going forward. Haven't been on this forum in a bit and warming up for my tour of service beginning too soon.

MaxB4
Posts: 3,513

Posted:

I don't have an issue with the opinion from www.davis-stirling.com. I've taken some boards out during the holidays for a dinner. As far as other vendors giving gifts to board members, I have never had a vendor ask for a board members address.

I use a escrow fund to pay for these expenses. I also send new owners a $100 Home Depot gift certificate when they move into a community after closing escrow. This is sent along with their Welcome Packet.

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