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JohnC52 (Missouri)
Posts: 4
Posted:
My builder turned over control of the POA HOA to the members back in August.
We where given a CC&R and that was all
We elected a President, Vice President and Treasure. We also appointed 3 members to the ACC.
In December the board removed 1 member of the ACC.
In January the President of the Association resigned and than moved
THe Vice President is now acting President.
We have allot of problems and issues that have been brought to the new self appoiinted president including wanting to know where the money is going. when asked we where told that it takes a while to get the books in order and he would be calling a meeting
That was in February
If you call the president he will not answer or return your call and as of end of March he has stop returning emails.
Can a member of the Association force a meeting?
We have no by laws because the short lived board has never set any and the builder had none in place.

Please Help
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
John,

Sorry to hear about the poor turn over. I've attached a document that gives a list of things that should be done during transition. If it wasn't done, some of it can still be done.

It is normal for the VP to serve as the President in the President's absence. Therefore, I certainly wouldn't call them self appointed.

Serving on the board during a transition takes a lot of time. Individuals who serve are typically volunteers and only have x amount of time available to perform their volunteer duties. Perhaps you can approach the board and offer your time and talent to help address some of the issues you described.

Tim
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JohnC52 (Missouri)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Thanks for the form.
The problem is we have about 10 members that want to help and move forward but we can't get the board to call a meeting.
We want a meeting to elect the missing President or if the Vice President wants to be President that to fill the Vice President position but not only that to get By Laws in place, and to see them enforce the CC&R's.

How do we as members get a meeting called if the board refuses or does not want a meeting?
JohnC52 (Missouri)
Posts: 4
Posted:
Thanks for the form.
The problem is we have about 10 members that want to help and move forward but we can't get the board to call a meeting.
We want a meeting to elect the missing President or if the Vice President wants to be President that to fill the Vice President position but not only that to get By Laws in place, and to see them enforce the CC&R's.

How do we as members get a meeting called if the board refuses or does not want a meeting?
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Typically, the Association elects Directors.
The Board of Directors appoint the Officers (Pres, VP, etc.).
Usually, when there is a vacancy, the Board appoints individuals to the vacant seat.

Is your Association incorporated?
You can check by looking on the Missouri Secretary of State website.

IF your Association is incorporated then applicable corporate laws would apply. These laws typically address procedures for Corporations. If your Association is not incorporated then those laws would not be applicable.

Are you in a condominium? If you are then Missouri condominium laws would apply.

If you are not in a condominium, and you are not incorporated, then only your CC&Rs would be used to see what is and isn't allowed.
NilaR (Kansas)
Posts: 49
Posted:
John,

Are you sure your HOA has been registered with the State of Missouri as a non-profit? You may not even have an official HOA there.

I have been working with Missouri residents for the past 3 years. They are trying to get the Missouri legislators to propose a bill just like we passed in Kansas that gives the HOA members legal rights. Now known as the Kansas Uniform Common Interests Owners Bill Of Rights. I don't know where you are in Missouri but you are not alone in the problems you are having.

I would suggest you take your CC&R's to a real estate attorney and have them looked over as well. You may very well find, if you are an HOA, that there are procedures for calling a special meeting.

We have new subdivisions in Kansas with the exact same problems. I've attended their meetings and my attorney has helped one of them get on track so they could move forward.

Keep us posted and good luck!

NDR
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I can see how one would say the President is self appointed. If you read the duties of the officer positions you find that the vice-president position does NOT take over for the president if that president quits/leaves/dies. It is NOT like the US Government but it is the Corporate structure instead. The Vice-President's job is to take over if the president can't attend meetings and hold them in their behalf. However, they don't inherit the position. The board decides amongst it's own board members what office positions members get.

I would look for to see if your HOA is incorporated at the STATE level. Your CC&R's are your deed restrictions and on file at your courthouse. By-laws do not have to be filed in most cases and are in-house documents. I believe that is what you are wanting to draft up. Which by-laws pretty much go by the CC&R's except with a bit more "flushing out" of the details. CC&Rs are usually outlines while by-laws cover the details.

Former HOA President
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I can see how one would say the President is self appointed. If you read the duties of the officer positions you find that the vice-president position does NOT take over for the president if that president quits/leaves/dies. It is NOT like the US Government but it is the Corporate structure instead. The Vice-President's job is to take over if the president can't attend meetings and hold them in their behalf. However, they don't inherit the position. The board decides amongst it's own board members what office positions members get.

I would look for to see if your HOA is incorporated at the STATE level. Your CC&R's are your deed restrictions and on file at your courthouse. By-laws do not have to be filed in most cases and are in-house documents. I believe that is what you are wanting to draft up. Which by-laws pretty much go by the CC&R's except with a bit more "flushing out" of the details. CC&Rs are usually outlines while by-laws cover the details.

Former HOA President
BruceF1 (Connecticut)
Posts: 2,535
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By MelissaP1 on 05/13/2013 1:56 PM
I can see how one would say the President is self appointed. If you read the duties of the officer positions you find that the vice-president position does NOT take over for the president if that president quits/leaves/dies. It is NOT like the US Government but it is the Corporate structure instead. The Vice-President's job is to take over if the president can't attend meetings and hold them in their behalf. However, they don't inherit the position. The board decides amongst it's own board members what office positions members get.

Not necessarily true.

According to proper parliamentary procedure, such as Roberts Rules, the vice-president DOES automatically become the president if the president resigns/leaves/dies, unless OTHERWISE PROVIDED IN YOUR BYLAWS. If the bylaws are silent on the issue, then proper parliamentary procedure should be followed unless state corporate or HOA laws dictate otherwise.

As always, the situation differs from state to state and from HOA to HOA. There is not a one-size-fits-all rule.

In the present case, if there are no bylaws, it may not be possible to determine the order of succession except possibly by looking at state laws or by following accepted standard parliamentary procedure.

Here, in Connecticut, we are required to follow Roberts Rules, so, if the bylaws don't specify the order of succession or replacement of the president, then according to Roberts, the vice-president automatically BECOMES president.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
Not all HOA's are the same or follow Robert's rules. I found out this information myself during an election period. Which of course was the one election to vote me out as President. However, it was all unnecessary as I had already bought another house and moved. The new board once elected then decided amongst themselves to appoint people to the office positions.

When I was president it's whoever volunteered and raised their hand got a position. We barely had 5 people to volunteer. So you can guess we did not always follow the election rules if we never had a meeting with people at it...

Former HOA President
JohnC52 (Missouri)
Posts: 4
Posted:
I will check with Sec of State to see if we are incorporated but i believe the only thing the builder filed was the CC&R.

In our CC&R it does not outline anything about meetings or the Board

I am in MO so what can i do to force a meeting or call a meeting

We have a small group that wants to start a petition to disband the Association.

I think that is a mistake we just need members on the board that have time and care about whats going on
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,059
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By JohnC52 on 05/14/2013 4:04 AM

We have a small group that wants to start a petition to disband the Association.

What common areas does the association maintain?
Who pays for trash/recycling collection (individual residents or the Association)?
Who pays for the street lights (city, individual owners or Association)?
Do you have common elements (roads, sidewalks, playgrounds, retention ponds, etc.)?

These questions need to be answered prior to disbanding the Association. If there are common elements or common expenses you will have to find someone (City, County, private individual, etc.) willing to take these over or pay to eliminate them prior to disbanding.
MelissaP1 (Alabama)
Posts: 13,836
Posted:
I always find it ironic that the people who want to "disband" their HOA also want to form their own group to run the place. Like it is a new idea that they ban together to make a committee amongst themselves after they disband the HOA. Which then in of itself makes another HOA. I've heard people actually contemplate this not realizing that is exactly what a HOA already is.

Former HOA President

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