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LynnF3 (Florida)
Posts: 3
Posted:
Our HOA board does not provide any narrative to the financials, the minutes only state that the treasure gave a report. There is nothing printed in the minutes as to the condition of the HOA. The owners for the most part are older and don't want to be bothered. I have ask the Board several times to provide a narrative report for owners, they will not. Accounting standards require that notes to financials must be provided. What can owners to force compliances by the Board.

examples:
Management Reports - HOA
H&E Management's Monthly Management Reports are prepared in a way that gives Project Owners, Board Members or other Stakeholders of the property a comprehensive and detailed representation of the activities that took place on the property during that reporting period.
These reports are written in a manner that will allow the reader to pick up the Management Report from any given period, and be able to determine precisely what was going on in various aspects of the operation of the property during that time. H&E's Management Reports have been instrumental in assisting Boards of Directors to construct chronological timelines of events, which worked to compliment and substantiate the property's meeting minutes for that period, while preparing the project for pending litigations..
The structure of H&E's Management Reports are typically segmented into three parts:
MANAGEMENT UPDATES
The Management Update starts off with a detailed written narrative about the activites that occurred on the property during the period covered. The narrative summarizes the activity along with Management's opinions and recommendations about property related matters. Many Owners and Board members find this written summary useful in assessing the status of the community, during the reporting period, as opposed to only being presented with raw data like other Property Management companies have been known to present in their management reports. For those readers who wish to read more detailed information about the activities that took place during the reporting period, the supporting documents that are the basis for the information in the narrative is included in the Management Update also. The typical topics that are included
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
For now, don't worry about the other owners - granted there's strength in numbers, but it appears your neighbors think ignorance is bliss (in which case they may be in for a very rude awakening). Or maybe they've tried, got rebuffed and are too scared to try again. If that's the case, maybe you can suggest to them that ALL OF YOU go to the board at the same time and demand details. However if that doesn't work, concentrate on getting the information yourself.

Your CCRs and/or Bylaws may state what reports the owners are entitled to - most of the time, you can't get information on other owners' accounts, but you should be able to get an itemized budget and income/expense statement, as well as a summary of delinquent owners, if any (how many and the total amount owed the association). If you have a property manager, you should be able to get it from him or her.

If that doesn't work, I think Florida has a department that handles complaints involving HOAs and you should contact them. Or try your state or local consumer protection division.


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
For now, don't worry about the other owners - granted there's strength in numbers, but it appears your neighbors think ignorance is bliss (in which case they may be in for a very rude awakening). Or maybe they've tried, got rebuffed and are too scared to try again. If that's the case, maybe you can suggest to them that ALL OF YOU go to the board at the same time and demand details. However if that doesn't work, concentrate on getting the information yourself.

Your CCRs and/or Bylaws may state what reports the owners are entitled to - most of the time, you can't get information on other owners' accounts, but you should be able to get an itemized budget and income/expense statement, as well as a summary of delinquent owners, if any (how many and the total amount owed the association). If you have a property manager, you should be able to get it from him or her.

If that doesn't work, I think Florida has a department that handles complaints involving HOAs and you should contact them. Or try your state or local consumer protection division.


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By LynnF3 on 08/22/2013 9:34 AM

Our HOA board does not provide any narrative to the financials, the minutes only state that the treasure gave a report.

Lynn,

I'm not sure if you mean that there are no financials attached to the minutes or not.

As Treasurer, I provide a written report at each board meeting. This includes an income and expense statement for operating funds and Reserve funds, a budget summary (budgeted vs. actual), and a total of delinquent accounts ( x lots are 30 days behind, x lots are 60 days, etc.). Basically, I let the numbers speak for themselves and ask if there are any questions (typically there are none).

Our minutes simply note that the Treasurer provided a written report and that the report is included as an attachment.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Lynn

Are you given financial statements, balance sheets, etc? Is it that you cannot understand them? Is it that you want more?

Thanks for answering.
LynnF3 (Florida)
Posts: 3
Posted:
This is what owners need!!!

The Management Update starts off with a detailed written narrative about the activites that occurred on the property during the period covered. The narrative summarizes the activity along with Management's opinions and recommendations about property related matters.
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
First I thought this was about financial statements and now I see it's really about what the Board/MC has or hasn't done.

Typically, the minutes (and the reports to the Board) are those indications. Typically they do not go into great detail. They are usually just bullet items of issues and decisions. The following links better explain what minutes should and should not contain:

Roberts Rules Of Order - Minutes Roberts Rules of Order is the typical standard.

Fairfax County (VA) Community Association Manual - Minutes (Scroll down to page 15) Although based on Virginia laws, it's a good write up on what should and should not be in minutes.

Davis-Stirling.com Meeting Minutes page Although based on CA laws, it's a good write up on what should and should not be in minutes.

AllisonD (Florida)
Posts: 449
Posted:
LynnF3, in Florida for the most part, minutes are a summary of what occurred at the meeting with some detail when then board feels its necessary. But remember in Florida, you are entitled to request to see all HOA documents including financials. Sometimes at my board meetings (which residents rarely attend) I will have the financials and put into the official record something regarding the financials I want the details of to be recorded (like a vote to spend money on something) and other times when the only item discussed is the aging report, we will just include the amount of dues owed by residents (no names or house #'s, just amounts). Anyone can request the financials at any time and get the details. If you would like something to be in the record, I would suggest when you attend a meeting, you should ask a specific question and then request that the question and answer be recorded in the minutes.
AllisonD (Florida)
Posts: 449
Posted:
LynnF3, you cannot request certain documents such as those related to law suits which are attorney/client privilege, HOA employee personal information and a few other items listed in the statute. I forgot to include this in my previous post.
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Allison

You say:

I would suggest when you attend a meeting, you should ask a specific question and then request that the question and answer be recorded in the minutes.

I do not believe this can nor must be done in every state.

Do not get me wrong. I advocate, an open question/comment time at every meeting. What I do not believe is that the questions/comments must be directly responded to nor put in the minutes.

Minutes are not a running, rambling narrative of all that was said. They are not a sales brochure. They are not meant to pump sunshine nor predict gloom. They are a concise and to the point record of business done. Such as Motion to do so and so made. Motion seconded. Motion was discussed (maybe for 3 hours). Motion voted on. Motion approved/defeated 4-3.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Lynn you keep saying "narrative" do you mean instead of attaching the treasurer's report, you want it read into the minutes?

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Glenn

I could be wrong but I think what she wants is a make me feel good narrative as my eyes gloss over with figures.

Like an Annual Report where if I like what I read, I do not look at (and in some cases do not understand) the figures that follow.

Our profits margins are up. We have a bright future. I stop reading.

Forget the we laid off half our people, we closed all we could, our sales and profits are in the toilet, our stock is worth 1/8th of what it was a year ago, but...but...our profit margins are up.....LOL

Does Kodak come to mind?

Talk about pumping sunshine up where the sun does not shine.

AllisonD (Florida)
Posts: 449
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC46 on 08/23/2013 2:31 PM
Allison

You say:

I would suggest when you attend a meeting, you should ask a specific question and then request that the question and answer be recorded in the minutes.

I do not believe this can nor must be done in every state.

Do not get me wrong. I advocate, an open question/comment time at every meeting. What I do not believe is that the questions/comments must be directly responded to nor put in the minutes.

Minutes are not a running, rambling narrative of all that was said. They are not a sales brochure. They are not meant to pump sunshine nor predict gloom. They are a concise and to the point record of business done. Such as Motion to do so and so made. Motion seconded. Motion was discussed (maybe for 3 hours). Motion voted on. Motion approved/defeated 4-3.

Of course you are correct but both the poster and myself are from Florida, so I was referring only to Florida. I will make that clear from now on.
LynnF3 (Florida)
Posts: 3
Posted:
ok GAAP accounting rules: there most be footnotes to explain major changes from prior monthly statement and budget. These footnotes are carried forward so someone looking at a June statement can see that in March there was an unbudgeted expense of $10,000 for repairs. This is what I am trying to "force" our HOA to provided.
AllisonD (Florida)
Posts: 449
Posted:
Lynn F3, I think it would be nice for all your documents to have footnotes and documentation attached with narratives and detailed minutes, but in reality, if a vote is taken at a January meeting to spend $10,000 on road paving, and in March the financials show the expense has been incurred and in April the financials show the invoice has been paid, that is the documentation you will get. If the board wants to mention the expense at the April meeting, then fine, but if they don't, that is fine too. This is another example of having to read all the documents to get the information you want rather than making it a board responsibility to give you the information you want in the format you want it in. I am not trying to be snippy but the financial reports and meeting minutes should have the information you are looking for, and if its not there, AND IF YOU ARE ALLOWED TO DO SO IN YOUR STATE, ask the questions you want answered and ask if the questions and answers can be included in the minutes.

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