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SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
I live in an area which has six HOAs. These HOAs are located in Dona Ana County New Mexico.

The main artery from a state highway into these HOAs is owned by a private individual. At the entrance of this main artery is a guard shack which he also owns and maintains.

This privately owned main artery splits into sort of circle and then turns into another road that goes to his two golf courses and club house.

This owner plans to abandon his roads and security service. After he opens his roads to the public, can the county or state takeover his roads? Does anyone know what rules or regulations apply to abandon roads?

I have already read Dona Ana County’s Code 360, Chapter 279, ROADS, Part 7, Acceptance of Private Roads. It does not address the abandonment of roads.

Thank you.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Sounds like the countyis getting this road. Kiss the guard shack goodbye unless you all want pay for it. This does not sound like abandonment than turning the road public. Which means anyone can drive on the road and have to obey the laws. No more expectations of privacy.

It is not a bad deal as now the repairs and maintenance will be on the county than the owner. What are your concerns for this change?

Former HOA President
SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
His roads have not been maintained in years. In other words, they are full of potholes. Security is a joke.

He shut down his golf courses over two years and plans to mothball them for another four or five years.

His lack of concern has caused the value of our homes to decrease dramatically. No one wants to purchase a home in our HOAs because of these conditions.

GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Is this the only way into your HOA? If it is, the Board might contact him to see if he is willing to deed them to the HOA. If it is the only road in then the Board should make sure there is a maintenance agreement in place between the HOA, the current owner and any future owners. In other words get an attorney involved to protect the HOA and its members interests. I seriously doubt the County will accept the road unless it is in pristine condition and up to code.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
Thank you.

Yes, the only way into the six HOAs is via is privately owned roads.

Yes, the county will not accept privately owned roads unless they meet county standards.

But, what if these privately owned roads were abandoned? What if no one owned them?
SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
Thank you.

Yes, the only way into the six HOAs is via is privately owned roads.

Yes, the county will not accept privately owned roads unless they meet county standards.

But, what if these privately owned roads were abandoned? What if no one owned them?
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Steve what do you mean by abandoned? I get it that he is shutting down his golf courses and the guard shack but I imagine he will still pay the property taxes so he doesn't lose them, same thing for the road, he just won't maintain it. If he does default on the taxes and the HOA is there with a winning bid, the HOA would then own them. Even if someone else buys them, the HOA easement should still be valid.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I do not get why this road has to be in good condition and fit the county specs? Our roads were turned over and did not fit the restrictions. They are too narrow and we went to the city from being county.

We just had to give up the privacy benefits of having a private road. Meaning we had no right to put in a gate or guard shack. Any repairs or changes we had to go to the city council to get done NOT the HOA. The city put up their own street signs. We did have to make a special code due to the narrow parking issue. Which allowed us to paint our curbs red instead of putting NO Parking signs. Which would have caused issues.

I would have the HOAs in the area talk to their city or county representative and fire department. You will have concerns with emergency services as well. However, your reps want your votes to stay in office. So use that to your advantage by getting that road added to your county or city.

I do not think any of you really want to own this road. It does NOT bring your home values down. It just makes them less attractive to buyers.

Former HOA President
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 08/25/2013 3:12 PM
I do not get why this road has to be in good condition and fit the county specs? Our roads were turned over and did not fit the restrictions. They are too narrow and we went to the city from being county.

Because then they would have to spend tax dollars to bring them up to snuff. IMHO you got very lucky if they took your roads as is - where is. Or someone got their palm greased.

BTW Do they even have building codes in Alabama?

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Yes they do and they decided NOT to bring the roads to code. Which is an option and NOT done by being paid off. You ASSUME too much of the situation. I find if you find out the facts than assumptions, things work out. I suggest talking to a county or city rep. They than want votes and your tax dollars from road useage. Meaning they can now post police there and issue tickets...

Talk to someone and do NOT assume. Your local representative is a good start and direction to find out the steps. That is what we did and our roads are public despite not meeting the width. Which we were later able to make an ordinace to work around.

Former HOA President
MatthewW4 (Arizona)
Posts: 500
Posted:
Steve,

If New Mexico is anything like Arizona you will not likely find any statutes addressing your situation. In AZ this is all covered by common law -- court decisions and scholarly works -- and it is difficult for the lay person to research.

My first guess is that somewhere along the line the original owner granted an easement for your roads. From my reading of Arizona case law, abandoning an easement is just about impossible so the easement (if there is one) will continue regardless of holds the deed to the property. Someone will need to research deeds and plats to see if there is an easement. If no easement was granted, you (all six HOA's) may be able to file a court action to obtain an easement by necessity.

Now for the bad news about road maintenance: open your wallets. There is a body of common law that says, in effect, that those who use an easement have a legally enforceable obligation to share in the costs of maintaining it. As far as the county picking up the tab, forget about it. Your roads sound like they are basically private driveways that dead-end inside your neighborhoods; the county is unlikely to have an interest in maintaining roads that go nowhere.

You collectively are most likely going to need the services of an attorney to advise you as to where you now stand and what your options are.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:

This owner plans to abandon his roads and security service. After he opens his roads to the public, can the county or state takeover his roads? Does anyone know what rules or regulations apply to abandon roads?


The road isn't really abandoned, it just won't be maintained by the current owner.

Quote:
Now for the bad news about road maintenance: open your wallets. There is a body of common law that says, in effect, that those who use an easement have a legally enforceable obligation to share in the costs of maintaining it.


Yep. You will of course need a lawyer to help you with this one. It's a complicated matter. You may want to start a new "road association" in which each owner pays dues and the dues only go to the road. It will be impossible to get 6 HOA's to agree to maintain the road. And you may need to get the old owner to deed the new association the roads. The court can force this matter as everyone uses the roads to drive home.

Don't do anything? The roads will fall apart, and you will still need to drive on them to get home.
MatthewW4 (Arizona)
Posts: 500
Posted:
Steve W:

I got curious and went looking for your development on Google Earth. Is yours the golf-course community named Santa Teresa? On the satellite image taken last November, I could see pot holes in the roads, tennis courts cracked and overgrown with weeds, a community swimimg pool with no water, and an unwatered golf course.

It looks like the developer had grandiose dreams that failed to materialize. My first guess would be that this development was in trouble long before the 2008 housing meltdown and recent economic problems were the final nail in the coffin. It looks like the developer built elaborate recreational facilities, including the golf course, but was unable to sell enough homes to sustain those facilities. If the boundaries of this development are where I think they are, they sold no more than 20% of the available lots.

SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
Matthew,

You are 100% correct.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Another option would be to get a quote to fix the pot holes, split it 6 ways between each HOA and just hire a company to repair the pot holes. Just make it good enough to drive. Just do it, regardless of who owns it. It will save expensive car repairs.
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569
Posted:
if you own it, you maintain/repair it

if you have an easement, you maintain/repair it

if it is the ONLY way in/out of your 'landlocked' developement you already have an easement of necessity ~ just go ahead and have it registered (may need legal help)

if it is private and for your exclusive use, YOU PAY THE BILLS

if you really want county through roads, pay for their construction, and give up any privacy you have

y'all bought what you bought

CAVEAT EMPTOR
SteveW9 (New Mexico)
Posts: 37
Posted:
Thanks to everyone. As always you have given me much needed information. As a departing gift, I give you the following:
Attorney General Gary K. King
Criminal Investigation Division
111 Lomas Blvd, Suite 300
Albuquerque, NM 87102

Criminal Investigation Division:

Prior to the addition of Franklin View Estates in Santa Teresa there were 528 homes.

Santa Teresa Community Services, owned by Mr. Gregory W. Collins who is not a homeowner in Santa Teresa; who still resides in El Paso; who is not a member of a Homeowners Association, has been sending the homeowners a statement for Garbage Service, Security, Aerial Lights and Aerial Road Maintenance ever since he became the owner of STCS. Today’s monthly statement looks like this:

Garbage Service: $21.95
Security Service: $22.10
Aerial Road Lights: $0.00
Aerial Road Maintenance: $2.00
Tax Sales @ 6.375%: $2.81
Total Amount: $48.86 per month

$48.86 X 528 homeowners equal $25,798.00 times 12 months equals $309,576.00.

Most Santa Teresa homeowners signed a contract with Mr. Collins to provide the above services. Some have never signed a contract especially a few who lived here prior to Mr. Collins. He has failed to insure that all past, present and future homeowners are aware of this contract.

It is a televised fact that Mr. Collins has failed to pay his security guards thus the reason why some quit. It is a fact that his security guards no longer patrol our streets. Do Mr. Collins’ security guards have a job description? What are their responsibilities? Patrol the streets; be highly visible; investigate disturbances; call the police or fire department in cases of emergency; deter theft and damage to personal property; report anything suspicious to the police? Are his security guards required to be certified?

Santa Teresa has many unauthorized roads providing ingress and egress. A thief could easily cut across the desert; travel to Santa Teresa Port of Entry and never get caught.

A couple of months ago thieves broke into my neighbors home; stole most of his valuables and his two cars in his garage. This incident might have been prevented had Mr. Collins been providing security services for which we are paying.

Replies by his security guards when someone calls about a disturbance or anything suspicious is always the same: We cannot do anything. Call the Sheriff’s Department.

It is a fact that he has not maintained his streets. Only recently, after considerable pressure from the residents of Santa Teresa, did he begin to patch some of the holes in his streets.

So, where have STCS’s fees gone? In Mr. Collins’ pocket? To pay his other debts? To maintain his bar which allegedly has mold?

FRAUD: In the broadest sense, a fraud is a deception made for personal gain. Is Mr. Collins guilty of Fraud?

FRAUD IN THE FACTUM: Fraud in the factum is a type of fraud where misrepresentation causes one to enter a transaction without accurately realizing the risks, duties or obligations incurred. Is Mr. Collins guilty of Fraud in the Factum?

SAS 99: SAS 99 defines fraud as an intentional act that results in a material misstatement in financial statements. Is Mr. Collins guilty of these intentional acts?

Mr. Collins could be directly adversely affecting the economical development of Santa Teresa.

Request that you please investigate the above allegations of fraud.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
I love people who post one question when it's really about something else. You contact the authorities, you live there we don't, you were the one who bought without doing your due diligence.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JohnB26 (South Carolina)
Posts: 1,569
Posted:
to repeat:

if you own it, you maintain/repair it

if you have an easement, you maintain/repair it

if it is the ONLY way in/out of your 'landlocked' developement you already have an easement of necessity ~ just go ahead and have it registered (may need legal help)

if it is private and for your exclusive use, YOU PAY THE BILLS

if you really want county through roads, pay for their construction, and give up any privacy you have

y'all bought what you bought

CAVEAT EMPTOR
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
To SteveW9,

I suggest that you read the posting rules for this forum.

🎯 You've read this entire discussion

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