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TerryJ1 (Maryland)
Posts: 42
Posted:
Hi Everyone,

For the last few years I have been thinking about the design of an application used to manage the ARC application process. By process I mean - submission, approval/rejection and archive. I have put together a design on paper. Before I begin development I would like to solicit some feedback.

Here are a few bullet points:

1) Simple to use

2) Ability to submit an application via FAX, email, or web form

3) Ability to integrate into the application a hand submitted application (which there will always be many of)

4) Approval configurability: Multiple people must approve, a single person must approve, a single person from a group must approve

5) Archive capabilities: search by address, search by type of change. EG: Show me all the roof change requests on Pine street. EG: Show me all applications submitted for 123 Pine st.

6) A simple mechanism to import a historical set of ARC applications (so that they could be used in the searches)

I have developed many web applications like this. My philosophy is to find the ideal balance between available features and ease of use. Many applications try to include every feature imaginable which makes the application impossible to use. My goal will be simplicity, but with a core set of functionality that will make the application worthwhile to use.

I have not really considered the cost model. Making money is not really my goal. My plan would be to offer the use of the application to a handful of communities for free and see if it is something that could make money down the road.

I would be interested to know what you think about this. Are there any similar applications out there? Has anyone tried to set up this type of application in their community? Are there any key features you could suggest? Any feedback at all would be welcome.

Thanks
TimB4 (Tennessee)
Posts: 21,062
Posted:
It sounds like an interesting program.

The problem I see is what happens when the committee changes hands and the new committee chair isn't as computer savvy as the last chair, or has a mac vs. a pc.

For example, we had one architectural chair who spent two years creating a database system giving many of the functions your looking at. The people who took on the job after her didn't understand how it worked and therefore, didn't use it. 5 years later the database was effectively useless as no data had been updated. Knowing that this issue could happen again in the future, we opted for organized paper files with classification folders. We did make a fillable application in pdf and word which was placed on the website.

TerryJ1 (Maryland)
Posts: 42
Posted:
Hi Tim -

Thanks for the response.

The easy one fist - Mac vs PC will not matter since this will be a browser/platform independent web application. Other than opening the pdf document (everything incoming will be converted to pdf) there is nothing that would happen on the users PC outside of the browser.

To answer the second part - This will not be an application that you buy, install and then maintain on your own, so that only a select few know how to use it. It will be a web application with a slice dedicated to a particular association (not a specific person). You will go to http://www.arcApp.com/your_community_name/ and do everything from there.

Of course there will always be turnover, and new people that come in may not want to use a web based system. However, I believe with the right design in terms of simplicity the benefits of such a system would make its continued use a popular choice.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:

The problem I see is what happens when the committee changes hands and the new committee chair isn't as computer savvy as the last chair


Yep, this always happens. Feel free to set it up if you have nothing better to do, but realize after you leave its likely no one else will use it. The next person might by 85 and go back to a ledger book. LOL.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:

Of course there will always be turnover, and new people that come in may not want to use a web based system. However, I believe with the right design in terms of simplicity the benefits of such a system would make its continued use a popular choice.


Using it is not an issue. The issue is fixing it when it's broken, or adding in a new must have feature that no one will be able figure out. Instead, they will scrap it and go back to paper.
TerryJ1 (Maryland)
Posts: 42
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SteveM9 on 04/02/2013 10:30 AM

Of course there will always be turnover, and new people that come in may not want to use a web based system. However, I believe with the right design in terms of simplicity the benefits of such a system would make its continued use a popular choice.


Using it is not an issue. The issue is fixing it when it's broken, or adding in a new must have feature that no one will be able figure out. Instead, they will scrap it and go back to paper.

The responsibility of fixing it would be with the service provider (me) not with the customer (the HOA) - and there should be very little to fix if done well.

Any new feature added would not break or make an existing implementation more complicated.
SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
An HOA is like a town, it will be around for the next 100+ years. Computer databases will come and go. Paper is still the best.
TerryJ1 (Maryland)
Posts: 42
Posted:
Quote:
Posted By SteveM9 on 04/02/2013 11:06 AM
An HOA is like a town, it will be around for the next 100+ years. Computer databases will come and go. Paper is still the best.

I guess it would be my job to prove otherwise.

I know from first hand experience that paper ARC requests get lost, they get destroyed, they are not easily reproduced (IE backed up), they are not searchable (without access and manual effort), they are a pain to share to a group, and the list goes on.

I know with my HOA there is no way that ARC request can be historically examined with any efficiency or completeness. Owners change, Board members change, management companies change - paper gets lost. I am sure there are more organized HOA's than mine, but I bet there are many that are similar.

SteveM9 (Massachusetts)
Posts: 3,699
Posted:
Quote:

I know from first hand experience that paper ARC requests get lost, they get destroyed, they are not easily reproduced (IE backed up), they are not searchable (without access and manual effort), they are a pain to share to a group, and the list goes on.


Well, there is that old saying...... you can't fix stupid.

We have a folder for every property. If the ARC made an approval or denial of a property, it goes in that property folder. Complaints, important correspondence, etc. If the HOA has never had any requests or issues with a property, there is no folder. We learned this from our local town hall (the professionals who get paid to do stuff like this) You can learn a lot from your local town hall and how they organize things. It's much easier to look in a specific folder for each property vs going through the books of every committee's folder to look for mentions of a certain property.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
We, too, have a paper file folder for each condo unit here.

All ARC change submissions must be submitted electronically to the Committee. Because we're a high rise, and depending on the proposed change, applicants also need to draw the affected area where, for example, wiring or plumbing would be changed. So, copies of that relevant arch. or mechanical drawings also are needed.The app is several pages long with some pages requiring contractors' signatures etc. It's a lot of work for the applicants and not so much for the Committee.

We still have a few owners who aren't very computer savvy so our Mgr. Asst. helps them.

The Committee usually is able to meet online and make decisions online too.
CarolR11 (Colorado)
Posts: 2,563
Posted:
We, too, have a paper file folder for each condo unit here.

All ARC change submissions must be submitted electronically to the Committee. Because we're a high rise, and depending on the proposed change, applicants also need to draw the affected area where, for example, wiring or plumbing would be changed. So, copies of that relevant arch. or mechanical drawing also are needed.The app is several pages long with some pages requiring contractors' signatures etc. It's a lot of work for the applicants and not so much for the Committee.

We still have a few owners who aren't very computer savvy so our Mgr. Asst. helps them.

The Committee usually is able to meet online and make decisions online too.

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