anonymous letters to hoa board

Started by JillM3 • 33 replies • 9287 views

💬 Join us to post & get advice from 50,000 HOA & Condo leaders.

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in

JillM3 (Washington)
Posts: 2

Posted:

I serve on the board as the VP. Neighborhood is 82 homes. I don't think you should have to identify yourself in a complaint but the past board members kept sending out notices saying; all complaints about possible violations need to be in writing and identified which articles in the cc&r's are being violated and all letters have to be signed or will be disregarded. My question is do they have to sign there names and identify which articles are being violated????

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

What do you think "OPEN MEETING" means? That what you write in a letter or email isn't going to be discussed? My rule wasn't as strict as yours, but close. My rule stated that because the board ONLY met once a month and the meetings are OPEN, expect your letters to be read aloud at those meetings. The board may discuss and make the decision on the subject (NOT the general membership) but they were discussed openly.

That's what I don't get. People always wanting "OPEN meetings" but don't like it when their letters/emails are discussed. Sorry folks but even in board exclusive meetings, your letters/emails are read outloud and open for review. How else does one take it into consideration if not discussed?

The HOA is made up of YOU and YOUR neighbors. There is no "They or Them". So think a bit before writing these letters or wanting something. Realize you are opening yourself up to all members.

Former HOA President

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

The complainer should identify the violation and, if possible, name the rule, etc. that is being violated. The Board can confirm if a violation exists and what the specific article says & the article number, etc.

We have a form for residents to fill out stating the nature of the alleged violation, how often it happens/or when it occurred, the violator's address, & also name if possible.

I'm on the Board too and we do not accept anonymous complaints, and promise the complainer confidentiality on the form. In the seven years I've been on our Board, no violator has ever denied his/her violation. The Board, then, becomes the one who complains, calls the alleged violator to a hearing or whatever the next step is.

But we do require that a third party confirm the violation. This usually is a security officer, prop. mgr. or if they're not available, a director on the Board.

If worse came to worse and the violator took us to court over, say, a $100 fine, it's possible the complainer would have to face the alleged violator thereby revealing their identity. But with a rep of the HOA corroborating the violation, that seems highly unlikely.

What do your governing documents say, Jill?

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767

Posted:

Melissa

I completely disagree with you. What the poster is saying is that the Board or Association are sending out notices of violations to homeowners and that discussion would fall under the category of member discipline. The violation letters, if they also come attached with a fine, should follow state statues and their governing documents. If you fine a homeowner, due process might come into play. The letter should be signed Board or Directors, or if you have a management company, they would generally send out and would close as so and so, on behalf of the Board of Director of so and so association.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767

Posted:

Jill

In many areas, it may be required that the accused by allowed to face their accuser. I would say that it is a requirement that the accuser state which section of the declaration has maybe been violated, but when a letter is potentially is sent to the offending party it might need to be included.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JillM3 on 09/18/2013 3:47 PM

My question is do they have to sign there names and identify which articles are being violated????

In my opinion, yes.

This is because they are the initial complainant and may be needed to, worst case, testify if the case goes to court.

In my Association, we are required to inform the complainant, in writing, of the Associations findings. Therefore, we do not accept anonymous complaints.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

In CA and many other states, Melissa, homeowner discipline discussions & deliberations take place, indeed are required to take place, in executive session, not in open meetings. If Alabama permits the board to discipline members in OPEN meetings, please cite your source!!

I do think, Richard, that not all owners would know where to look to find out exactly what rule or covenant is being violated. Our PM is happy to look up the correct rule or article as am I.

An example might be that a resident sees a neighbor has installed red drapes an "knows" it's not permitted, but not where it's written. It's easy for others of us to find the rule. (We have many rules & CC&Rs due to being a high rise HOA.)

JillM3 (Washington)
Posts: 2

Posted:

it is a small community and petty where neighbors aren't putting back there garbage cans and leaving them out for weeks, or someones cat poops in there flower bed, or cats that are suppose to be ONLY indoors are outside ALL the time so when their next door neighbor wants to complain to the board they don't want to be identified because then there is 'bad blood' where if it is anonymous the board handles it saying it has been anonymously brought to our attention.because in past the violators of 'petty' things want to know who complained and then they get into arguments and fights which affect the neighbor hood children etc. the neighbors want it handled by the hoa so no 'feelings' get hurt??

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CarolR11 on 09/18/2013 4:36 PM

are required to take place, in executive session, not in open meetings.

Required or allowed? They are two different things.

Per CA Civil Code §4935 (provided by Davis-Stirling.com) the law says that the Board may meet in executive session to discuss specific issues. However, the Board must meet in executive session only if the individual member called to a hearing before the board requests it.

For our Association, we give the member the option of executive session or an open meeting.
Additionally, if the member does not attend the hearing, we err on the side of caution and go into executive session.

RichardP13 (California)
Posts: 1,767

Posted:

Carol

Sorry, meant to say, was NOT a requirement to state the section of the declaration.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

You're right, Tim, I should have stated it that: Owners may meet in ES on disciplinary matters. In other words, the board cannot force them to discuss the issues in an open meeting.

All owners we've called in 7 years have opted for ES.

Jill, won't the complainants be satisfied if the Board sees their names, but the neighbors who allegedly are in violation don't see the names? Can't the complainants take time stamped pics of the trash cans, roaming cats or whatever? Couldn't that confirm their complaint?

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Interesting issue. Something to be said for if you do not sign something (like a letter to the editor, HOA complaint, etc.) then it should be ignored. While this might be a method to stop the Chief Complaining Officer (CCO) that we all have, it can also be a head in the sand approach to problems.

I believe any "accusation" should be discussed in Executive Session (private) and a course of action decided. Even if such a accusation is signed, I think reading it in public opens all (BOD and writer of such) to potential legal action.

I believe the BOD should at least have a cursory look to see if any (signed, oral, etc.) complaint is valid. If the complaint is valid, then I say the BOD should accept the problem as theirs and the BOD become the "official complainer".

If the complaint was not signed it does not deserve a response no matter what the BOD finds/decides. If it was signed, it does deserve the respect of a reply.

One poster on here was a BOD Member who was hesitant to sign their name to anything. Talk about lack of assuming responsibility.

KellyM3 (North Carolina)
Posts: 2,239

Posted:

I'm opposed to anonymous complaint letters or violation reports, however, that policy should be board specific. At day's end, the accuser will be the HOA board - so the accused will certainly receive an opportunity to face them in a hearing.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

Since we require verification by a staffer or director of an alleged violation before an owner is sent a "courtesy" letter or is called to a hearing, it is the board who takes the action, decides on the outcome, etc. We do it that way too, Kelly. The Board, not the individual owner is the complainant.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

We do assume some things here. It has been my experience that reading the letters from the homeowner's with the issue at the meeting, sends the message we do listen. I don't mention who has sent the letter as sometimes they are at the meeting. However, they do appreciate the fact that the letters did not just go to my door. That the whole board was given that information and they can listen to our discussion of the matter. It has made a few of my CCO's happy to hear their issue being addressed and discussed. Mind you the ultimate decision is up to the board to handle but the owner's do get to see that we do indeed listen to them. It sends a message that we do address things and not hiding behind doors. Our responses to the letters do indeed reference the rules that were violated or reason for acceptance/rejection.

I found being open as much as possible even when it comes to letter to the board, helps. My funniest but serious letter I had to read? Apparently I forgot to get up early enough to unlock the gate that goes to the bathrooms for the lawncare people. So one of them took a bathroom break in someone's back yard. They walked out to see the man "watering their roses". Of course it was a CCO's that this happened to. She wanted them fired. However, I clarified the facts that we have a contract with them we must observe and firing them would cost us thousands of dollars. I also apologized as it was my fault and changed up how I open up the bathrooms for the workers. All worked out fine. She was in attendance for the reading of the letter and was happy that I did address the issue in front of everyone. I just kept her privacy by not saying it was her. (She admitted it was her to everyone).

It is hard to do things openly but the decisions have to be documented any way be it by the meeting notes or open meeting. Best to figure out the best method for your HOA to handle.

Former HOA President

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

This issue is timely, as we're about to publish our newsletter on disputes between neighbors - after reading this, I think I'll add something about CCR violations (in addition to being our Board's treasurer, I also edit the newsletter).

Policy wise, we've told homeowners (or residents who rent out their units)must identify themselves, along with providing contact information. The contact information isn't for the person who's the subject of the complaint - we need the information so we can follow up in case we need additional information. It's my experience that anonymous complaints have a tendency to leave out LOTS of details that we need in order to conduct an effective investigation. The complainant doesn't have to quote the article being violated, as we'll check it to see if the issue is even covered before a letter goes out.

We also need contact information because if the issue escalates to where legal action may be necessary, the complainant will need to come to court and testify as to what he/she saw.

Regarding a CCR violation, if it's something the board or property manager can verify, we'll notify the homeowner, but won't mention the complainant's name. Personally, I like to see time and date stamped photos of the violation, as it can be difficult to argue with a photograph, unless there's proof the photographer Photo shopped the thing half to death. In that case, getting the actual chip with the photograph would be needed (at that point, we're probably looking at legal action).

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569

Posted:

in my HOA:

unsigned letters are 'quick read' to see if a life safety issue is involved

if not - they are trashed

if so - the issue is addressed

the 'intent' is that an unsigned letter is merely gossip

(however, if one hears about a safety issue through gossip.........)

MikeS1
Posts: 521

Posted:

Carol - You're spot on. Thanks.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JohnB26 on 09/19/2013 7:33 AM
in my HOA:

unsigned letters are 'quick read' to see if a life safety issue is involved

if not - they are trashed

if so - the issue is addressed

the 'intent' is that an unsigned letter is merely gossip

(however, if one hears about a safety issue through gossip.........)

Sounds good to me.

ValerieS2 (Michigan)
Posts: 244

Posted:

I would not think that because someone brings a violation to the attention of the board that they would be required to sign their name.

What would the point be?

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

I can't think of a reason why complainants shouldn't reveal their names to the Board/PM.

Anonymity can encourage unbalanced or vindictive members to send a stream of complaints about someone against whom they hold a grudge Then the volunteer board may feel they have to investigate, but, perhaps finding nothing, they've wasted their time. The alleged violator may end up feeling harassed, etc.

There are lotsa reasons why various entities don't accept anonymous letters, complaints, etc. How about a college dean accepting an anon. student's letter about a professor allegedly harassing him?

ValerieS2 (Michigan)
Posts: 244

Posted:

Carol I can definitely see your point; however, an HOA differs in that MOST complaints can be easily verified by a simple visual glance at a property.

HOA's should not be investigating harassment type complaints, that is for law enforcement.

JH3 (Maryland)
Posts: 67

Posted:

Anonymous letters mean absolutely nothing, I get them all the time, most of the time the accuser doesn't even submit the name of the HOA they live in and my firm manages hundreds of HOAs - Trash. "My neighbor is pissing me off, do something, or else. - Anonymous" Really, I'm going to know who your neighbor is, who you are, where you live, why they're pissing you off? Dont think so.

Obviously the board is not required to do anything when they receive a letter, anonymous or not. However, if the board does act on a letter for a violation, the violator will receive a violation notice. An informed violator will request a hearing, and at that hearing, they have the right to face their accuser, question them, read the submitted letter (evidence), call witnesses, etc. (due process). The board, in these cases, is enforcing the violation, not making the accusation.

Perfect example, "My neighbor's dog is pooping in my yard, and he wont stop." There is no way the board can be the accuser in this case, unless a board member actually witnesses it happen.

If its serious enough to lodge a complaint, you better be prepared to go to court for it, because that is where it will end up eventually. You cant go to court with an anonymous letter as your only evidence.

AllisonD (Florida)
Posts: 449

Posted:

Question: Do you attempt to verify the veracity of the complaint, whether its anonymous or not?

In my HOA, we do not address anonymous complaints (it could be an x-spouse who is trying to harass the homeowner spouse and does not even live here), however; I investigate all complaints and will not act unless we can get a board member to verify that the complaint is valid. After that, we never tell the homeowner who complained since we verified it ourselves.

JM10 (California)
Posts: 503

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CarolR11 on 09/19/2013 4:04 PM
I can't think of a reason why complainants shouldn't reveal their names to the Board/PM.

Anonymity can encourage unbalanced or vindictive members to send a stream of complaints about someone against whom they hold a grudge Then the volunteer board may feel they have to investigate, but, perhaps finding nothing, they've wasted their time. The alleged violator may end up feeling harassed, etc.

There are lotsa reasons why various entities don't accept anonymous letters, complaints, etc. How about a college dean accepting an anon. student's letter about a professor allegedly harassing him?

From my perspective, the complaints should be written and should specify the CC&R that is being broken. The complainant should be able to do just as much reading as that person would like the perpetrator to do. Unless that person signs their name, then the complaint isn't that important.

I agree with Carol that anonymity encourages complaints that are groundless. We won a substantial judgment out of court because we were harassed. The insurance paid out, but in the end, that cost is passed on to the other HOA members who weren't willing to stand up for due process.

We were the target of several complaints by the HOA board. They would not name the complainant. If they had, they would have been forced to ask one of the directors to recuse himself in the case of the hearing. There is such a thing as due process and this must be part of any hearing, including HOA hearings.

I've read other people on this forum who were too easily bullied by their board of directors. They didn't ask for who, what and why and just paid up the fines. In each case we were threatened with fines, I challenged the board to show cause and quote the exact CC&R that we were violating. With each challenge, the board backed down except for those related to the hearing.

RayM6 (Virginia)
Posts: 40

Posted:

If it's neighbor vs. neighbor stuff that the BOD has no responsibility for, I wouldn't do anything. If it is a covenant violation that can be verified by a drive by, why not address it? A violation is a violation. We received an anonymous letter about a boat parked in a driveway (a violation in our HOA). Evidently it was an ongoing issue the previous BOD didn't address. It was easily verifiable, so we addressed it.

PeterD3 (Florida)
Posts: 708

Posted:

If the state statues (or similar) or the assn. controlling documents do not specify that complainants must identify themselves what authority does a BOD have to require it?

Failure to act on a legitament violation report is a dereliction of fiduciary duty.

Upon notice being given, should loss of property or other enjoyment result, failure to investigate it may put the BOD in an undefendable position.

While some or most may be 'crank' complaints, just like law enforcement agencies, the the BOD is obligated to "take a look".

SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By PeterD3 on 09/23/2013 4:45 PM
If the state statues (or similar) or the assn. controlling documents do not specify that complainants must identify themselves what authority does a BOD have to require it?

Failure to act on a legitament violation report is a dereliction of fiduciary duty.

Upon notice being given, should loss of property or other enjoyment result, failure to investigate it may put the BOD in an undefendable position.

While some or most may be 'crank' complaints, just like law enforcement agencies, the the BOD is obligated to "take a look".

The governing documents may allow the Board to adopt various rules and procedures so the Association can function, therefore if complaints have to be signed, they have to be signed.

If the issue concerns a CCR violation, you might not need to know the complainant's identity becuase you can always verify for yourself if, say a trash can was left out well after trash day. However, do you expect the board or property manager to run pillar to post investigating EVERY type of complaint? No one has time for that. Also, how does one define "legitimate violation" without some sort of evidence as a starting point?

I investigate complaints in my job - I won't say where or what king, but I can say anonymous complaints always irritated me, not because they're anonymous, but because most of them were lacking in details. something happened, but the complainant doesn't say where, when, who, how, if other people were involved or even how he/she came across the information. Having that information in the beginning gives me a roadmap on where to begin the investigation so I can try and gather evidence that will prove or disprove something happened.

I understand people are concerned about retribution and in some cases it's justified - in that case, you need to spill your guts and tell me as much as you can because I won't be able to come back to you. Then again, in some investigation, you can put a few facts together and figure out who filed the complaint and whether it's a crank. The problem is, all of this takes time and it's not a good thing to spend limited time and resources chasing something when you have little to go on to begin with, only to find it's a crank. How many solid complaints (with people willing to attest to what they saw and heard) went by the wayside because you had to take time to investigate what turned out to be nonsense?

If we were talking about life and death situations or something that affected a considerable number of people and anonymous complaints are the only way to get an investigation started, that's one thing. The stuff in HOAs doesn't usually rise to that level

If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius

GnomeX (Washington)
Posts: 253

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By CarolR11 on 09/18/2013 4:36 PM
In CA and many other states, Melissa, homeowner discipline discussions & deliberations take place, indeed are required to take place, in executive session, not in open meetings. If Alabama permits the board to discipline members in OPEN meetings, please cite your source!!

Don't know about Alabama but in Washington, we can discuss covenant violations in executive session but we MUST reconvene in open session and VOTE in open session on any decision.

The idea that a Board should discipline or fine people in closed session is abhorrent to me. Everything should be open and transparent as much as possible. It protects everyone overall.

GnomeX (Washington)
Posts: 253

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By JillM3 on 09/18/2013 4:44 PM
it is a small community and petty where neighbors aren't putting back there garbage cans and leaving them out for weeks, or someones cat poops in there flower bed, or cats that are suppose to be ONLY indoors are outside ALL the time so when their next door neighbor wants to complain to the board they don't want to be identified because then there is 'bad blood' where if it is anonymous the board handles it saying it has been anonymously brought to our attention.because in past the violators of 'petty' things want to know who complained and then they get into arguments and fights which affect the neighbor hood children etc. the neighbors want it handled by the hoa so no 'feelings' get hurt??

This also gets turned on its head and you get people abusing anonymous complaints. We have had problems where anonymous complaints were often frivolous. IE a neighbor wanting to use the HOA as a weapon to attack neighbors they do not like with sometimes outright false claims.

Anonymous complaints are troublesome in and of themselves for several other reasons. They give no way for a Board to do any followup in cases like a noise or pet violation. You need to know who made the complaint to substantiate it.

An anonymous complaint also will often not stand up in court. Who is the witness? Who will be called in to testify the violation actually occurred?

Case in point about things like animals. Our HOA has had those overturned in court before. We have had old Boards in my HOA just take anonymous complaints, they fine the member with no substantial proof the violation ever took place. Then it gets overturned in court when a member fights it. The judge will look at whomever is representing the HOA in court and ask for proof. A anonymous letter isn't going to fly. Seen it happen before.

Anonymous complaints might stop some of the bickering but it often opens up a whole other can of worms. They can create more headaches for a Board than they solve.

Plus people should ALWAYS have a right to face their accuser.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699

Posted:

Anonymous complaints are "ok" but it depends on the complaint.

If an anonymous complain comes in that someone built a shed without a permit or permission, and it's easily visible from the road, that is an easy violation for a board member to go and see and take proper steps to let the violator know he is going against CCR/bylaws, etc.

If an anonymous complaint comes in that someone was working on their car in the yard, or barking dog, etc. That complaint will be completely ignored because there is no one to discuss the problem with and the issue doesn't exist anymore.

Humans are very revengeful, so I don't blame some people for sending in anonymous complaints. People have been known to key cars, flat tires, vandalism etc in the name of revenge.

Kudos the anonymous tipper who is smart enough to know the person they are ratting on is a psycho.

MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836

Posted:

We never fined anybody in my HOA. We also discussed violations openly in our meetings. The decision and letter writing of that decision I usually had to write up. It sited the rules broken and the action needed to be taken to correct the issue. Most people complied and it became a non-issue. Heck, people were talking about the violation anyways, so why do it behind closed doors? It wasn't like a violation is a "secret" and can be hidden. The action taken against it should not be either.

We held OPEN meetings once a month. The first half of the meeting we would discuss things amongst ourselves as a board while letting everyone else listen. Ultimately, the board made the decision and voted in front of everyone. Since we the board were elected to represent the general membership, it was only fair they know what we did. Plus gave us an opportunity to listen to what they wanted.

I don't need to quote a "Law" source. It is all in our CC&R's that we followed. Executive meetings are good for some HOA's and necessary. However, we did not have that luxury nor need. We were very open to the membership. The only rare occasion we ever did do an executive type meeting was for ACC issues that needed reviewed. Even then we would announce it at the meeting and go afterward as a group to the member's home. Whoever wanted to follow us could. I find being open as much as possible is VERY hard but in the end is the best way to handle things.

Former HOA President

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563

Posted:

So, Melissa, you're telling us that the CC&Rs at your former HOA supersede AL state laws?? Or do no state laws address the issue of homeowner privacy in HOAs?

We summarize action taken against violators at the open meeting, which follows our EX. Sess. Tonight, for example, we'll state that an owner was fined $100 for allowing liquid to come off the balcony onto units below.

And HOAs are different. Detached home violations may be a lot more obvious to any passerby than violations in high rises. These usually are noise nuisances--loud parties & barking dogs. It's not at all always possible to figure out where the noise is coming from. In addition, we recently had a "noxious odor" violation where a new owner with a certain medical condition complained about cigarette smoke coming onto her balcony & into her unit. Took a while to figure where it came from.

In other words, confirmation of our typical violations do usually take security being involved to track down the problem & confirm it.

PeterD3 (Florida)
Posts: 708

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By SheliaH on 09/23/2013 7:49 PM

I agree the documents MAY allow the Board such authority.

Our BODs 'rules and procedures' adoption authority is limited to the common areas.

Our byLaws state the 'rules and procedures' for association function.
In this case it takes 2/3 membership vote to ammend them..

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

Join the conversation with 50,000 HOA & Condo Leaders:

✓ Ask follow-up questions
✓ Share your experience
✓ Get expert advice
✓ Access 350,000 discussions

Create Free Account →

⚡ Takes 30 seconds

Already a member? Log in here