"Can't we all just get along?"

Started by MarilynN1 • 15 replies • 1765 views

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MarilynN1 (Michigan)
Posts: 30

Posted:

Let's see if I can explain this terrible situation our Board is now faced with:

What do you do when a Member of our Board sends a email memo to a co-owner that was meant only for the Board for discussion. This co-owner has been overstepping the Boards duties numerous times. She does not trust anything we are doing. Frankly, I know we are doing everything correctly. Our meetings are transparent and open. All our bills are paid, property looks great and everyone is happy. Our monthly meetings are enjoyable and we all work well together. We are all new except for the president and treasurer.
This co-owner then sends out a public letter to all co-owners blasting the Board,the Treasurer, accusing the Members of not returning her phone calls, not paying bills, and went crazy when we said in the email, that she wasn't supposed to get, (it was for the Board only,) what we would do as to some sort of legal action towards her if she continues her meddling. Now we have to get legal advise which cost the entire community!

The first huge mistake was by our Board member who had no business sending this co-owner an email meant for our Board members for discussion. (they are friends)

Secondly, the email was quite strong and frankly the wording by our secretary was quite......well, let's say..... way too strong, describing any legal action if she continues her constant accusations.

Now we as the Board have to defend our position in the community and have sent out a letter to counter her letter which we mailed out today.

This is a terrible situation .....co-owners now calling, writing letters asking for the secretary to be removed from the board......asking "what's going on???" All this when a week ago everything was great!!

...........and I thought, this isn't going to be so bad serving on the Board, piece of cake!.....now we have to scold our own Board members!!?? I didn't sign on for this!
Sorry this was so long.

FrankS10 (Kansas)
Posts: 276

Posted:

Exactly what do you mean by meddling? You will always have to deal with a few people who do not trust anyone and will always be critical. Peggy Noonan in the WSJ last weekend had a great editorial about how we have become a nation of paranoids. It is life today in America.

Just from what you have told me, it sounds like a lesson your Board needed to learn. Don't write nasty things you would not say in an open meeting. Not every thought has to be put into printed word.

Again, I am curious to know what amount of meddling your Board felt rose to legal action. Were any other steps taken before this was considered? If this person is so bad, keep answering their queries like Tim does here and let them look like the fool you are implying they are. It's difficult to recover from exercising poor judgment, maybe an apology is in order which just might open the door for productive dialogue with this individual?

JMHO.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Marylin,

You understand the mistake. The Board sent an email about an issue that appears to have contained too much information.

A Board always runs this risk when sending e-mails. It doesn't matter if it went to the wrong person. There is always the possibility of a spouse or other family member of the board member reading the e-mail and disclosing what is in it.

As Frank posted, a good rule of thumb is not to place anything in an e-mail that you wouldn't say in an open meeting or in front of the person being discussed. In fact this is a good rule for anyone, not just board members.

Now you have to do damage control and worst, you may need to remove the individual from serving as secretary (remember that serving as secretary and as director are two different things). One way you might be able to prevent this is ask everyone who is calling for the Secretaries removal if they are willing to serve as Secretary. I suspect most, if not all, will say no.

MatthewW4 (Arizona)
Posts: 500

Posted:

Marilyn,

This is a good reason why you should not have been discussing board business in emails instead of at an open meeting. One board member's personal opinion has been transformed into the official position of the board without a motion, without a second, without a vote, without minutes, and without majority support.

You wrote that "The first huge mistake was by our Board member who had no business sending this co-owner an email meant for our Board members for discussion." Wrong! Your "first huge mistake" was conducting a secret board meeting via email instead of waiting for a scheduled open meeting.

As a result of bypassing all the open meeting requirements you put yourselves in a sticky situation. In the future, maybe you will learn from this mistake and conduct board business at open board meetings instead of skulking around in cyberspace discussing owners behind their backs.

MarilynN1 (Michigan)
Posts: 30

Posted:

I LOVE THIS FORUM!!!! All of you are so helpful seeing me see things from other points of view. Yes, you are right....emails get misunderstood, misconstrued, confusing at best and don't forgot emotions that can't be relayed in a email.
I feel terrible having to take a vote on removing someone from our Board...... All from a email that should have never been written and sent out. And now we have to deal with the Member that sent it!
Oh boy!!
Personally, the co-owner that wants the removal of the secretary would take it and he isn't a very nice person. Just moved in a year ago and has re-invented himself to the whole community! An expert on everything so he says.
Thank You!

ps...I'm the one working on the tennis court redo!!

KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118

Posted:

I think that all correspondence should be discussed in a noticed, open meeting and not in secret. Doing business in a transparent way will solve that problem.

One thing I was concerned about is your talking about "we all get along." The board should be a set of independent-thinking members who come together to conduct business and REPRESENT and serve the other members. It is not your job to necessarily agree and get along. You are expected to work in a civil way but definitely disagree, question and argue for what you believe is in the best interest of members and the community itself. If you are all just agreeing with each other, you are really not doing the job you were elected to do.

Members have a right to question you and hold you accountable. That is the part of democracy that functions as a check and balance. If you (meaning your board) are not comfortable with that process, you are not designed for service.

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MarilynN1 on 08/31/2013 8:39 AM

I feel terrible having to take a vote on removing someone from our Board......

Removing them from the Board or removing them from Office.

THEY ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.

If the individual was elected to the Board by the members, then typically only the members may remove the individual from the Board.

However, Officers are appointed by the Board and individuals appointed to an office may be removed from that office by the Board. That individual would still be a Director and still have a vote on everything brought before the Board. They just wouldn't have the additional secretarial duties.

KarenC15 (Florida)
Posts: 118

Posted:

Thanks for posting that. In my own HOA I have found that people do not understand the difference between doing an officer function and being a voting member. Most people believe that their is some kind of hierarchy where the President is the leader with a director having no power. All directors get equal votes and the others do a function. There is perceived power in the officer positions via setting agenda, giving reports in meetings, etc.; but those are subject to change by the popular view of the board itself. I have spoken to a lot of members who believe the board can just tell another board member to leave if that person disagrees, but directors are generally elected and must be removed by a vote of members, not the board itself.

Hatred is contagious, so one should work to avoid it.

MatthewW4 (Arizona)
Posts: 500

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By KarenC15 on 08/31/2013 9:02 AM

One thing I was concerned about is your talking about "we all get along." The board should be a set of independent-thinking members who come together to conduct business and REPRESENT and serve the other members. It is not your job to necessarily agree and get along. You are expected to work in a civil way but definitely disagree, question and argue for what you believe is in the best interest of members and the community itself. If you are all just agreeing with each other, you are really not doing the job you were elected to do.

Karen,

Well said! Being elected to a board is not like joining a club. Each director is accountable to those who elected him/her and should not be expected to march to the beat of the other directors.

MarilynN1 (Michigan)
Posts: 30

Posted:

Thanks to all......Karen and Matthew, believe me when I say I do not agree with something I feel strongly about but do "agree to disagree!" I am the only female on the Board with 6 Men. Must I say more????

Our Secretary wrote a hot-headed email which should never had been written and certainly not sent to one member who forwarded it to the c-owner. I was horrified! We do not have any Board meetings via emails or secretly and of course would have called a special meeting to discuss the entire matter if he hadn't sent it out already! You are certainly right about emails going around, half the time you don't know who sent what to whom!

When I say our meeting are cohesive and we all get along, I mean there is no yelling or screaming (like you hear about)........we get along with respect to each others ideas and thoughts even though I or we totally disagree.

I would say we learned a HUGE lesson this week and we're not done. Thanks Guys, I really appreciate your advice. I think I'll take 2 aspirins now.

MatthewW4 (Arizona)
Posts: 500

Posted:

One last comment:

Quote:

Posted By MarilynN1 on 08/31/2013 2:08 PM

I am the only female on the Board with 6 Men.

If my math is correct, you have seven members on your board. Why? My county has only five members on its board yet it functions fairly well and has a lot more responsibility than any HOA.

To be fair, my own board has nine! It originally was set up for 3 to 5 members but when the owners took control the first elected board could not figure out what to do so they added four more members. For the last ten years there have been two or three members who do almost everything and 6 or 7 who sit there like dunces. We have one member whose sole contribution consists of the phrase, "I'll second that."

There is no earthly reason for more than five members on any association board and most could get by just fine with only three.

MarilynN1 (Michigan)
Posts: 30

Posted:

Do you all agree we should have a Special Meeting to discuss this mess right away or wait and put it on the Agenda for our September Board meeting under new business? I personally think we should have a Special Meeting with all the Board members Present asap. Should it be open to the co-owners that sent nasty letters to us demanding retribution?

FrankS10 (Kansas)
Posts: 276

Posted:

Since today begins September, and typically there are requirements for announcing a Special Meeting, I would just wait until your regularly scheduled Board meeting. This will allow time for cooler heads to prevail and time hopefully for a sincere apology to be delivered-in person.

JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MarilynN1 on 08/31/2013 2:38 PM
Do you all agree we should have a Special Meeting to discuss this mess right away or wait and put it on the Agenda for our September Board meeting under new business? I personally think we should have a Special Meeting with all the Board members Present asap. Should it be open to the co-owners that sent nasty letters to us demanding retribution?

No need for a special meeting. This is an embarrassing issue but in the grand scheme of things it is not that important unless one wants blood.

MarilynN1 (Michigan)
Posts: 30

Posted:

Now it is turning into a blood-letting! It's getting worse by the minute. Now our Secretary is thinking of legal action on the co-owner in a libel suit stating his good name in the community has become compromised.
I personally think he is being irrational at this point. He wants a public apology and so does she(the co-owner) and at this point...the entire Board needs to get back from this Labor Day vacation and put this fire out!
Yes John.....in the grand scheme of things and what's going on in the world.....this makes no sense!

TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062

Posted:

Quote:

Posted By MarilynN1 on 09/01/2013 7:59 PM

Now it is turning into a blood-letting! It's getting worse by the minute. Now our Secretary is thinking of legal action on the co-owner in a libel suit stating his good name in the community has become compromised.

Well, I think that the Board should explain that the Association will not pay legal fees for such action and that the Secretary will need to pay for any legal expenses on her own.

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