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SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
A month or so ago, I wrote about a board member who'd been sent several letters from the association about the condition of his unit (we're a townhouse community). At our board meeting in March, a homeowner who lives across the yard from the unit put the guy on blast during the resident forum (in fact, it took up all the forum and a little more before we moved on to the rest of the agenda.

The board member rents the place out and promised the tenants would move out this month, along with their their dog, who's terrified several neighbors when it gets out by digging under the patio fence. We are approaching mid May, the tenants are still here and the board member has kept about a third of his promises.

Today, when i got home from work, our vice president told me about the dog getting out yet again earlier today. I reminded him that I suggested to the board last month that we hold an executive session to deal with this and now I think that will happen at the next meeting (week after next) or possibly June (I'll be able to attend because I've been working a seasonal part time job where I work nights. I'm treasurer, but still manage to turn in treasurer's reports).

ANYWAY, I know if we censure the guy or ask him to resign in an executive session, we will have to summarize this in the minutes, but I'm thinking we should also mention it in the newsletter - it's not so much to embarras him (the March meeting probably took care of some of that because he's still steamed of being yelled at), but let the homeowners know that the Board does take its responsibilities seriously - we're planning to put a new emphasis on CCR enforcement with respect to how homeowners maintain their unit and for us to have any credibility, we should at least make sure our own house is in order.

So, for those of you who have found it necessary to call a Board member on the carpet, how do you inform the membership? Do you have an example of how you summarized this in the minutes and/or your newsletter? If the board member quit, did you just announce he/she quit, thanked him/her for their service and leave it at that? Any ideas will be helpful - thanks, as always!


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Shelia,

It depends on if the individual resigns or not.

If the individual resigns simply state the following

in the minutes:

Went to executive session to discuss personnel issues.
Returned from executive session.

New Business: Director xyz announced their resignation effective on mm/dd/yyyy.



Director xyz has/will resign effective mm/dd/yyyy. If you are interested in serving on the Board and being part of the decision process, contact . . .

If they don't resign:

in the minutes:

Went to executive session to discuss personnel issues.
Returned from executive session.

Since s/he didn't resign, there is nothing to announce to the membership.

CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
I think I asked you this previously, Sheila. Why isn't your board fining this director for violations of your rules concerning upkeep of his unit?

In our HOA, but maybe not yours, fines increase if h'owners fail to comply with our rules after a first warning and then a fine levied in executive session to which the owner is invited.

Re: the dog, do you have any rules about dog control, e.g., must be on leash or otherwise under the control of its owner? If so, call the unit owner to hearing for that violation too. Our board has the additional authority to demand that a dog that's a nuisance can be removed from the premises. Never have had to use it, though.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
PS, Sheila, Tim's approach is one we've used here too if the director refuses to cure his violations. We've seen no need to name the director, the violations, etc.

But what you really want is compliance with your rules. I can't remember, do your docs permit suspension of common are privileges for uncured violations. Works very well here, but, then, we have some privileges that are well worth suspending.
GlenL (Ohio)
Posts: 5,491
Posted:
Censure means diddly squat, it's basically saying so and so screwed up and the Board gave them a 'talkin to'. If he or his renter are in violation, treat them as any other violator. If the renter's actions cause the owner to be fined and he was dumb enough not to put something in the lease that allows him to pass the fine on, the rental property goes from making money to costing money. Always an incentive to change. If the dog gets out, call animal control.

Studies show that 5 out of 4 people have problems with fractions
JohnC46 (South Carolina)
Posts: 14,265
Posted:
Fine the owner/BOD Member as you would fine anyone.

Some Byalws permit removal/suspension of any director that has not paid their fines, dues, assessments, etc.
SheliaH (Indiana)
Posts: 6,964
Posted:
Thanks everyone for your responses! I will keep in mind the verbiage Tim and others suggested

Carol, I wish we could fine the hell out of the guy (and a few other homeowners who are just as bad), but there is Indiana case law that says homeowner associations aren’t allowed to issue fines because they’re not government agencies. Some HOAs do it anyway and apparently haven’t had any problems, but we’re decided not to because someone is bound to sue over it and the Association would lose. Our local CAI chapter has begun talking with various state legislatures about giving HOAs the right to do this, but as you can imagine, this is a fairly touchy subject.
Unfortunately, the only way to get people to straighten up and fly right in an Indiana HOA is by suing them and asking a court to order them to behave. So, you’d have to consider if a CCR violation is bad enough to warrant going to court and all the expense that comes with it, including appeals. It might be one thing to go after someone who’s created some sort of health hazard, but a dilapidated patio fence???

I wish we did have some sort of low cost or free alternate dispute resolution process that was legally binding and would deal with HOA disputes like this, but in general, Indiana is way behind the times when it comes to HOA laws.
Our CCRs don’t say very much about what will happen if there’s no compliance (yes, they’re badly outdated). The Board proposed some updates in 2006 which required 75% approval of the homeowners – naturally, we didn’t get it because some didn’t care, others balked at the rental cap we proposed and a few homeowners who did sign have since moved away. We also found out the approvals had to be notarized and after consulting with our attorney, we’ve decided we’ll have to start over on the whole process. As some of you have noted in other threads, this will be a long process and won’t be cheap and because of our delinquency rate and other community needs, we’re not in a position to really pursue it now.

The Bylaws had been updated, but the information on removing board members is extremely basic – if he/she becomes delinquent in assessments or misses three consecutive meetings, that’s it for his/her seat on the board. 10% or more of homeowners can submit a petition to request special meetings to deal with association issues, which could include recalling a board member, but except for the homeowners who live close enough to this guy, I don’t know how successful that would be, given the incredible amount of apathy in the community.

I’m hoping an executive session might be enough to persuade the guy to step down and then we can simply say he quit and move on. He’s been told the association can elect to sue him – if we take that step, I guess he can become the poster child for what happens if you don’t comply with the CCRs. Whatever happens next, this probably won’t end well, so in addition to getting through this, I think we need to set a precedent for what will happen in the future.


If it is not right do not do it; if it is not true do not say it. Marcus Aurelius
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SheliaH on 05/09/2013 10:03 AM

there is Indiana case law that says homeowner associations aren’t allowed to issue fines because they’re not government agencies. Some HOAs do it anyway and apparently haven’t had any problems, but we’re decided not to because someone is bound to sue over it and the Association would lose.

VA has similar case law that the Association may not issue fines.

However, Associations may assess financial penalties for non-compliance providing the CC&Rs provide for financial penalties.

I know that it's semantics. However, legalize is based in semantics.

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