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KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118
Posted:
Our PM recently sent a letter to one of my neighbors claiming a violation because one of their cars had been parked for "six months." The letter did not include any rule citation, evidence or even a notation of what car it is. The letter went on to say that although the car is licensed, the parking lot is not meant to store cars so it should be moved within two weeks to prevent towing.

First, I was wondering if anyone has had problems with towing in their HOAs. We had a problem here about six months ago where some cars were towed without notice and one car was towed from a driveway that is deeded "exclusive use." Our documents say that cars must be operable and legally tagged.

The car in question is legally tagged and operable, though one tire is a little low (but not flat). I'm wondering if a PM in FL has the right to tow a licensed, operable car from a legal parking space? It is owned by a resident, though not the resident who received the letter (they never checked who the car belonged to before sending the letter). Finally, don't violation letters require a rule citation and a committee to enforce? Recovering a car from a tow yard costs hundreds of dollars which seems to be equivalent to a fine.

Thanks!

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/09/2013 8:05 PM

I'm wondering if a PM in FL has the right to tow a licensed, operable car from a legal parking space?

Every County has specific codes on towing. Providing the Board has given towing authority to the PM and that County codes are complied with (typically specific signage and/or notice requirements), then the answer would be yes.

Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/09/2013 8:05 PM

It is owned by a resident, though not the resident who received the letter (they never checked who the car belonged to before sending the letter).

Somebody probably thought it belonged to that resident and told the PM that. Mistakes happen. The resident who received the letter should inform the PM that it is not their vehicle and the PM should take the time to identify who does own the vehicle.

Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/09/2013 8:05 PM

Finally, don't violation letters require a rule citation and a committee to enforce?

The good ones do.
If your on the Board, take steps to correct the issue.
If your not on the Board, bring it to the Boards attention (as they might not be aware of it).

Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/09/2013 8:05 PM

Recovering a car from a tow yard costs hundreds of dollars which seems to be equivalent to a fine.

Towing, like fines, are just one of many ways to enforce violations. Towing instead of fining tends to correct parking violations quicker. This is why many Board use them. However, if the Board isn't in compliance with the local towing laws, the Association may be required to pay for the tow if the tow itself is challenged through the courts.

As an Oh by the way: Our Association will often threaten towing just to get the members attention. However, due to our lack of compliance with County Codes, we can't actually tow unless the vehicle is causing a safety issue. When that happens, we contact the police and it's the police who have the vehicle towed.

DaveD3 (Michigan)
Posts: 796
Posted:
The PM exists solely to enforce the rules & restrictions in the declaration, Bylaws, and anything related that's issued by the board.

If there are no rules or restrictions regarding the duration for which a car may be parked without moving, then they have no basis to complain or tow.

So what's in the rules?
KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118
Posted:
Rules say it must be licensed and operable. I walked around today and found 3 cars with cobwebs; and I know those have moved within a week. So, cobwebs are no indication of an inoperable car. If you're sick or traveling, should the HOA be able to tow your car because there are cobwebs on the tire? It's a stretch in my opinion. We have snowbirds that are gone for 6 months.

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/10/2013 10:46 PM

If you're sick or traveling, should the HOA be able to tow your car because there are cobwebs on the tire?

In my opinion, no.

Mind you, it could also be an indication that the owner of the vehicle is military and deployed, incapacitated, hospitalized, away on business, etc.

DaveD3 (Michigan)
Posts: 796
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/10/2013 10:46 PM
Rules say it must be licensed and operable. I walked around today and found 3 cars with cobwebs; and I know those have moved within a week. So, cobwebs are no indication of an inoperable car. If you're sick or traveling, should the HOA be able to tow your car because there are cobwebs on the tire? It's a stretch in my opinion. We have snowbirds that are gone for 6 months.

Why is the PM trying to enforce rules that don't exist? That's the first question.

Tow a vehicle that's parked according to the rules only if legal action against both the HOA and PM are desired.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By DaveD3 on 09/11/2013 5:33 AM
Posted By KarenC15 on 09/10/2013 10:46 PM
Rules say it must be licensed and operable. I walked around today and found 3 cars with cobwebs; and I know those have moved within a week. So, cobwebs are no indication of an inoperable car. If you're sick or traveling, should the HOA be able to tow your car because there are cobwebs on the tire? It's a stretch in my opinion. We have snowbirds that are gone for 6 months.


Why is the PM trying to enforce rules that don't exist? That's the first question.

Tow a vehicle that's parked according to the rules only if legal action against both the HOA and PM are desired.

I agree.
KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118
Posted:
Some people on the board don't like the person who they "think" owns the car. The PM has done the letter thing often and with a few select residents when people on the board tell him too. They never cite a rule, they just send a letter saying to stop doing something that is not in a rule. He is the same PM that sent letter after letter to my neighbor about her satellite dish because it was not in placed in the exact place on her roof as a neighbor. One of the people on the board did not like the lady, so they kept having him send letters even though you cannot interfere with placement of a dish. He's like part of the gang and does not serve members any more. He's been here so long that it is really time for a change, but we can't change him without changing the board too. They think the board power and money is a place to carry out all their personal likes and dislikes, and the PM supports that.

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.
PeterD3 (Florida)
Posts: 708
Posted:

"Some people on the board don't like the person who they "think" owns the car."

Enough said.

That's the REAL problem (here and elsewhere).
RogerB (Colorado)
Posts: 5,067
Posted:
Karen, have you provided all of the facts? Is the vehicle parked in the common area on private property? Does the Owner have the right to park the vehicle at that location and for what length of time according to the Rules? Was an illegal parking notice been posted on the vehicle waring it could be towed if it remained in violation of the Rules? Were there other extenuating circumstances? Have you posted all of the facts related to the Restrictions? Often posters do not know all of the facts or are biased and post only part of the information. I would not give an opinion or "jump to a decision" without all the information.
KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118
Posted:
@Roger-

The vehicle is in common area, unreserved parking for residents. The vehicle is operable, licensed and owned by a resident. There is NO restriction on the number of vehicles belonging to one unit; just a limit of 8 residents (so that means 8 cars to me). The person who owns the car only has one other car, so two cars are ok. Because we have snowbirds, we do have cars that sit for long periods of time and those are not towed. No notice was placed on the car. The issue seems to be the "perceived" owner and that the car is older and doesn't look nice (though, it is not wrecked or rusted -- just old and dull). There is another resident with 6 cars -- all Benz and Mercedes, and there is no problem with their cars parked next to the car in question.

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.

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